Just had a call from a hysterical SWMBO who has just put 6 litres of Unleaded in the Scenic. Thankfully she realised and stopped at 6 litres, and of course hasn't started the engine. RAC are on their way to recover to a local garage.
I presume it's going to be a case of dropping the tank, flushing, refitting and refilling with diesel. I hope nothing else!
What's this likely to set me back?
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Ha ha. £200 + VAT "standard charge". It's being recovered home and I'm doing it myself this weekend. Daylight robbery.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Just a thought. Does the fuel pump on these prime when the doors are unlocked?
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Just a thought. Does the fuel pump on these prime when the doors are unlocked?
After further thought, this is my concern. All the dash lighting goes live when you unlock the car and there is no ignition switch as such, just a START/STOP button (which hasn't been touched)
That said, it wouldn't have been unlocked as it wasn't ever locked.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Just checked the thread again before I posted, was just about to say that the AA charge a fixed fee in the region of £200 + VAT..
Backstreet garages with their own recovery will usually do it cheaper. I was told by one recovery bloke that where possible they disconnect the fuel line and pump the fuel out with the cars' own pump, to save time and effort..
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where possible they disconnect the fuel line and pump the fuel out with the cars' own pump to save time and effort..
Fine if the pump doesn't rely on the diesel fuel for lubrication!
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Stupidly enough I did the same once! The recovery truck guy came and when he found out what I had done, he told me he'll charge me £30 and would do it there and then and he did it for me! He removed my fuel pump and used one of his own and emptied the whole tank for me (30 litre petrol).
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DP
As long as nobody has turned on the ignition; then it's just a de-fuel and refill.
I normally add a splash of very cheap engine oil to treat any dregs, then cycle the ignition a few times to get the new fuel right through and start it.
It it's the type without a low-pressure pump, then hand-prime it and bleed some off from the filter outflow.
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Pardon my ignorance, but would six litres actually matter if the tank was brimed with diesel? Assuming a capacity of tank 55 litres are fuel systems fuel systems really that sensitive?
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It's a 60 litre tank, and if it was the Mondeo, that's exactly what I would have done, but I just won't take the chance with a common rail system.
I'll dump the fuel out this weekend, a shot of cheap engine oil as per Screwloose's recommendation, and then prime it through and bleed the stuff in the lines off into a container. Is it worth changing the filter as a precaution, or adding anything (Millers) into the fuel at the same time.
I'm guessing any dregs or residue in the tank aren't going to matter.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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I am sure there are plenty reading this thread saying that it is a total over reaction and 54 litres of diesel with 6 litres of petrol will not cause any problems. If I hadn't read the various horror stories on here that would be my thinking. Why don't we have a direct phone link to Aprilia at times like this ? :)
But more importantly, what is SWMBO going to do to make up for this, there goes your weekend and the hassles you have encountered today!
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2007 Seat Altea XL 2.0 TDI (140) Stylance
2005 Skoda Fabia vrS
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Done it myself and was charded on the order of £200 + VAT
5L of Unleaded into "empty" diesel tank. Vehicle (Fusion) not started
Remedy was a simple as described...
1) Towed to dodgy yard
2) crappy in line pump connected on the tank side of the hand primer pump (squeezy bubble). Connect to battery terminals with rusty crock clips makinf as many sparks as possible after having sprayed fuel all over engine bay. Pump into rusty old can until tank runs dry
3) refuel with a couple of litres of good diesel
4) run pump again cehcking for traces of petrol (between fingers and sniff)
5) Reconnect fuel line and refuel
6) took 30 or 40 mins
Problem will be disposal of "contaminated" fuel. Apparently that is what I paid for (but I am sure recovery trucks run really well on that mix!)
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Just fill it up with diesel it will not make the slightest difference.
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I put 6l of UL into the 405TD, luckily when it was very empty. Brimmed it with Derv and it was fine. Only reason it made me cross was that I had only intended to put in 15l to get me to Dover, so I could fill up cheaply in France. As it was I was nearly back at the ferry again before I could fill up with cheap fuel.
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I would really love to believe I could just brim it with diesel and save myself the hassle (actually a (VW) mechanic who I know and trust is saying do just that as we know precisely how much was put in and in his opinion it's not enough to do any damage) but the thought of the repair bill if the gamble doesn't pay off means I just can't bring myself to do it.
If I can at least get the fuel out of the tank I'll feel better. The tank was low (range indicator had just dropped below its 50 mile "--" threshold) so at best it's a 50/50 petrol/diesel mix in there now.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Called the Renault dealer.
Don't whatever you do start it. It'll wreck the high pressure pump and probably the injectors as well.
Tank needs to be drained and then brimmed with clean diesel
If the pump has primed, it shouldn't matter as long as the filter is changed as well, as the fuel shouldn't have got any further than that. Important thing is engine hasn't been run.
We can do it for you for £140 all in, but we can't fit it in for a week.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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DP
They're just saying pretty much the usual, sensible, things.
Drain it as much as possible; splash [cupful] of cheap oil mixed with a little derv and a quick shake of the car; refill with a lot of clean derv; make sure, by whatever means, that clean diesel is pumped right through the system before you start it.
[I've never seen the point of a new filter unless it's been sitting full of petrol for a long time.]
Sorted; then you can forget it. All the ones that go wrong have actually been run on petrol.
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Thanks Screwloose. Will do as you suggest.
Now trying to get out of work early and make a start this PM.
cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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I wouldnt have called the garage myself - lets hope they havent ticked the "get out" clause for future use in your customer file........
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< Ex RF, Ex TVM >
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They don't have our name, the reg number, and it wasn't done from our phone ;-)
In any case, the warranty expired last week! :-(
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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A colleague (my boss actually..) did this with his then new Laguna (the 120 engine, whatever that means). Anyway, he called Renault Assist (or whatever it is called) and they told him to just brim it with diesel and keep brimming it for the next few tanks. Two years later there have been no further problems, but I stilll wouldnt't want to buy it used.
Incidentally, my bosses boss did this with his Merc CLS 320CDI. Merc Assist insisted on dropping the tank, draining and cleaning, etc.
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When I used to work as a recovery driver, we used to get these in all the time. We normally charged £160 out of hours and used a old pump salvaged from a written off XR3i to pull the contaminated fuel through the line at the connection to the filter under the bonnet. The only make we wouldn't touch was Mercedes as these never ran right once they had been started. Incidentally, Land rover used to insist on replacing every part of the fuel system at a cost in excess of £5000!! (on the P38 RR at least)
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Problem will be disposal of "contaminated" fuel. Apparently that is what I paid for (but I am sure recovery trucks run really well on that mix!)
Errrr I couldn't possibly say...
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I'll not be drawn as to the course of action I would take (it depends on the type and particularly the maker of the fuel system) but if any oil is added to the fuel - a good idea in moderation - use self-mixing 2 stroke oil.
Engine oil has poor lubricity at this kind of dilution and can cause problems with ash formation on the injector needle tips.
659.
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"Errrr I couldn't possibly say..."
I will take that as a yes then.
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A quick update: After seeing what was involved in dropping the tank (a lot!), I rang a local garage recommended by a mate whose C class has been looked after by them for 5 years now, and has had no problems.
They said they'd recover it for £20 and charge £100 labour to drain the tank and flush the lines through just in case, plus of course any fuel added. They also recommended a new diesel filter at "about a tenner".
Got a call at 5:00 this evening to say it's all back together and running fine, but they want to road test it in the morning before they ask us to pick it up and were about to knock off for the evening. Tank has been completely drained, the fuel lines up to the filter flushed with clean diesel, and a new filter fitted.
The guy said there was no evidence that any petrol had made it into the fuel lines, but that once the tank was drained, the flushing process was so quick and easy it was a "no brainer". Dropping the tank takes the time.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
Edited by DP on 02/11/2007 at 21:41
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my mate ran his nearly new grand cherokee with 30/70 petrol/diesel (its a CRD) and has had no issues at all apart from a couple of dodgy starting moments. He kept topping it up with diesel to keep diluting. 2 weeks later its fine.
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Which car designer was the first to say, "I know, let's knock 50p off production costs by doing away with the drain plug on the fuel tank", and what punishment would be most appropriate for him?
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Edited by Robin Reliant on 02/11/2007 at 22:58
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DP
"Dropping the tank?" What on earth? Who are these people?
Just suck it out the filler; or use the fuel pump to empty it. Or remove the tank unit and syphon it through the 6" hole....
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ive got draining tanks to a fine art if the cars of to see its maker
i hate dropping tanks and cant remember the last time i changed one (thankfully)
plus you now need a licence in case you pass wind while doing it (is that acceptable mods?) {it is now}
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 03/11/2007 at 00:13
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Sorry - yesterday was a very long and exhausting day. What I meant was draining the tank was the time consuming part - not dropping it.
I don't know how they did it - will ask when I pick it up. From speaking to the guy and from a mate's recommendation I am inclined to believe they've done a decent job though.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Just picked it up and added 56 litres of fresh diesel. Drove it home and it seems fine.
Thanks all
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Now, about your "repeat performance" prevention strategy.
For guidance
There is not much (financially) between divorce or new inejctors/pump....
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< Ex RF, Ex TVM >
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Why didn't you use the method that Telly Savalis did in Kelly's Heroes? You stick a piece of tube in the tank (no pun intended) and suck!
I also agree with other posts which say just keep it filled up with diesel and drive. I do not think a small amount of petrol would cause much trouble.
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