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Breakdown that was hardest to fix - ifithelps
Mention of the Bedford CF van in another hread reminded me of one of the most obscure and difficult to fix breakdowns I ever came across.

The garage I worked for was called out to a CF and I got the job.

The instructions were to check if it was anything obvious, if not, drag it back to the garage.

On arrival, you always checked for fuel and sparks first, which I did.

Both present, and the van would run, but not well.

I managed to get it running better by retarding the ignition, but it was still not right.

Towed it back to the garage, and the job was solved after a lot of head scratching by people far more expert than me.

Turned out the timing belt had jumped one tooth.

The valves were opening a fraction of a second too early or too late, but it would still run - just.

Anyone else come across a far from obvious cause of a breakdown?
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - bell boy
Bedford cf 2.3 recovery
got caught in a rain storm of humungus proportions and i broke down outside a fire station,
cranked and cranked and cranked the thing and it finally fires,unfortunately all the unburnt fuel in the exhaust also lit and there was the loudest bang you couldd imagine.
All the firemen came running out of the building

Still make oi larf
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - menu du jour
My Dad owned a 1966 Hillman Minx with the 1725cc engine.
On this occasion, it would drive well for about 2 miles, then stop dead. It would restart after a while then do the same thing.
Turned out to be dirty connections on the coil. Easy to fix but puzzling at the time.
Took a few days to sort.
mdj
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - DP
I had a series of random breakdowns in my old 1600 (Pinto) Sierra caused by a coil. It would run fine for weeks, then suddenly the engine would quit with no warning - not so much as a misfire, just "thud" dead. By the time I'd opened the bonnet and started diagnostic proceedings, it would fix itself. This meant all the roadside checks would show no fault, I'd try the key one last time out of desperation and it would just fire up.
There was no pattern to it whatsoever. The resistance of both windings of the coil was within spec, and as the car ran perfectly most of the time, it made the fault impossible to find.
Eventually it died completely of course, and the fault was quickly traced to the primary winding of the coil having gone completely open circuit, but this took many months. It must have been a hairline break which had been there for many months, and which was still passing current most of the time.
Fitted a spare coil from another car I'd broken months before, and it ran perfectly from that moment forward.
Also shows that baffling, confusing faults existed long before modern fuel injection and ECU setups.

Cheers
DP

Edited by DP on 23/05/2009 at 12:20

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - 659FBE
Years ago I had a SAAB 95 (a proper one) fitted with the Ford Cologne V4 engine. Normally trouble free within the limitations of a Solex auto-choke carburettor, one day it refused to start. Perseverence got it started, whereupon it would run normally.

Eventually it got to the stage where starting was extremely difficult and all of the usual checks were made - to no avail. The spark at the plugs was present but not as strong as I would have expected from a Bosch ignition system.

After a great deal of head scratching, I discovered that the steel coil spring under the graphite brush in the centre of the distributer cap had rusted through - hence the poor spark. I replaced it with a Lucas spring which was plated.

Sparking produces ozone which is highly reactive. An unplated spring in this position is prone to rust. A Bosch cock-up with a mercifully cheap fix, but lots of fruitless investigation was required to find it.

659.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - brum
1975 - bought a Honda CB250 from auction - terrible bike really. Used to lose all power when travelling any distance (>3 miles) and caused great stress when going to/from yorkshire down south which I had to do regularly. The A1 is not a place to be on a dodgy motorbike.

Tried everything - Honda dealers - "nothing wrong sir" - after charging more for for a service than Jaguar charged at that time. I tried stripping the carburettors and engine (finding distintigrating shims - ugh what a nasty design), but still no joy. It cost me more to run than buying a car. Eventually brother took it off my hands for a tenner.

Several years later, I asked him if he ever sorted the problem. Yes, he said, he found a bit of rag in the fuel tank. Every now and then it would float and flop over the petrol exit point.

Doh!!!!

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - Rattle
Dads Escort MK7 1995 N 1.6 Zetec. Lovely car in many ways with silky smooth engine with a near silent tick over. However towards the end and what turned out to be a dodgy MOT (we sacked that garage) the car was getting 15mpg previously to the MOT and the garage told us they fixed it by doing something (they were very very cagey).

We took it to another garage who replaced the coil pack and HT leads - still no better
Took it to a third garage said said you need a new ECU init - erm didn't buy that one.
Forth garage replaced the plugs and coil pack saying it had the wrong coil pack fitted - car ran smoother but still 15mpg. Same garage then fitted a new temperature sensor and lamdba sensor - still no better

Finally my uncle looked at it and discovered some of the valves were siezed. I am amazed to this day that all the garages were too busty with their sensors and ignition to check one of the most basic mechanical things.

By this time the car had been in storage for a year and was rotten anyway so we sold it for £150 as a big MOT failure.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - perro
I'm going back about 30 years now ... Vauxhall it was - 6 cylinder, probably a Ventura ... It would start but run like a pig (a real swine) I did everything to it - tappets (whatever they are!) stripped the carb down again and again and again etc., etc., etc., turns out that the inlet manifold sits on the exhaust manifold (HOT) and the inlet manifold becomes porous - quite a common fault with 6 pot VX's I came to learn ... sooooooooo many new carbs were fitted by mechanics (including moi) trying to rectify this prob!
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - NARU
My mini broke down whenever it rained. Eventually tracked down to the two spring clips which kept the distributor cap attached - they'd become weak.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - sierraman
>>>that all the garages were too busty with their sensors <<<

That's the trouble with these female mechanics. :)


Breakdown that was hardest to fix - Clanger
Not strictly a breakdown but very perplexing.

GF's newly-purchased Triumph 1300 was starting badly and ace mechanic here determined it needed a service. Changed the oil and filters, plugs and points and suddenly it was a non-starter. No spark at the coil. Tickled the coil positive with a length of wire from the battery and got a healthy zap. Points then? New in a Unipart bubble-pack. Cleaned the old points and put them back. Instant starting.

Dead short across the new points; the insulating fibre collar that you were supposed to oil sparingly had been made with a built-in shard of metal.

PS. HCX 131L, where are you? Mrs H wants you back with your wood dash and leather seats.


Now a proper breakdown.

GF had been Mrs H for a year or two and she was pregnant with our first. We were returning from a social late one night. I was at the controls, sober, and giving the Fiat Strada a caning. We went over a rise and the engine coughed and the lights flickered. It kept happening so I pulled over and the engine stopped on its own. Lights, yes but not a peep from the starter. I called the recovery service.

It turned out to be a snapped engine-to-body earth lead. Fiat had made a batch of them too short. Annoyingly, I had jump leads with me so I could have bodged something up to keep us going.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - MadPete
My 1984 Jaguar XJ12 decided a few years ago to splutter to a halt on a cold night. It wouldn't restart, though it seemed to be trying to. After getting it towed back home. I checked all the wiring and wiggled all the bits, and it started the next day. I checked all the relevant connections, and couldn't find anything wrong. Over the next few months it repeated the experience several times and I was fast running out of things to fix. The last time, it died just outside my house, so it was pushed into the garage. I decided to bring home all the good test gear the next day. The next day, without any action by me, it started. At this point I pulled the ECU and opened it for a good look. No dry joints, all looked good. I decided to replace the four electrolytic capacitors on spec, as I had fixed a few Japanese ECUs that the capacitors had died in. It has never failed since then, and I have repaired a number of these Lucas ECUs for other Jaguar owners, and some Land Rover ones too, by the same method. It costs almost nothing, and I wonder how many thousands of pounds work have been caused by these old capacitors. Over time, the liquid in them dries up, and this allows the internal voltages to be unstable. In contrast , the fault in the Japanese ECUs was mostly that the fluid had leaked out and dissolved parts of the circuit board.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - Graham567
I had a Fiat Uno FIRE on a 'A' reg plate.It would start perfectly and run, but once the engine had warmed up it stalled and would not start again until it had cooled down.It turned out to be the fuel pump was heat sensitive.I traded it in as it was but the garage was 5 miles away.I had the heating system on hot and the air blowers on full(in the middle of summer).It stalled just as i pulled into the garage.I quickly locked it up and went in to the garage and did the deal and drove off in the new car.
I saw the salesman a few days later and he commented on how the car wouldn't start.I just smiled,knowing that i knew and was glad it was his problem now.Its nice to get one over on a car salesman.(They do it to you the other 99% of the time)
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - henry k
1600E came to a halt with dead engine.
Eventually found the copper carb float had sunk. As a temp fix I used a needle drill to enable me to empty the petrol out and then I soldered it up so I could drive to the spares dept for a replacement.
I kept the float and experimented heating and cooling it but the petrol stayed it it for many years. Most odd.

!600E clutch "failed". It allowed drive but the release although it appeared to be OK was not disconnecting the drive. On advice from a M4 service centre "expert" we managed a carpark clutch fluid change to no effect.
We had to complete our trip to a family funeral and then home - 150 miles, fortunately mostly M4. It was a failed spigot bearing grabbing the gearbox shaft.
We had to undo the clutch bolts before the bell housing would split.

1600E loosing power. Stopped, switch off, waited and OK for a while.
I had paid for petrol and got some water in the tank. The rust from the tank eventually blocked the fuel line and even got past the filter into the carb.

Mondeo almost totally dead electrics when attempting to start it whilst on the drive.
No dash lights, no external lights but internal light working so battery seemed OK.
Happened very rarely and corrected itself.
At the time it was difficult to gather enough details as it always happened of course when a trip was wanted "now".
Studied Haynes and eventually found a big fuse had blown and the fuse link had fallen down and it was left touching the leg of the support. On first inspection it seemed OK but only a close look provided the answer.
I often wonder if the previous owner got rid of it as "unreliable"

I do not know which was the hardest to fix. The Mondeo was the most difficult to track because it was so infrequent and intermittent.

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - 1400ted

As a contrast, a stunningley easy one to diagnose and fix at no cost.

Got turned out one nice day in the 80s by Britannia Rescue to a house call locally.
Took details down, Ford Escort Mk2, Red, Manual, Petrol....fault? ' Tries to jump sideways when I try to start it '.

Jumped in, saw it was l in gear with the handbrake hard on....into neutral, started fine.

Car could only react to the starter motor by trying to turn the opposite way....try it !
One embarrassed lady owner ! Mind you, if she hadn't put the brake on she would have ended up in her hall !


Ted
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - bell boy
a leg out of bed on the m62
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - henry k
a leg out of bed on the m62

>>
LOL a long time since I last heard that expression.

Reminds me of the same 1600E one dark Fri evening 100 miles from home and unbeknown at that time a main bearing cap snapped.
IIRC A piston did not follow its proper path causing rings to go and a hole in the crown
Discovered an engine bay dripping in oil.
Only competition main caps available ( Caps come with the block Sir!)
Plus line bore, rebore etc.etc. so a Ford exchange engine was the only option at 25K miles.
Car was recoved by a flat bed truck and we travelled home sitting in the 1600E which was strapped onto of the flat bed.
How things have changed ! Can you imagine the elf n safety bods view of that?
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - bell boy
whenever i used to pull a car on the back i could never get in to these peoples minds that hawsers broke
then one day one did
thankfully no one was hurt
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - Ravenger
My old citroen xsara HDi went 'dead' while undergoing a routine service. The car wouldn't start, and it couldn't be moved off the garage ramp for a couple of days, which caused a lot of problems for the garage.

Turned out after much head-scratching by the mechanics that an electrical connector on the fuel pump had been dislodged slightly, and wasn't making a proper connection.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - pmh2
1968 - A friend rang up having just completed a a journey from Nottingham to London. The car ( a side valve engined 1172cc Ford 100E) is making a funny noise.
He brought it round and a quick listened pointed me in the direction of something knocking, bordering on terminal, from the top end of the block. He then admitted that he had driven over 100miles in that state.

Took the head off (about 20minutes in those days) and could not believe what we could see. 3 Pistons at the the top of their travel! Turning it over by hand revealed that one piston did not appear to move as the others behaved normally.

One piston had fully fractured around the gudgeon pin, and the knocking was the bottom half of the piston slapping around in the bore and hitting the remaining section at the top of its stroke.


Sump off and con rod out, new single piston fitted and car back on the road by the end of the day. It certainly lasted for quite some time , but could never be described as 'quiet and smooth running' thereafter.


p
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - pmh2
I have posted this before, but it fits well into this thread, and have good laugh at my expense!


1996 Fiesta Zetec 1.25cc 16v in 2004

The battery finally succumbed after another 2 months of non use.
Jump started ok but battery would not hold charge (8 years old so not complaining). Alarm became very confused to the irritation of neigbours and did not want to reset properly until I discovered that manually opening and closing the passenger door would reset it permanently! Trick worth remembering.

No problem , new battery, and now fires, starts and and ticks over at first touch. HOWEVER for the first 2 -3 minutes engine refuses to 'pickup' when any load is applied or acellarator is opened anything other than very slowly. It then runs and drives perfectly. Ambient temperature is not a problem 22 deg C down here today!

I first thought that ECU was retraining itself (after flat battery) but have now done about 50 miles and fault still reoccurs. Petrol is now all fresh. It is worse if car has not been used for more than about 60 minutes.

It does need servicing and plugs are 35k old (previously they were good for 50k) and has never exhibited any sign of misfire or similar problem in the 85k since new.

The problem persisted despite new plugs (just about due any way at 35k), search for sensor connector problems and vacuum leaks. And then problem started to manifest itself as intermittent loss of power at about 3500 rpm in 5th causing loss of about 10mph, which could be cleared by dropping a gear temporarily and then changing back. No problems in round town driving after the 4 -5 minute warm up period.

ECU diagnostics showed no error codes. But the mpg had apparently dropped from a normal 44 mpg.

Open Air filter box and find that some animal had made a nest incorporating large non degradeable eucalyptus leaves and bits of air filter in bottom of box and air inlet piping. No sign of animal tho' but probably frightened off by mechanical activity. Presumably the intermittent nature was due to animal adjusting its position for added or less warmth as car warmed up. New filter and all cleaned out and ran almost perfectly. A small hesitancy continued to exist, but this was solved with a replacement MAF.

I should have included in the original post that car had been unused for about 6 weeks before the problem occurred, and somebody would probably suggested it. The flat battery (and ECU power down) and battery replacement was just a red herring!



p

Edited by pmh2 on 24/05/2009 at 10:22

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - oilrag
Trouble

1) Hole in piston - Honda C90 - in 1966, near Bridlington (only time stranded to date!)

All the following are roadside fixes

2)Zenner diode - lead vibrated off - fixed - Triumph Twin (of course) (1967)
3) Bond mini car - chain leaping worn sprockets (fixed 200 times) or was it 500?
4)Bond 875 - throttle cable snapped - fixed
5)Old Mans Victor 101 - distributor lead - soldered at roadside. Fixed
6) Mini - electrics gone - cleaned an earth - fixed
7) Bedford CF - throttle cable - extended with string. fixed.
7) Fiesta 1982 - clutch assembly collapse- drove without clutch. then fixed
8)Maestro 1994 - clutch cable - fitted spare. (thus vindicating years of carrying a spare)

Wow! I hadn`t realised it but nothing since - although I carry a spare clutch slave cylinder, wiper linkage, spare (old) alternator belt and Genden code reader. But no tools - just an AA card.
And a full size spare ;-)

Nearest miss? Maestro Clubman D spewing diesel over the engine bay (leaking lift pump diaphragm) and exhaust in a cloud of stinking fumes - Sheffield to Leeds in 1995. VERY near miss that.
Fitted a new pump and also carried a spare from then on - never needed.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - AshT
Had a SIII Landie with the 2.25 petrol quite a few years ago that although never breaking down completely threw up a problem on just about every long run I used it for - after 50 - 70 miles at motorway speeds the engine would lose power and start misfiring intermittently, no overheating or oil loss, or obvious electrical fault. Slowing down to 50 for a few miles or stopping for 10 minutes invariably cleared the problem, so I never had it looked at properly. I did all the usual replacements and checks - it had a new Weber carb, all the engine electrics replaced, fuel filter changed, air filter cleaned, and the oil was changed regularly.
Still a mystery - the Landie was still doing it when I sold it (buyer was a friend who knew about the problem).
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - steveo3002
^^ sounds like carb icing
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - ifithelps
Another tricky one we had was a Volvo 164E with the then new-fangled fuel injection.

The car would either run correctly or stop due to lack of fuel.

Quite a few people in the garage were keen to blame the injectors or injector pump.

Turned out to be a relay bolted to a slowly rusting inner wing.

The relay depended on its mounting for its earth and the fuel injection system depended on the relay.

Problem solved by resiting said relay onto a bit of the wing that was not rusting.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - NARU
^^ sounds like carb icing

I agree. Quite common in the days when you could point the air intake to the front of the car (summer) or down to the exhaust (to get warm air in winter).

I remember a 2-year old Orion which had exactly the same symptoms. Main dealer maintained that it couldn't be icing as the car didn't have one of those adjustable air intakes. After a little detective work I realised that the car chose where the air came from via a little servo. The servo had failed.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - perro
>>> Another tricky one we had was a Volvo 164E with the then new-fangled fuel injection. <<<

Wonderful car - bet it was an auto!
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - bell boy
to Ash t


i reckon it had a foreign body in the fuel tank being sucked up over the fuel pickup pipe under certain conditions
had this on a mk 3 fiesta a few years ago,took days to fathom out (it was a plastic sheet small but big enough to cause mayhem)

Edited by bell boy on 25/05/2009 at 11:33

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - AshT
^^ sounds like carb icing


>>i reckon it had a foreign body in the fuel tank

Could be either I suppose - the guy I sold it to only used it for running around locally and the problem never recurred as far as I know. Could carb icing happen in Summer though? It was a year round problem.

I've always wondered what the cause was, and regretted selling the Landie..

Breakdown that was hardest to fix - Mchenry
Fiat Tipo turbo diesel.
It would start and idle perfectly but was almost undriveable because it had NO power and wouldn't go beyond 1500 rpm. The intercooler was behind the bumper below the left hand headlight, so there were 2 long bits of rubberised trunking going to and from it. One of them had split on the inside of a bend where it was almost impossible to see. The problem was that I got the idea of fuel starvation into my head...
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - datostar
Renault Megane 2.0 RXE just driven off cross-channel ferry. Engine apparently seizes solid driving down the ramp in Dover Docks towards the Customs Shed. Won't turn over on starter. Freewheels with clutch depressed. Call out RAC - 'Oh, it's the cambelt gone, probably wrecked the engine'. Tows me out then calls Recovery Service to get me home- 90 miles. Recovery driver of same opinion. Call out local garage next day - fiddle around a bit - 'Oh yes, cambelt and damaged engine'. Tow it away to have a look at it. Phone call following day - aircon compressor seized due to faulty clutch. Cambelt and engine fine, the auxiliary belt had taken the full strain and held. Cost me a new compressor, set of belts etc. but better than a rebuilt engine! Fortunately happened at low speed in the docks. Might have been another story 10 minutes later on the M20.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - gordonbennet
It wasn't a hard fix, but.

A truck i drove until about 5 years ago had an intermittent fault with the starter, probably a dead spot which if you persisted would eventually croak itself into running.
Despite repeated defect notices from me, the commercial garage we then used was staffed by the most idle no hoper's imaginable (i could write an essay about them, and they are no longer in existance thankully).

Anyway one moning i'd filled up with fuel at Stafford services and the starter did it's usual only this time the dead spot was permanent...so called our breakdown call centre, yes as much use as most of them, i stressed times to the chap that the starter was at fault and i wanted either a tow start and/or a new starter motor (remember loaded car transporter you can't tilt the cab).

Now 3 guesses what turned up...right first time, a nice feller in a small van complete with jump pack..arrrgh!
I wasn't surprised but it's very frustrating and not the breakdown blokes fault, those chaps never get the full story from the call centre (who make sure never to pass on the message requesting the mechanic attending to speak to driver first)
So he had to go back an hour each way and get a wrecker to tow start me...
Wish i'd thought of that in the first place..;)
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - ifithelps
Tow start a loaded car transporter?

Was that on the end of a chain?

Presumably you both had to know what you were doing.
Breakdown that was hardest to fix - gordonbennet
Presumably you both had to know what you were doing.


Well the breakdown fella knew what he was doing..;)

The air held up just long enough, but proper truck breakdown motors have a long airline to plug into the broken trucks air system, so it wouldn't have mattered i'd still have had full brakes, and a very loud hooter to let him know when to stop, but i'm certain he used a bar anyway.
It only needed a couple of yards pull to get it to bump start anyway.

Hmm...another thought, that's something else we won't be doing any more now most trucks have automated manual boxes of one sort or another, apparently its called progress.

I recall another one with a dodgy starter...articulated car transporter this time, starter had died...i kept it running all day (bump started meself on a hill) and took the vehicle loaded into the main dealer for the make that evening at home.

Had a chat with the young man who was going to do the job, i asked him if he'd like me to 'jack knife' the truck so he could get the cab up...''no just turn it off, i'll get it going with jump leads''...i suggested he wouldn't as it was the starter.

''Just turn it off and leave it''...so i did as i was told , he connected the jump pack to show me i was wrong and it was really the batteries.
The truck wouldn't start strangely enough as apparently the starter had died...result the lad had to squeeze under the unable to be tilted cab through the wheelarch and do it the hard way.
Some knowing smiles from older mechanics there who i knew from the past.
You just can't help some people..;)

Edited by gordonbennet on 25/05/2009 at 15:24