So the French pay higher taxes than we do. At least they still have public services. We have quietly allowed ours to be removed from under our noses.

You can't have it both ways. You either pay for your country to be run properly or you have no coppers on the streets and little else to show for your taxes.

And That is as clear as a message that i totally agree with.

A few weeks ago, we were in Lille.

We went into a local bakery for croissants etc. On leaving a woman , perhaps in her 3o's asked us if we could spare her some food. And no, not a druggie, but dressed as if to go to work.

She had no money for food, she explained. we gave her the big bag of croissants and some money for a coffee in the cafe across the road. She didn't want to take the money, but we insisted.

I have never seen the amount of beggars in 49 years of travelling to France.

We will wear our hi-viz in support.

And gets rid of wealth taxes on his friends the very rich.

This was probably the final straw. It is not 'very rich' to have an estate of more than £1,300,000 which is when the wealth tax kicked in. It equates to a small farm or business plus your life savings, or the value of the estates of tens of thousands of reasonably hard-working thrifty middle aged professionals who would not consider themselves particularly rich. Even fifty times this doesn't get you anywhere near the Sunday Times rich list. But - for the vast majority of young to middle aged blue and white collar employees, especially those in the public services, a seven figure estate would be pie in the sky. 1789 was a rebellion against a tiny minority. This is a rebellion against vast numbers of wealthy middle classes, which hardly existed in those days. It does not bode well.

<< Don't forget King Charles the first was tried for treason and beheaded in 1649 after there was a bit of bother with Oliver Cromwell and Parliament. >>

You will recall that was mostly the culmination of a long-running religious dispute. I think today's French are targeting those they see as a well-heeled establishment. Even if they redistributed their wealth it probably would not cover their expectations. As always, the mob sees no reason to sacrifice any existing perks, even in the country's interest. Neither do the elite, of course.

Ostensibly religious. Equally it was about taxation and representation (the King wanted only one of those). Mix in religion and it became toxic..

Mrs Thatcher's downfall was the Poll Tax..

I think that was the excuse they needed at the time, the real reason she (and arguably the country) was betrayed was because she'd finally realised what the EU was really about (German domination by another name), hence an EU placeman was called for.

Do you seriously believe that?

Macron has decided as all leaders do in financial do do that the masses shall pay... Masses don't like it, we write to our MPs moaning but the French get out and take action. Don't forget that the guillotine was invented in Halifax!

Well, if the 'masses' won't pay, who else can afford to? A socialist ideal is that all people should become equally well off, but clearly if that were to be achieved there would be no-one willing to pay the bills and no-one to be fleeced. In the UK we have been struggling to keep the NHS afloat financially, but that is mainly because we now expect it to provide all those modern expensive treatments for all, gratis. Can't be done I'm afraid. I suppose 'they' could print more money, but that doesn't work either.

Oh dear, safe zones everywhere - it really is the era of the SJW snowflake. So what if there's some robust conversation? It's a (loosely) motoring related political thread. 1984 really is coming true - you're only allowed a government sanctioned "opinion". Very sad.

There's been a request Emailed to me to close this thread, as it's become overly political and there are accusations of racism.

Has anyone got anything useful to add? If not, I'll close it on Tuesday evening.

The subject matter was never going to be just about using the A13 while the 'gilets jaunes' were on the march; the politics are not even a tangent. If that leads to people with robustly held views expressing them and others countering so be it. That includes challenging real or perceived racism.

I don't think anybody who has participated in that debate has the right to demand it be shut down.

Anybody else can choose not to participate.

There's been a request Emailed to me to close this thread, as it's become overly political and there are accusations of racism.

Has anyone got anything useful to add? If not, I'll close it on Tuesday evening.

You're the mod Avant, it's your decision, and no one elses, but i'd like it made clear the email to your good self has not come from me or anyone else on my behalf.

Maybe some people here should look at their own personalities/lives/views for a while and wonder if they are quite as perfect as they think, i won't insult them by calling them ill judged names because i don't know them, their lives or circumstances, the same as they don't know very imperfect me.

I have refrained from commenting so far, though some of the views expressed have been unpleasant, to say the least. Many posters seem to have an axe to grind and their target is the establishment's perceived lurch to the left.

There is also a drawbridge mentality - we're victims of something and two fingers to anyone who disagrees.

The negativity and doom-ridden stuff is a bit hard to stomach, frankly.

I'm not going to add anything specific, except that I don't like any of the above and am disappointed in the views of some forum members I have felt respect for in the past.

If Avant is minded to close the thread it will at least let an unpleasant conversation die.