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Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

Noticed some sidewall cracking on my tyres, which have quite a lot of tread wear left in them.

I suppose this is less likely to be an issue in the UK but here in Taiwan average mileages are lower and average temperatures are much higher. Strong sunlight and air pollution are probably contributary factors as well.

From reading, if tyre pressures are maintained the main destructive factors seem to be oxygen (from the pressurised air inside the tyre) and atmospheric ozone. The latter is the main crack propagator.

Since tyres are oxidised internally by the air fill, it seems likely that nitrogen inflation could prolong their life.

I didn't find much on exterior protection (as opposed to cosmetic treatment) on the net though there's quite a bit on tyre softening treatments to (illegally, mostly) make racing tyres stickier.

I found one reference to castor oil as a tyre treatment, and a US Army reference to sunflower oil as a rubber protectant for chemical protection gear.

I've been experimenting with sunflower oil as a tyre protectant on my front tyres for about 8 months, the rationale being that it will form a physical barrier to ozone, and also react sacrificially with it.

No disasters yet, and the tyres look better, 4WIW. The oil does, however, seem to be absorbed by the rubber to some extent. Since I can't really predict the effect of an unstable oil inside the tyre structure, I'm trying canola oil (which is more stable) on the rear tyres, though I'll be surprised if I can tell the difference.

Not a scientifically controlled experiment, of course, but if the deterioration slows, perhaps the treatment is doing some good.

Edited by edlithgow on 09/03/2013 at 12:42

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - thunderbird

More great advice from the poster who ran their engine dry and wants to fix it by taking photo's.

The advice from all sensible sources is that tyres over 6 years old are past their best and should not be used. Tyres that are used infrequently will age faster and show cracking much sooner.

If there is cracking scrap the tyre, they are your only contact with the road and if they fail at speed you have an accident, you ,may die, you may kill others, if you live and your tyres are found to be faulty you will be prosecuted.

Recently I discovered that my 3 year old Michelins with about 12,000 miles on them (had been on the car 2 summers) were all cracking. I was not happy and spoke to Michelin, they said they were garateed for 5 years from manufacture and to take them to ATS who would send them back FOC for inspection, if Ok I would get them back with no charge, if faulty I would get a refund for the remaining tread. Since I was fitting the winter tyres there was no problem having to sort new tyres thus followed Michelins advice. 5 weeks later got a cheque for £197.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

More great advice from the poster who ran their engine dry and wants to fix it by taking photo's.

The advice from all sensible sources is that tyres over 6 years old are past their best and should not be used. Tyres that are used infrequently will age faster and show cracking much sooner.

If there is cracking scrap the tyre, they are your only contact with the road and if they fail at speed you have an accident, you ,may die, you may kill others, if you live and your tyres are found to be faulty you will be prosecuted."

This is not advice, nor do I represent it as such. Its a (tentative) idea which I'm experimenting with.

Re tyre lifespan of six years, (mine are about 8) depends what you consider a "sensible source." Ford and Chrysler both recommend 6 years. They get sued a lot, as you might expect. This gives them a vested interest slightly different from tyre manufacturers, who don't want to get stuck with ageing inventory.

The most specific statements from the tyre industry suggest 10 years, but latterly they've tended to defer to the car manufacturers recommendation, which are often lower. This deference is due largely to damaging US litigation between Bridgestone, who produced some sub-standard tyres, and Ford, who recommended a very low tyre pressure for the Explorer, which tended to roll-over and kill people when they burst.

Does this make Ford a "sensible source"?

This episode, and subsequent investigation, produced most of the publicly available information on tyre failure mechanisms.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=138

The article quotes the two tyre industry associations that have made recommendations.

“The British Rubber Manufacturers Association (BRMA) recommended practice issued June, 2001, states "BRMA members strongly recommend that unused tyres should not be put into service if they are over six years old and that all tyres should be replaced ten years from the date of their manufacture."

The British Tyre Manufacturers Association more recent recommendations, in contrast, say b*****-all, referring the reader to the vehicle owners handbook.

http://www.btmauk.com/data/files/Tyre_service_life_recommendations_31_May_2011.pfd
Mine is in Chinese. I'd bet the price of a new set of tyres that it says b*****-all too, but then its 25 years old.

Perhaps more relevantly for local conditions for me here in Taiwan, they also refer to The Japan Automobile Tire Manufacturers Association (JATMA) who's recommended practice issued May, 2005, is quoted as stating:-

" it is recommended that all tires (including spare tires) that were made more than ten years ago be replaced with new tires." though they also attempt to pass the buck to the owners handbook.

So both these recommendations, including the one from the famously anal Japanese, [EDIT: That should perhaps now be "famously (at least until Fukushima) anal Japanese"] are for 10 years.

These are of course general recommendations and have to cater for some very high performance vehicles and jurisdictions where there are no speed limits. Those conditions do not apply to my sub-litre car, especially when driven here, by me.

Bridgestone-Firestone apparently adopted the Japanese recommendation, with the caveat that there is/was no specific technical basis for it.

http://www.safetyresearch.net/2006/01/01/number-of-tire-age/
“we believe it is appropriate to follow the JATMA recommendation in the interest of further encouraging consumers to focus on the importance of maintaining and properly replacing their tires.”

They also defer to the owners handbook.

http://thesafetyrecord.safetyresearch.net/2010/11/18/tire-age-issue-still-languishing-in-us/

The OTHER judgement-call is "How bad is too bad" re the sidewall cracking, and that's controversial and subjective too. The only actual standards I've seen, are that (a) you shouldn't be able to see the internal belting. (e.g. UK MOT) and that (b) cracks shouldn't be more than 2/32" (USA, sorry. That's about 1.6 mm in the developed world) but I dunno how the crack depth is operationally defined/measured.

Beyond that its subjective, but I've run lots of tyres in the UK with fine surface cracks that I consider cosmetic. This ref matches my predjudices nicely. I've got lots more, but I'll spare you.

http://fleetowner.com/management/exercise_tires_0809

"The weather-checking or “dry-rot,” as it's known, poses no risk to the performance of the casing in its minor stages. In fact, in order for it to result in any damage, it must extend to the steel body cables or be greater than 2/32 of an inch deep. Of course, not all sidewall cracks should be ignored. Large circumferential cracks about an inch above the rim flange and small cracks near the shoulder should be inspected by a tire professional. But just like the theory that all roadside tire debris is the result of faulty retreads, the court of public opinion has already determined that all tires with sidewall cracks should be immediately removed from service."

So I stand condemned in the court of public opinion? Oh dearie me.

Since the UK MOT simply requires that the belting not be visible, (which is rather more liberal than I would choose to be) it seems unlikely that fine sidewall cracks could be a basis for a prosecution in the UK, as you state above. (I'm assuming the UK is your legal reference frame).

In the US one could probably be sued for this, as for just about anything else.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - thunderbird

One of the longest posts on record does not change my point of view. Tyres that are showing sings of cracking are potentially damgerous.

With regards to the UK MOT I had my cracking Michelins looked at by local MOT man before I sent them back, he said they were OK. I them asked the mobile tyre fitter up our street to have a look, he said he would not use them, in fact it was him that suggested I speak to Michelin. Surely Michelin would not have refunded me almost £200 if the tyres had been fine. Based on that I concluded that our local MOT man knows nothing about tyre safety. In fact when my MOT was due 2 weeks ago I went to a different garage, if he is so uneducated about tyres what other defects does he allow through.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - The-Mechanic

Can I ask if your "dangerous" Michelin tyres showed the bracing cords through the cracks on the sidewalls ? Were any of the cracks over 25mm ? were any of them causing a bulge or lump ?

If not then the MOT tester you asked to inspect them was quite correct in saying they were OK as the MOT testers guide (scroll down to section 4.1 tyres - condition)

www.motuk.co.uk/manual_410.htm

clearly states the fail criteria for tyres on a class 4 test, and nowhere does it say if the tyre shows signs of cracking or aging than it is a reason for rejection (failiure).

If I was testing a car (yes, I am an MOT tester and have been for 10 years) I would asses the tyres using the MOT testing guide as it is the ONLY guide you are allowed to use. Obviously, if the cracking was sufficient to be a cause for concern, I would make an advisory note on them, but if they don't fall into the failiure criteria, any MOT tester worth his salt would not and could not fail them.

Sure Michelin refunded you nearly £200, and this seems to be justification to you that the tyres were dangerous, but in fact, they (Michelin) were just honoring their agreed warranty that they offer. Did they state that your tyres were in any way dangerous and should not be used ?

Before you go off the deep end and slate an MOT tester for his incompetence (in your view), please, in future make sure you know what you are talking about. As MOT testers, we are fully educated on tyres amongst other defects whilst carrying out tests as our MOT testers license proves we have met the excacting standards set out by VOSA. What government body license or certificate does your mobile tyre fitter hold I wonder ?

Edited by The-Mechanic on 10/03/2013 at 09:55

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - thunderbird

The whole outer sidewall of all 4 tyres were a mass of cracks. The cracks were especially bad around any raised lettering. The cracks were well over 25mm long and when the tyres were off the rims and more flexible it was easy to see the reinforcement.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - maximus

Sunflower oil on tyres?? I would think that is potentially disastrous. Most kind of rubber will only take certain kinds of 'lubricant' without softening/distorting.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - mss1tw

ACF 50 is supposedly rubber-safe.

I would be just as likely to put it on the tyres as on the brake discs though.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

Maximus wrote: "Sunflower oil on tyres?? I would think that is potentially disastrous. Most kind of rubber will only take certain kinds of 'lubricant' without softening/distorting."

I can't rule out negative effects, but I havn't so far seen any reports of negative effects of sunflower oil on rubber.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/20/automobiles/20TIRE.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Goodyear are reported as using sunflower oil in tyres. Though slightly encouraging, this may not be relevant, since its part of the compound, rather than a surface treatment.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - The-Mechanic

The whole outer sidewall of all 4 tyres were a mass of cracks. The cracks were especially bad around any raised lettering. The cracks were well over 25mm long and when the tyres were off the rims and more flexible it was easy to see the reinforcement.

I'd like to quote from the MOT testers manual :-

a. A tyre has a cut the length of which is in excess of 25 mm or 10% of section width, whichever is greater, deep enough to reach the ply or cords

If you cannnot see any of the bracing cords when the tyres are on the vehicle and inflated, as an MOT tester you can only advise any cracks or cuts. You cannot remove or strip down any part of the vehicle when inspecting it, so only test "as presented".

If the cracks were so bad as to show the cords whilst inflated, then yes, it would be grounds for a failiure, but if not, then it's advisory only. What annoys me is people who like to draw conclusions as to what should be classed as an MOT failiure or is dangerous when they have no training or knowledge on the subject.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - TeeCee

between Bridgestone, who produced some sub-standard tyres, and Ford, who recommended a very low tyre pressure for the Explorer, which tended to roll-over and kill people when they burst.

I don't think you have that quite correct. Ford accused Bridgestone of supplying substandard tyres, but it turned out (and Bridgestone had the documentation to prove it) that Ford had asked them if it was OK to run 'em at lower pressures and Bridgestone had said no.

Ford went ahead anyway to avoid delaying the launch while they reworked the suspension to fix the harsh ride.

IIRC Ford ended up paying a fairly tidy sum to Bridgestone as an out-of-court settlement for the damage to their reputation in the US caused by Ford's lies.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

That might well be true, but I don't think its incompatible with what I said.

My reading on this topic has concentrated on trying to identify tyre ageing/failure mechanisms, and to establish the technical basis (if any) for the recommendations for maximum tyre service life.

There was quite a lot of evidence that Bridgestone produced some sub-standard tyres, (I can dig some of it out if you're interested) but it seems likely that this wouldn't have caused a problem (at least on anything like this scale) without Fords very questionable pressure recommendation. "Faults on both sides" in other words.

Ford subsequently became an advocate of a six-year age-limit for tyres, but, given this background, one might reasonably suspect they had a buck-passing axe to grind.

Edited by edlithgow on 17/03/2013 at 07:45

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - Cyd

The sidewalls of tyres are attacked by UV light from the sun. In the UK it is generally accepted that tyres that have been in use for 10 years should be removed. The internal damage is invisible.

Elsewhere in the world, where UV loading may be higher than the UK, I would imagine one should exercise caution with tyres even at 5 years.

This UV deterioration is one of the reasons it is recommended to rotate tyres (especially on FWD cars) to even out the wear and allow the tyres to see a "fuller" lifetime.

There are proprietry treatments to "nourish" tyre sidewalls. It is important to choose one that provides UV protection and not just a visually appealing finish.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

My reading suggests that, while UV is a factor, the main threats are oxygen and ozone. Intuitively, UV would not be expected to penetrate deep into the structure of the tyre, but oxygen from the pressurised air content does permeate it.

Surface damage from ozone and UV is self-limited by a thin layer of degraded rubber and carbon black, but in a crack, fresh rubber under tension is continually exposed, and "snipped" by ozone attack. This mechanism means cracks can propagate relatively rapidly.

My model is that the sunflower oil fills the cracks so the fresh rubber is not exposed to ozone. Since sunflower oil is a relatively reactive, "semi-drying" oil containing a lot of double bonds, it should also react preferentially with the ozone.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow
I've seen various claims that "leading" showroom tyre valetting products contain silicon oil and organic solvents that attack the rubber, so as you say "pretty" may not be the same as "protected".

I suspect this includes Armour-all, the market leader in the States.
The makers of Aerospace 303 protectant make this claim particularly forcefully, though of course they would, having a vested interest in talking down the competition. IIRC their stuff was recommended as a UV protectant by the seller of my inflatable boat, giving me some confidence it might work.
A sample:-

http://www.autoeducation.com/carcare/tires.htm

http://www.303products.com/techinfo/tires1.htm

and a recipe:-

http://www.scprod.com/formularies/Tire%20Protectant.pdf

You takes yer choice, and you pays yer money.

Or you dont. I'll stick with my "home remedy" for now. It's hard to find things here, but if/when I get new tyres I might try and score some of that Aerospace 303
Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - Andrew-T

The sidewalls of tyres are attacked by UV light from the sun. In the UK it is generally accepted that tyres that have been in use for 10 years should be removed. The internal damage is invisible.

I think the sun/UV effect is the most significant, plus the need to run at the correct pressure to limit tyrewall flexing. A recommended lifespan for a tyre is unrealistic because its use and exposure to UV can vary so widely. And since cracking is accelerated by UV I am fairly sure that the interior will be in better condition, especially as it will be under compression rather than tension.

I have 1990 Michelins on my 1990 Peugeot which I keep in a garage and drive every couple of weeks. The sidewalls show virtually no cracking, and when the annual MoT tester advises me to change them for that reason I shall do so.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - madf

In 1968 I bought a 1929 Riley 9 saloon which had been stored in a garage by its owner from new.

The front tyres weretdated c 1937 (I believe the design changed around then and they were the earlier design) so were 29 years old. The sidewalls had no cracks but the tread was nearly worn out - the MOT tyre test had only been introduced that year - so I replaced both...

We had a caravan in the 1980s parked outside and the tyres lasted 5 years before cracking.

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - Andrew-T

The front tyres were dated c 1937 (I believe the design changed around then and they were the earlier design) so were 29 years old. The sidewalls had no cracks but the tread was nearly worn out ...

But of course a 1937 tyre has very little in common with one from 50 years later - crossply fabric reinforcement, natural rubber instead of synthetic ....

Edited by Andrew-T on 15/03/2013 at 13:50

Bridgestone - Tyre anti-ageing treatment? - edlithgow

I've also seen it stated that lack of use itself is a reason for deterioration, because the protective waxes incorporated into the tyre compound migrate to the surface as the tyre flexes in use. On a static tyre they degrade and aren't replaced.

That might partially explain the rapid deterioration of the caravan tyres, (along with greater exposure to UV and ozone, I'm not denying thier importance.)