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Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Xileno

An interesting article, perhaps provides some clues regarding how other countries including the UK will deal with the shortfall of ICE vehicle taxes. I think road pricing will be introduced.

www.wired.co.uk/article/norway-electric-vehicle-tax

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Grenache

An interesting article indeed. I have family who live there and they discuss this too.

One thing that the article doesn't mention is that electricity is very cheap. Almost all electricity comes from hydro generation, and does not compare with the cost of electricity in the UK.

It's also a country of two halves. A significant number live in or close to Oslo where there is good public transport, high road tolls an no public parking at all in the city centre. This is where the green activists reside, young single or childless with no essential need for a car.

Contrast that with the other half who live away from the cities, who need to transport kids to school perhaps five or ten miles from home where the term 'public transport' is unknown.

Several years ago my son-in-law advertised his 3-year-old car for sale, and a chap came to view. He said he was viewing for a friend, and confirmed the friend would buy it. Next thing he got a call saying, can you meet me at the airport please? The buyer arrived at the airport, they drove into town to do a bank transfer and the buyer droped my son-in-law back at his house.

As a parting comment my son-in-law asked how long it would take the buyer to get home - and he replied '25 hours driving, two tankfuls of petrol! He would not have done that so easily with an EV!

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Terry W

The UK treasury raises £26bn from fuel duties + £7bn from excise duties. There is also VAT on fuel making, say, a total of ~ £35bn.

Total UK taxes are ~£800bn - so vehicle taxation is not a game changer but large enough to be a problem, particularly with Covid debts to repay.

Taxes will be raised to encourage use of public transport, and recognise that EVs still need energy generated - either by green or carbon/nuclear sources.

EV subsidies are already being withdrawn or ended. Expect new taxes based on on either usage (possibly time/route dependant) or electricity used for charging, or both.

They are all technically feasible - only issue is timing which will depend partly on EV take up in the UK - my guess is a start in ~2025 with progressive subsequent increases.

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - movilogo

It is never about environment, always about money.

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - brum

Mayor Kahn is planning to introduce road pricing for London

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Bolt

Mayor Kahn is planning to introduce road pricing for London

Only because the ULEZ isn`t giving enough cash, most traffic is ULEZ free so not giving the cash they wanted, I gather they weren`t expecting that to happen so he wants road pricing instead, though it would be good if local traffic was sorted first though as congestion is terrible on main roads into London because of his daft ideas

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Sofa Spud

I welcome the move to electric cars but they will need to be taxed at some stage to make up for the coming shortfall.

I would suggest that eventual taxation of electric cars should be annual VED based on the maximum rate the motor (or motors) can consume energy. So something capable of emptying its battery by doing 0-60 in 2 seconds a dozen times in succession would pay high tax. This is in line with pursuing a policy of energy efficiency.

I suppose it would be a horsepower tax, or kilowatt tax. There are electric cars with over 1000 bhp. The Tesla Model S Plaid, for example, is 1019 bhp. That's just crazy.

Edited by Sofa Spud on 20/01/2022 at 20:47

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Bolt

I would suggest that eventual taxation of electric cars should be annual VED based on the maximum rate the motor (or motors) can consume energy. So something capable of emptying its battery by doing 0-60 in 2 seconds a dozen times in succession would pay high tax.

Should imo be based on weight of car/vehicle, due to energy needed to propel the vehicle, max speed/acceleration of an electric motor shouldn`t come into it, weight will determine power consumption and source of electricity...

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - daveyK_UK
This may sound old fashioned but how about having a small prudent government that isn’t so reliant on tax?

I have always found it perverse why you would tax travel, it’s one of the key economic activities which should be encouraged.

There are many activities where you can tax people and businesses; road pricing seems totally contradictory to a country that wants to encourage commerce.

One area of transport that seems to avoid proper scrutiny is the handouts and subsidies for railways which have been flavour of the month for far too long.

How about we stop heavily subsidising railways with declining passenger numbers?

Road pricing is simply taking poor people of the roads so rich people can have more space; it’s wrong and it’s not the answer.

The UK is an island with limited space much like Japan; when the majority of vehicles are EVs why not tax cars on the space they occupy aka the length and width.
What can be fairer if everyone has the same fuel?
Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars to Tax - Engineer Andy

To be fair, pre-pandemic times did, over some years show significantly increase numbers of people using public transport, mainly the trains, though I suspect much of that was down to the population increases (especially in cities) due to increased immigration.

The pandemic has, at least temporarily put a dampner on travel by bus and rail. Whether it'll return after (hopefully) the pandemic (restrictions) end is another matter. Other than the fear, I think many people have though long and hard about their priorities and work/life balance and this may change things considerably, which will have a big impact on taxation as well as how we do things as regards the workplace and travel.

Add to that the (often hastily thought out or pushed by certain 'lobby' groups and individuals who have a lot to gain) green laws and you got a lot. Times they are a changing indeed. What to though...