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It is (supposed to be) the pinacle of Motor Sport. If there's no point in F1, then arguably there's no point in any form of Motor Sport.
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Pays for the roof over my head, and earns me a nice income.Also provides thousands of jobs in the motorsport industry and entertainment for hundreds of millions. Anyone who thinks its boring has never worked in it or seen a race live. Every non F1 fan I have taken to a race, guided them around the pits and has watched the race has been totally blown away by the experience.
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I have taken to a race guided them around the pits...
That's not the typical experience you'd get if you just turned up, though.
I'm sure it's fun to be involved and I appreciate the job creation side of it, but I'm bemused by the specatator / fan angle.
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>>....Every non F1 fan I have taken to a race, guided them around the pits
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This aspect was raised in the prog.
The pits are out of bounds except for obscure "celebs" or money unlike the Festival of Speed where it is a condition of the the event that fans are allowed in the pits.
I know the scale of things are different and IMO a much higher % of real fans go to Goodwood.
FI is about money, money, money and there is NO concern where events are run so long as $$$$ rule the day.
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I know many people who have been and find it boring, T11. And watching the full race on TV is mind-numbingly dull... who wants to watch racing where one (or sometimes two) teams are so far ahead of the rest that the result is a foregone conclussion baring accidents or mechanical breakdown? But that is what we've had for many years in F1 now...
I agree that going round the pits of any motorsport is fascinating (not just F1) but in most forms of motorsport we are allowed in there, but in F1 we are not, so that rather detracts from the experience for the ordinary punter as opposed to the privaliged few, does it not?!
As far as some developments are concerned then it might be the pinacle of motorsport, but many other forms of motorsport also develop things... high performance diesels in the LeMans series for instance... I tend to think that F1 is so regulated now that its claim to be the top of the pile is perhaps a little exagerated... what gets me is that even with all that regulation they still can't get competative racing... they even have to bring in regulations to "encourage" overtaking... its lost its way if you ask me!
Edited by b308 on 19/05/2009 at 12:02
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Yes, I was fortunate enough to be on the start line literally minutes before the start of the Belgian GPs in 1986 & 1987 (IIRC), and then in the pits for the races. Tremendous atmosphere. Haven't been to F1 for years though - the cost is just way too much and you get to see far more (if not the atmosphere) on the TV.
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According to the programme 850 million watch it worldwide so it must appeal to many - not me though :-)
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The point is a nine digit annual profit. It's a business, just like any other.
I'm sure the sport is amazing if you're an insider or get access to areas that the masses don't. I also agree the cars with their shrieking, screaming engines and physics defying corner speeds are awe inspiring. However I still don't see why anyone would pay three figures to stand behind fences 30m from the track and watch what is pretty much a procession, and to see race order changing pretty much only through pit stops and attrition (of the same old drivers and cars every time). I say that as someone who has done so before.
That's the problem with F1 - it has completely lost touch with its fanbase. I laugh at claims it's the pinnacle of motorsport. From a technical viewpoint maybe, but not as a spectacle, or even as a "sport". For a VIP or team member with "access all area" privileges, it's a totally different experience to the peasants who make up the numbers.
I agree with b308 - having to impose artificial restrictions and legislation to get basic racing going shows just how badly wrong it has gone.
Dead sport, in my personal opinion. British success aside, I couldn't care less about it.
Edited by DP on 19/05/2009 at 12:42
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Isn't it a bit like football - what's the point of the Premiership? They're both part of the entertainment industry. You get people who do it at lower levels for the fun of it, but at the top it's done for money.
Not everybody likes football and not everybody likes F1, but the reason they are both big business is that (presumably) millions of people like it enough to be prepared to pay (in some form or other) to watch it.
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I don't like football either :-(
PS
Not moved into the F1 Thread for the benefit if the people who aren't likely to look in there but may appreciate the contents of the thread.
Off to iron my ManU shirt - over a wok of course to get that authentic bulge (that seems to be de rigueur when wearing one.)
Edited by Pugugly on 19/05/2009 at 12:45
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F1 is curious in that it seems to be a sport that people who don't like it, or find it boring, watch it anyway, then complain about how boring it is. Why not just not watch it?? I don't like rugby, so I don't watch it. Simple!
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I gave up on Formula 1 some years ago.
The highpoint for me was in 1997 visiting a customer in Maranello whose factory was next to the Ferrari test track. It was just before the start of the F1 season and on that particular day Schumacher was testing the latest Ferrari. From my customer's office there was an excellent view of the track and the sound and speed of the red F1 car up close was amazing. Watching a real race on telly seemed a bit tame after that. I haven't watched a race even on telly for about 4 years now, I just found other things to do on Sunday afternoons.
I would love to go to a race and visit the pits but sadly not rich or well connected enough for that!
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It also provides a steady drone and whine that facilitates a nap after lunch on Sundays. Scientific study to determine whether `drone` or `whine` is originating from cars or commentators has so far failed due to...zzzzzzzzzzz
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I think it was Arthur Smith who likened it to watching two identical washing machines, both set to the same wash cycle and wondering which will finish first.
Can't better that really and I'd rather eat my own arm than go to Grand Prix, but if it floats your boat......
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Isn't there a simple answer to this... its a sport
I like F1 and motorsport and always have done. I like Rugby too but think tennis, snooker and horse racing is boring and pointless.
F1 is about building a car with the best performance and seating a driver capable of driving it and entertaining people like me. It is the ultimate race, the step from formula 2 to formula 1 is massive, non fans might not appreciate how hard it is to drive an F1 car, think about driving on the edge and then multiply it by 10.
Its a sport for competition just like any other sport, then it is also big business. As the sport tries to evolve it gets things wrong just like everyone does. Personally i would love to see the return of equal fuel loads and for fuel to be loaded for the race and no strategic stopping. I also would like to see a realistic budget cap put in place... like with any business, money makes it unfair but can also provoke outrage.
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Want to see real racers?
tiny.cc/lJDbD
Forget F1 as it has been commercialised beyond recovery.
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I must say I liked it better in the fifties when the cars were more like cars - driveable on the road and sometimes driven on the road by intrepid testers with good relations with the local plod - and the drivers more like people and less like miniature cyborg action men. Even in the sixties you could go to a meeting where people like Jim Clark, Graham Hill and Dan Gurney would perform in their F1 steeds, and later (or earlier) compete in saloon cars. You got a full programme and an unobstructed view, and it didn't cost 300 quid to get in or take four hours to get out. Great invention, television...
F1 has evolved, as things do, quite possibly into a blind alley. The explosive growth of budgets, costs, wages, team sizes and so on is part of that evolution. So, unfortunately, is the pursuit of downforce which has turned F1 cars into inverted aircraft that can't be driven slowly and are fitted with rigid, very short-travel suspension.
But it used to be the pinnacle of motor sport, and as a motor sport enthusiast one can hardly just turn off one's historical and emotional interest in it. That would be a little inhuman on one's own part.
Edited by Lud on 19/05/2009 at 15:55
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F1 has evolved as things do quite possibly into a blind alley. The explosive growth of budgets costs wages team sizes and so on is part of that evolution. So unfortunately is the pursuit of downforce which has turned F1 cars into inverted aircraft that can't be driven slowly and are fitted with rigid very short-travel suspension. But it used to be the pinnacle of motor sport and as a motor sport enthusiast one can hardly just turn off one's historical and emotional interest in it. That would be a little inhuman on one's own part.
Isn't this most peoples view. Not many people like change, it means adaptation is required.
Its very common to see people saying "oh it isn't as good as it used to be". Ask a lot of new fans just getting into a sport and they think its the best thing since sliced bread. Give it 20 years and they will be saying the same things as you.
I'm not generalizing you or making reference to age or specific time periods but this is generally how it goes.
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Mmm, I can understand the "progress" argument as a plus point... but when it pushes the "sport" to what it is now I really think that they've lost the plot... its supposed to be about man and machine in harmony against the rest... but it seems that the "machine" part is now responsible for about 95% of the result these days (something quoted somehwre recently from one of the tech guys at one of the teams, sorry I have no link)... thats surely wrong...
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Every non F1fan I have taken to a race guided them around the pits and has watched the race has been totally blown away by the experience.
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Perhaps this is true, but the fact is it now costs so much for a modest ticket to an F1 race let-alone the full monty of a corporate day with 'access all areas' , I think they ar5e slowly killing the golden goose that allowed a priviledged few to indulge themselves.
Anyway it is shown all the time in F1 that he who has most money to spend wins almost every time. I dont think it has the skill level of other motorsports such as saloon-car or rallying.
Edited by Roly93 on 19/05/2009 at 16:39
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High ticket prices are mainly due to bernie. The circuits have to pay vast amounts to host a race.The British GP has always been one of the most expensive tickets of any race. The paddock club earn a fortune from corporrate guests (thousands per person per day). As for skill level- if your trying to tell me that Senna,Prost,Piquet,Mansell,Schumacher,Hakkinen,Alonso,Hamilton,Button etc. have/had a lower skill level than saloon car or most rally drivers then your greatly mistaken( I have also worked in WRC for prodrive)
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I dont think it has the skill level of other motorsports such as saloon-car or rallying.
I watched some live British Touring Cars (and others) on ITV4 at the weekend, and as someone who isn't that into motorsport, it just wasn't as entertaining as watching the spectacle of F1. (Not that I'm a big fan of F1 - will watch it if nothing better to do, which quite often there isn't on a Sunday afternoon.)
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For people who really like cars, I would strongly recommend VSCC Shelsley Walsh, at the world's oldest motor sport venue. Fabulous machines, mostly specials, ancient and modern, visible close up with a paddock ticket and driven in anger too, albeit only one at a time. You can't have everything.
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The radio programme which posed the original question is being repeated tonight - Tuesday on BBC Radio 4 at 9.30pm, I found it interesting.
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And on iPlayer of course.
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