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NIO battery swap - sammy1

Did anyone watch Fifth Gear Recharge. I showed a NIO battery station swop the EV battery automatically in 5 minutes. The station is in Norway which by all accounts is streets ahead of the UK converting to EV by 2025. China has these stations all over the country.

I do not know how the NIO system works or whether you buy the car with a battery or merely rent the batteries probably the latter? These stations look expensive and must have charging systems for the battery swops. It did not say whether you can charge these batteries yourself otherwise the system would seem pretty limited if you have to take your car to have the battery changed all the time? I wonder what ratio of batteries to cars you would need? It seems that such a system would only be suitable for large urban areas. It appears to me that there needs to be more standardisation of charging systems as EV grows.

[Moved from Technical as it's more a discussion topic and will get more visibility in the Motoring forum]

Edited by Xileno on 22/01/2022 at 07:09

NIO battery swap - John F

As usual the Chinese are streets ahead with this. At first sight it seems about as sensible as unbolting an empty petrol tank and exchanging it for a full one. But their website claims only three minutes to do it, which is about as long as it takes to fill an empty tank. However, it would need impressive logistics to provide twenty fully charged batteries an hour to several exchange points at busy times. But in theory there would be no busy times because usually charging would be done at home and the swap facility only used for the occasional long journey.

NIO battery swap - Terry W

NIO are a Chinese manufacturing company with aspirations - they moved into Norway in 2021, I assume as Norway has a very high proportion of EVs already.

There are two ways of making EVs independent of range anxiety - fast charging like Tesla at 100KW++, or a battery exchange technology like NIO.

Both rely upon access to an "electric fuelling" point - capacity is a current soluble issue. This is no different to ICE where forecourt tanks can run dry through panic buying.

I am not convinced that the NIO approach is right as EVs will need a common battery exchange capability. This is not currently the case, and would require major modifications to both existing and planned designs.

Conversely standardising charging points - connections, payment methods, etc (also necessary) is likely to be far easier as buyers may increasingly select those manufacturers who are best compliant with the widest charging network.

NIO battery swap - brum

I'm inder the impression that batteries are usually built into the floor pan and form part of the vehicle chassis. They are definitely not connected to the main power converters with a simple plug.

I don't think Id be happy to swap my battery pack that was 6 months old with just 2000 easy miles and gentle charging, for another that was 4 years old, had done 80,000 miles and had a life of rapid charging.

NIO battery swap - Xileno

"I don't think Id be happy to swap my battery pack that was 6 months old with just 2000 easy miles and gentle charging, for another that was 4 years old, had done 80,000 miles and had a life of rapid charging."

My thoughts exactly. I used to get annoyed enough when I used to go camping exchanging a nice clean shiny gas cylinder and getting a tatty rusty one in return...Totally irrational of course. With exchange batteries there could (would?) be some degradation in performance.

NIO battery swap - sammy1

"I don't think Id be happy to swap my battery pack that was 6 months old with just 2000 easy miles and gentle charging, for another that was 4 years old, had done 80,000 miles and had a life of rapid charging."

My thoughts exactly. I used to get annoyed enough when I used to go camping exchanging a nice clean shiny gas cylinder and getting a tatty rusty one in return...Totally irrational of course. With exchange batteries there could (would?) be some degradation in performance.

Yes depends if the NIO system is purely rental of the battery? If so then the car itself minus a battery would be comparatively cheap to buy. I asked above if you could charge your own battery which would infer that you bought it? I cannot see the battery exchange being cheap to run, the capital start up of such a system would be very high. Someone would maybe change batteries everyday while someone else perhaps as long as a month so would it cost you per exchange or time held?

PS thanks for moving this to its intended place!

NIO battery swap - pd

I think I am right in saying the original Model S Tesla was designed to allow potential quick swap of the battery.

However, Tesla eventually decided there wasn't enough demand to introduce it and concentrated on the supercharger network instead.

I understand the Model 3 and later Model S are designed differently without quick swap potential.

NIO battery swap - Terry W

The battery lease model was tried by Renault due to the high initial cost of batteries - discontinued a few years ago. Leasing may attract new car buyers by reducing the initial EV cost to below that of an ICE.

A battery pack costing (say) £5000 may need to be recovered over (say) 4 years - £1250pa (£104pm). As the battery supplier covers admin and defaulters, financing costs, technical risk etc - perhaps they make a profit by year 6 or 7.

Charging costs are additional - probably a per KWH charge. At 4 miles per KWH + overheads, the charge would need to be around 10p per mile driven. For a mileage of 12000pa - total cost is £100 per month.

This may attract new car buyers and companies keen to promote green credentials. Second owners would be committed to a possibly unaffordable lease.

Back of a fag packet calculation gives monthly "fuel" costs of ~£200pm for 1000 miles - 20p per mile. A bit more than ICE which at 40mpg and £6 per gallon is ~15p per mile.

No real surprise - EV currently only works if recharged at tax free domestic rates, with additional battery costs recovered through a high annual mileage. Reality is that we will have to pay for a nicer environment through higher transport costs.