I'm not sure whether this has been covered before but I'm still confused about using a hand held mobile. I understand that the law prohibits the use of a hand held when moving and also stationary with the engine running. Someone has now told me that it may be rather foolish to use a hand held when sitting in the driver's seat with the engine off. According to this 'someone' the police may assume that the engine was swiftly switched off when the driver saw an officer approaching.
BTW what's the situation over using a mobile when riding a horse on public roads? Not such a daft question as I saw a girl the other day doing just that and certainly not paying attention to controlling the horse!
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They'd have to prove "driving" , One may indeed be "driving" when stationary, there's plenty of case law on what constitutes "driving", without researching it I doubt whether a stopped engine means the the driver is "driving". Luckily UK courts don't allow Officers to "assume" they have to have evidence.
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To be safe I would say staitonary, handbrake on and key out of ignition. If you can be done for due care and attention for eating an apple at the wheel or adjusting your lippy if (female!) while stationary I wouldn't chance it
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To be frank, everybody who uses a mobile phone constitutes a hazard unless they are on the sofa in the comfort of their own home and away from sharp objects, scalding water and the TV remote control.
As soon as someone uses their mobile whilst they are....ahem.....mobile, be it in a car, on foot, on cloven hoof, a bike, trike they are at worst completely oblivious of their surroundings, or at best, less concentrated.
How many times have you been behind someone walking down the street when they stop suddenly and gesticulate wildly as they make their point to whoever is on the end of the line, or the pedestrian who wanders off the footpath and onto the pedex without so much as a by your leave as they discuss the minute details of tonights dinner, or the cyclist....or motor cyclist....even in Tesco as you patiently wait wth your shopping trolley as some gum chewing chavvy can't even be bothered to stop their conversation as they pay for their groceries, very slowly.
Mobiles are a fact of life and infuriating......and I cannot be without one!
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> " on cloven hoof"
Wow - I want to SEE someone riding his cows and sheep on the road, let alone with the mobile in use! ;~)
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> " on cloven hoof" Wow - I want to SEE someone riding his cows and sheep on the road let alone with the mobile in use! ;~)
A local farmer near us often hitches a ride on the rearmost cow when he is moving them in to milking or back to the field.
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> " on cloven hoof" Wow - I want to SEE someone riding his cows and sheep on the road let alone with the mobile in use! ;~)
A farmer near us often hitches a ride on the rearmost cow when he is moving them in to milking or back to the field.
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SNIPQUOTE!A farmer near us often hitches a ride on the rearmost cow when he is moving them in to milking or back to the field.
Ah, but does he use his mobile at the same time?!! :-)
Seriously I'd have thought the Police could do her if they thought she wasn't in control of the veh..., sorry, horse! They can do a cyclist who's drunk, so why not a horse rider?
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 23/10/2007 at 20:21
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Based on the fact that you can successfully be prosecuted for driving under the influence if the keys are in the ignition, even if the engine is off and you are wrapped up in a blanket and obviously bunking down for the night, then I would assume that this test may also reasonably be applied to use of a mobile.
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To a certain extent, but governed by very different case-law.
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Interesting about 'driving under the influence'. Situation - I have a few drinks in pub with Mrs S, arranging to meet daughter who's working late in the vicinity, using my car. I have a set of keys. Walk to car park, open car, sit in passenger seats awaiting daughter. Daughter arrives, drives home. Hm, that's driving under the influence? I thought it was being responsible!
JS
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Based on the fact that you can successfully be prosecuted for driving under the influence if the keys are in the ignition even if the engine is off and you are wrapped up in a blanket and obviously bunking down for the night then I would assume that this test may also reasonably be applied to use of a mobile.
Yes, you might be surreptitiously using the phone by torchlight under the blankets.
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Someone has now told me that it may be rather foolish to use a hand held when sitting in the driver's seat with the engine off.
Perhaps "someone" thinks that the sky might fall on their head?
BTW what's the situation over using a mobile when riding a horse on public roads?
They use the 'phone whilst riding their horse. End of story.
Pssst! You don't need a driving licence to ride a horse (or walk, cycle, etc.) on public roads".
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pulled up at a busy T juntion the other day and sat behind a stationary land rover for some time...wondered why they never pulled out when it was clear
so i pulled around them and drove off and they were sat there bold as brass on the phone..no attemp to pull over or hazzard lights lol
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Driving home yesterday evening, and the chap in front was reading his SMS's and replying to them.
All this at 50mph on the dual carriageway!
I gave him the Gareth Hunt/coffee beans at the next lights...
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I think that if you have the ignition key on or about your person you are deemed to be driving.
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L\'escargot.
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" I think that if you have the ignition key on or about your person you are deemed to be driving."
No. As I said above there is a definition of driving in the RTA. Over the years this has been refined and focussed with caselaw. You can actually "drive" a car (within the meaning of the Act) without having the keys anywhere nearby. The old Section 5 (Drunk in Charge was the Police term) is different, having the keys in your pocket may then become a situation where you are in Charge for the purposes of that chunk of legistlation......Driving as the Act understands is'nt that simple.
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