When a 2000-vintage car TD reasonable size estate car with 80k can be found for just a few hundred pounds, you have to wonder why.
Why? Can they really be THAT bad? HJ mentions 'lousy build quality' and 'timing belt changes every 3 years/36k.'
Is there a single Fiat driver on this board?
(My mother had a Cinquecento (early 1970s vintage) which rusted before her eyes. Father once tried to change a wheel on it when it was about 3 years old, and the jack just went straight through the bottom of the car.)
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In 1984, after Fiat had gone to Saab in the late 1970s for advice on rustproofing, I acquired a used 1.4-litre Fiat Miafiori 131 that I used for three years.
It proved a cracking car, was economical on fuel and cheap to run. I was so pleased I followed it up with a Fiat Regata 1.6S (a Fiat dealership demo for a modest £5k) that was also retained for three years.
This proved equally satisfactory with one exception - the brakes. They were either on or off with absolutely nothing in between, somewhat reminiscent of older Polos with no brake servo. It was common with Regatas so I lived with it.
In both cases, neither Fiat showed any tendancy to rust and I'm someone who lives right on the North West's Irish Sea coastline.
I'd be quite happy to buy a Fiat again in the highly unlikely event of switching from VW, but it would have to ride and handle better than cars such as the Brava and Bravo...:-)
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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Fiats don't rust now. It's a thing from the 1970's
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When a 2000-vintage car TD reasonable size estate car with 80k can be found for just a few hundred pounds, you have to wonder why. Why? Can they really be THAT bad? HJ mentions 'lousy build quality' and 'timing belt changes every 3 years/36k.' Is there a single Fiat driver on this board? (My mother had a Cinquecento (early 1970s vintage) which rusted before her eyes. Father once tried to change a wheel on it when it was about 3 years old, and the jack just went straight through the bottom of the car.)
First the rust thing. Italy no longer uses sub-standard Soviet Bloc steel that was bartered by the then communist government in exchange for various goods and services. At least they had an excuse for their cars falling apart in the 70s. The rest of the world's motor industry also made cars that rusted, but they tended to last a few months longer before falling apart. A Marea will be as good as any of its contemporaries.
Secondly the engine. Is this the 2.4JTD? If so it's basically identical to the engine in my beloved 156. HJ is mistaken when he refers to 36k timing belt changes on this engine. I'm not aware of a single instance in the UK of a 2.4JTD blowing a belt before the scheduled 72k and nor are the two Fiat/Alfa specialists I use for servicing my car. That's not to say I didn't opt for an earlier belt change, but that has more to do with the fact that my car is driven VERY hard and has been chipped for an extra 40 or so BHP. It is recommended by both specialists that the tensioners are inspected at 50k or so as there have been instances of tensioner failure, but this is common to pretty much every car out there, regardless of the official line from the manufacturers.
You may well get trim niggles and squeaks on the Marea; the dash design seems to lend itself to it for some reason.
There are plenty of 156 JTD drivers who have reported in excess of 140,000 miles without problem on the forums at Alfaowner.com
If you want to talk over possible pitfalls with this car, can I recommend that you ring Geoff at Melbury Motor Company on 01747 855247. Very knowledgeable on this engine in both the Fiat and the Alfa. Melbury were running a 2.4 Marea Weekend as a service/support car and may well still be doing so.
Hope this helps,
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Ride quality is a bit poor. My dad test drove one of that era with the 2.4jtd and it was rock hard. This is saying something when I have cars with ultra firm suspension! It is possible the shocks were knackered on the one he drove so I might being unfair.
teabelly
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I has a hertz one for a few days a couple of years ago when they were new. Ride quality, especially for those in the rear, was dreadful. I couldn't find a comfortable driving position but meybe I'm not the shape they build them for.
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I was only using the rust example as to why people used not to buy Fiats, sorry not to make that clear.
Does anybody on this board run a Fiat?
I remember noticing the Marea at a car supermarket about 5 years ago, and being amazed how cheaply 6-18 month cars with 15k miles were being unloaded. At the time I thought it might be a really cheap car to look out for further down the line.
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The only Fiat I had was a Regata 85c Weekend 1989 vintage. The 1970s rust problem was evident here as well!
I had it for 5 years, didn't cost a lot to run but it was like a slug to get rid of later.
It took 7 months to get rid of it. Every other car I have ever sold has gone within a few weeks, including a Renault Trafic van with a knackered diff
By all means buy a Fiat, pay next to nothing for it because you'll get even less for it when you try to sell it.
This one may have the 2.4jtd engine, and that'll be of value to an Alfa owner when the rest of it rusts through, but it's a Fiat. Fiat's don't sell.
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Ride quality is a bit poor. My dad test drove one of that era with the 2.4jtd and it was rock hard. This is saying something when I have cars with ultra firm suspension!
I hired a petrol one for a weekend a few years ago to help a friend move house, and I didn't find the suspension too bad. I really like soft-riding cars, and while the Marea was no rival for a older French car, my friend and I both thought that it was a much nicer car than we'd expected. There was an annoying lip to the boot, which made it it a bit tedious to shift heavy stuff, but that was the only thing we disliked. No idea how reliable it was, but it ran smothly all weekend!
Mapmaker, any chance you could drive one before you decide to hand over your beer money?
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I drove a Marea saloon for about 3 months as a company car. Clearly I can make no comment on long-term ownership on that basis (no problems in 3 months for me), but I can tell you it went like snot off a stick and handled well.
V
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Well, I have one of the 'new' Fiat Pandas and it's a brilliant car. I've done over 18,000 miles since I bought it new last year and it's great to drive - and with cheap insurance and over 55mpg. Rust is definitely not a problem with Fiats these days - it's a shame that people have this fixation with Fiats being rust buckets and unreliable....I would recommend the (new) Panda 100%
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My dad ran a 96P 1.6 petrol Marea saloon for 4 years and 60k miles without any major problems. The depreciation was, as expected, titanic, but that was the only major pitfall. The ride is not the greatest, but equally it could be far worse. The dashboard developed a few squeeks, but these could be solved with careful placement of a few sponge pads! Can't comment on the diesel engines but the petrol was responsive enough for the size.
BTW, the comment about the lip on the weekend model is, as far as I can remember incorrect. The boot lid is split section with the bumper section dropping separatley from the rest of the boot.
And in terms of running current Fiats, my last car was a 96 Punto 55SX which gave 5 years of good service and 60k miles as a student, and my wife currently runs a Punto 1.3 multijet (diesel) dynamic, which has covered 40k miles over two years from new with no problems, except being noisy! Mind you, it is a work lease car and therefore depreciation is not an issue.
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Underneath the skin of my recently departed Talbot camper lurked a Fiat built van and I can confirm the rust problems were still alive and well in 1988. To be fair the rear chassis members were as new, the MOT tester praised them every year, but the cab panels could rust for England, or should that be Italy.
In fact the van was a good sound commercial vehicle, bombproof engine apart from the exhaust manifold studs, but I could never get used to the little design quirks such as having to remove the header tank in order to take the brake fluid cap off and needing a tyre lever to top up the oil, never mind having to bend the brake pipes out of the way to get the plug spanner on.
So what have I replaced it with, why another Fiat. Forum wisdom says that the cabs from 1995 on were galvanised and the 2.5TD is another rock solid engine. Problem is for a would be camper owner there was not much choice until recently, mainly Fiats with a few Transits and VW?s plus a smattering of Mercs for the well heeled. Converters often had a favourite base vehicle so if you want a particular model you have to go with what it is built on.
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One mans junk is another mans treasure
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and just how many rust-free 1988 transits and vw transporters do you see? That's an E/F plate'
Approximately none.
When will this crap about Italian cars rusting more than others cease?
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Point taken, general advice is against buying trannies of that age. I could forgive the wheel arches disappearing but I couldn't understand rust creeping out from various *dry* seams which was not matched on the other side of the vehicle or on other sevel-built vans, unless it is down to faulty paint preparation
When will this crap about Italian cars rusting more than otherscease?
I always presumed that they rusted as the Italians had no experience of coping with salt drenched roads in the winter.
Unlike many, my camper got used most days through the winter
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One mans junk is another mans treasure
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When will this crap about Italian cars rusting more than others cease?
Approximately the same time when these wonderful pieces of pub wisdom cease:
Skodas are rubbish you know
All French cars are unreliable (every single one, no exception)
All Fords are built down to a price
And
German cars are high quality and never break down.
Fiat cracked the rust problem in the 80's, and the Tipo (remember them?) was galvanised at about the same time Audi started galvanising. It's a myth, but unfortunately they stick.
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Hello Mapmaker
Yes I run a 1998 Marea Weekend 2.4TD . This has a turbo diesel not the JTD engine of a 2000 model.
The price secondhand makes then very attractive and excellent value for money. Insurance for mine is a group 17 and with a 70% NCD I am paying just under £300 fully comprehensive (with elephant).
The car is a very practical estate car with a large load area. I personally love driving it, even though the ride is quite hard. The steering is very light and responsive, the gear change is feather light like an old escort direct box, but the hydralic clutch is hard and will take a short while to get used to. The diesel engines are very powerful and can make the car fly when needed. In ordinary driving I get about 38mpg (over nearly 2,000 miles), so is fairly economical for such a large car. Servicing is not too bad either as I was charged about £175 by an independant for a main service including parts. A set of tyres should set you back under £200 for pattern type.
The expensive bits to watch for are the cam belt change (Fiat recommend every 72,000 miles, but mine was changed at 62,000 before I bought it) and a clutch change (about £700 as part of the suspension needs to be dismantled). If you are considering buying one, then do check all of the electrics work as this can be a problem in some cars. Also check the boot release as this can get sticky but is easy to fix.
There should be 3 keys for this car, one red and 2 blue. Do not buy one if the red key is missing as it is needed if there is an engine management problem (can be £1200 to replace the locks and engine management).
I would suggest you have a look at:
www.fiatforum.com/
www.bravo-guide.co.uk/
www.sfconline.org.uk/models/marea/Marea.asp
carsurvey.org/model_Fiat_Marea.html
www.car-insurance.gb.com/insurance-groups/FIAT.php
Overall I would recommend you have a test drive and see what you think. If you need any more detailed information on what I think of the Marea Weekend then email me direct.
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Roger
I read frequently, but only post when I have something useful to say.
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I had a Marea saloon to drive for a month around early 1999, IIRC the interior was bland though it was great to drive, handled well and had very characterful 5cyl 2.0 engine. Bit of a Q car really.
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Group 17 insurance?
What are you not telling us about these cars? Are they Ferraris with five doors or something?
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Opps, typo error. It should read group 12. Going from memory I think it will reach 60 in 10.5 seconds and a top speed of 120. Maybe not quite a Ferrari, but still very good performance for an estate at a budget price.
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Roger
I read frequently, but only post when I have something useful to say.
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Bought a marea at 18 months old (1.8) with 16,000 on clock, for £4,500 over 4 years ago, not exciting, but i have had no problems whatsoever with the car. I have used for towing a speedboat, and managed to out the back half of the car into swansea bay. Now has 62,000 miles, and i'll keep running it until it starts giving me problems - then probably just throw it away.
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