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Well, I suppose that's OK if you drive 10 miles a day, but I expect the "500 mile commute whilst towing a 6 berth caravan" crew are getting ready to jump in.
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A typical EV does 3-4 miles per KWh.
A standard 4KW domestic PV array generates ~3500KWh in the UK - more in sunny Torquay than Aberdeen. Rule of thumb - each installed KW needs 75-100 sq. ft. of roof space.
Space for PVs on a medium sized car is 35-50 sq. ft. - roof, bonnet, hatch. The likely usable power generated each year may be be 400-500 KWh - enough to cover 1000-2000 miles - hardly life or budget changing.
The final slight "wrinkle" is that the batteries charge best in summer - potentially you have an EV which may have a range of perhaps 10 miles a day in summer falling to 3 in November.
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Space for PVs on a medium sized car is 35-50 sq. ft. - roof, bonnet, hatch.
As I already said, the whole car is covered with solar panels. Remember, sunlight doesn't just come straight down.
The likely usable power generated each year may be be 400-500 KWh - enough to cover 1000-2000 miles - hardly life or budget changing.
The final slight "wrinkle" is that the batteries charge best in summer - potentially you have an EV which may have a range of perhaps 10 miles a day in summer falling to 3 in November.
Again has been said, the price of the car renders the solar gubbins effectively free. It won't only charge through solar, you can plug it too in just like any other EV.
£21.5k for an EV with a 54kWh battery, the approximate size of a VW ID:3 (cheapest version of which is just under £31k), but at a lower price than the cheapest Fiat 500e.
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You might also want to have a look at the https://aptera.us/
You will either love it or hate it. You decide how many solar panels you want and there’s a calculator on the website that shows how many yearly changes they think you will get.
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This could be the future of motoring - very light weight, aerodynamically excellent to reduce energy consumption. Limited luggage space, no good for caravanners etc etc.
Their claims for charging are based upon the very few places on earth where 100% sum is almost guaranteed with sun high in the sky - tropics. Not like the UK - often cloudy, sun low in sky (never overhead).
Add a bit of exaggeration for potential range, battery cost, driving conditions, optimal external temperatures etc and you have a wonder car. In a decade or two with much cheaper, lighter batteries, more efficient PVs etc it may be possible. I will not be putting down a deposit anytime soon.
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Interesting video about graphene super capacitors
https://youtu.be/87o8AIldbh4
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I'm assuming this is re the Aptera?.
If so,
Limited luggage space
It has 25 cubic feet of luggage space, which I believe equals just under 708 litres (a Golf has 380)
Their claims for charging are based upon the very few places on earth where 100% sum is almost guaranteed with sun high in the sky - tropics. Not like the UK - often cloudy, sun low in sky (never overhead).
Their claims for charging is not based on weather in the tropics, it is based on weather all over the world. The website has a page where you look at a colour chart below a world map, match the colour where you live (based on the amount of sun) to the corresponding number. That number for me (along with most of the UK) would be 0, and goes up to 12 for certain parts of Bolivia, Chile and Argentina. Select your daily mileage from 10-50 and you will get the estimated number of (plug in) charges you will need per year on top of what the solar panels will give.
Add a bit of exaggeration for potential range, battery cost, driving conditions, optimal external temperatures etc and you have a wonder car. In a decade or two with much cheaper, lighter batteries, more efficient PVs etc it may be possible.
The car is way, way more aerodynamic than anything else you can buy, with a drag coefficient figure of 0.13 (a Golf is 0.275). It is also very light for an EV at 800kg with the 60kWh battery. Now it is generally true to say that aerodynamics don't play a big part in efficiency below say 50mph, but with a shape this slippery, it definitely will, especially combined with the low weight meaning acceleration does not deplete power nearly as much as a typical EV, even an electric Corsa is nearly double the weight. Are they exaggerating the projected range?, maybe, but to single them out for doing what every other car comany does wouldn't be very fair. And irrespective of this, it is going to have a far greater range than any other EV with a similar battery size.
I will not be putting down a deposit anytime soon.
Well ignoring the question of whether it will go on sale in the UK, it is a two seater. So the percentage of buyers who could fit an Aptera in their lives (whether they like it or not) is obviously going to be very small. Despite the fact that I love it, i also won't be putting a deposit down any time soon, because having two cars is not viable for me, nor is one car with two seats (otherwise I definitely would).
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There's another solar EV pitched at the opposite end of the market. It's called the Lighyear -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM6BHvgvrVc
It will be interesting to see which has greatest commercial success.
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There's another solar EV pitched at the opposite end of the market. It's called the Lighyear -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM6BHvgvrVc
It will be interesting to see which has greatest commercial success.
That may depend on how you quantify success.
If you consider success as making most money for the shareholders, I'd guess the $250k Lightyear 0 would win there. But if you consider success to be number of cars on the roads and doing most (between the two) to get folk into an EV, I'd guess that to be £21.5k Sono Sion!
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I admire the aspiration and intent. At some point much will be a reality - but in one or two decades. I simply to not believe what is promised is feasible in the next year or two.
Claim is that Aptera will use 100W per mile. Current EV is ~300W per mile.
It is about twice as aerodynamic, has less friction (3 wheels), and is about half the weight - 800kg vs 1600kg. Passengers and luggage are no lighter. Ancillaries (aircon, lights etc) would be very similar. I would guess reality consumption is 150-180W per mile.
The 700W PV panels fitted will apparently produce UP TO 4KW per day. At a claimed 100W per mile the 40 mile range per day is arithmetically correct.
In the UK 700W of PV will averagely produce 1.7KW due to low sunshine hours (compared to say LA), and that horizontal PVs (roof, boot etc) work more efficiently when the sun is higher in the sky.
These two factors alone reduce the "up to 40 miles" to "around 10 miles per day" in the UK.
Luggage capacity - there is a standard for measuring capacity involving litre sized blocks. I suspect he may have poured rice grains (or similar) into every nook and cranny.
It is 16 inches wider than a VW Golf and a little longer. The width would make it largely unusable in the UK (but not illegal). I will take on trust that impact safety etc etc will meet regulations.
Finally we are expected to believe they can provide world class advanced engineering and materials - composites, cooling systems, advanced lightweight batteries etc - to give a 250-1000 mile range for £20-40k. The cheapest Tesla is £48k albeit not a direct comparison).
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Sounds like a good theoretical fit here in Taiwan.
5th lowest birthrate in the world, so 2 seats SHOULD be ok, and uncomfortably reliable sunshine.
But if it isn't BLING
It won't be a thing.
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I have to admit to really liking this car. I have to say I thought it was a lot smaller then it is but I guess to make it stable it clearly needs to be wider. That probably would rule it out for me
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The 700W PV panels fitted will apparently produce UP TO 4KW per day. At a claimed 100W per mile the 40 mile range per day is arithmetically correct.
In the UK 700W of PV will averagely produce 1.7KW due to low sunshine hours (compared to say LA), and that horizontal PVs (roof, boot etc) work more efficiently when the sun is higher in the sky.
These two factors alone reduce the "up to 40 miles" to "around 10 miles per day" in the UK.
You make it sound like they are trying to hide something. I did mention the map/colour chart/number thing on my last post, and actually the link provided to Aptera by newguy2015 takes you to a page where it clearly states the daily solar charge capacity ranges from 16-40 miles, not just 'up to 40'.
Luggage capacity - there is a standard for measuring capacity involving litre sized blocks. I suspect he may have poured rice grains (or similar) into every nook and cranny.
Cars in the USA have boot volume measured by cubic feet, so it is probably fair to assume that your standard litre blocks are not used as standard there. Quite how they do measure it I don't know, but looking at pictures and videos, the boot is clearly very large indeed.
It is 16 inches wider than a VW Golf and a little longer. The width would make it largely unusable in the UK (but not illegal).
I didn't realise quite how wide it was. But, while its width is likely to make it inconvenient in some situations, the suggestion that its width would make it largely unusable in the UK is nonsense (unless you also think a Luton van is also largely unusable in the UK).
Finally we are expected to believe they can provide world class advanced engineering and materials - composites, cooling systems, advanced lightweight batteries etc - to give a 250-1000 mile range for £20-40k. The cheapest Tesla is £48k albeit not a direct comparison).
As it happens, that price is what I am most sceptical about.
Having said that, modern tech, manufacturing (especially low volume) and design does not have to be provided be huge companies with huge overheads to pay and huge profits required to keep their shareholders on board. These days small start up companies can do most of what the big boys do for a much lower price. Though obviously with batteries, the price is dictated by current technology and materials.
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Something that light and slippery could probably easily be made compatible with the Gogoro electric scooter battery swapping infrastructure already in place here in Taiwan, if Gogoro thought it was in their interest.
This would remove range anxiety and concerns about battery life.
The solar charging aspect might be a commercial conflict though.
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I presume the car is like a Model-T - any colour as long as it is solar-panel ? And it may do wonders for the car-cleaning brigade, to collect every last milliwatt of energy ....
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Actually light does "come straight down", light moves in straight lines, though technically it can be affected by gravity, light bends around planets and stars.
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Actually light does "come straight down", light moves in straight lines, though technically it can be affected by gravity, light bends around planets and stars.
Never heard of reflected light then?
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Actually light does "come straight down", light moves in straight lines, though technically it can be affected by gravity, light bends around planets and stars.
I didn't say it didn't come straight down, I said it didn't only come straight down, because it doesn't.
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Actually light does "come straight down", light moves in straight lines, though technically it can be affected by gravity, light bends around planets and stars.
If you follow the output of your panels, you will find that the best returns are on a bright day with a good scattering of white fluffy clouds - better than totally clear blue. That is because light doesn't come straight down unless there are bright reflectors up there.
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