Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 06:13
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - _

Silly me. got a low account balance warning and noticed one of my old cars had crossed, so went and deleted from my account. The £2 i've lost isn't worth the hassle..

Lesson learned. all deleted now.

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 13:26
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Chris M

And if you are an infrequent user like me (fortunately!), check your payment method is still valid. They'll send a reminder when it's about to expire, but if you miss the email, you'll get a penalty next time you cross (which they cancelled in my son's case when he phoned).

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 14:40
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Engineer Andy

A real shame they don't do a 'phonecard' type system where you can buy one without having to register an account then use it for any vehicle you're travelling in and without a use-by date.

Not exactly the same but I used part of the £45 left on my Oyster card (not used for 4 years!) after leaving my last job (and career) in 2017 to meet up with a former work colleague in London a couple of months ago.

I mean it's not as though the powers-that-be care where the payment for crossing the bridge/tunnel comes from, as long as it gets paid!

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 15:27
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Bromptonaut

A real shame they don't do a 'phonecard' type system where you can buy one without having to register an account then use it for any vehicle you're travelling in and without a use-by date.

The system is based entirely on number plate recognition and the number tying up with an account or one off payment made on line.

There's no facility to show an Oyster style PAYG card.

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 16:34
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Galaxy

They closed my Dartford Crossing Account because I hadn't used it for a while.

Had no choice in the matter.

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 17:22
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Bromptonaut

They closed my Dartford Crossing Account because I hadn't used it for a while.

Had no choice in the matter.

Mine too. Lack of use during the pandemic. Normally a combination of a summer holiday in France and a trip or two to the CAMC site near Folkestone means we were using it at last one way or the other a couple of times a year.

Holiday 2020 we crossed out Portsmouth Le Havre and although we cam back to Dover we used M26/M25/M40 rather than Dartford and M25 c/clockwise/M1. So no use for a year after December 2019 when we'd been at Folkestone.

Initially it was suspended, could be reinstated by passage through the tunnel but we didn't manage that in time. Forgot to pay promptly after a passage through in June and got a Charge Notice.

Fortunately they let me off.

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 17:23
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - John Boy

They closed my Dartford Crossing Account because I hadn't used it for a while.

Had no choice in the matter.

Same thing happened to me after I'd not used it for 2 years. I recall that getting a refund was a bit of a rigmarole. Perhaps that's easier now. It wasn't difficult to open another one 18 months later, when I thought I might need to use the crossing again.

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Sat 13 Nov 2021 20:18
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Big John

Same thing happened to me after I'd not used it for 2 years. I recall that getting a refund was a bit of a rigmarole. Perhaps that's easier now. It wasn't difficult to open another one 18 months later, when I thought I might need to use the crossing again.

Likewise because I've not been driving to France etc since lockdown my account was removed and still had a reasonable balance left on it - I phoned up and they were helpful and a cheque appeared in the post a few days later. However shouldn't this be automatic? - how much money are they sat on and legally when does this expire?

I've since setup a PAYG account and noted the expiry date of the card in my calendar just to make sure.

I've always disliked the signage for the Dartcharge - it's not very clear and just says "find us online" - and when you do you find the scam sites! What's wrong with giving out a phone number? If you are not familiar with what's required it's easy to miss - imagine if you are coming to this country on holiday and you don't understand English.

Edited by Big John on 13/11/2021 at 20:52

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Sun 14 Nov 2021 18:21
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Smileyman

If you are not familiar with what's required it's easy to miss - imagine if you are coming to this country on holiday and you don't understand English.

I guess such people won't be paying. Serves them right, I agree the DART charge people don't do enough to make it easy to pay.

(Although actually I feel this entity should be disbanded as the whole matter of charging is nothing more than a form of taxation of a captive target)

Edited by Smileyman on 14/11/2021 at 18:23

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Sun 14 Nov 2021 20:47
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - alan1302

If you are not familiar with what's required it's easy to miss - imagine if you are coming to this country on holiday and you don't understand English.

I guess such people won't be paying. Serves them right, I agree the DART charge people don't do enough to make it easy to pay.

(Although actually I feel this entity should be disbanded as the whole matter of charging is nothing more than a form of taxation of a captive target)

In what way is it taxation? You use the crossing and you pay for it.

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Mon 15 Nov 2021 10:45
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Bromptonaut

In what way is it taxation? You use the crossing and you pay for it.

Yep. There's a toll for using the infrastructure. Lot's of toll bridges and ferries around the country.

Government could abolish tolls, as has been done in Scotland. Not doing so is a political/policy choice.

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Mon 15 Nov 2021 12:41
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Engineer Andy

A real shame they don't do a 'phonecard' type system where you can buy one without having to register an account then use it for any vehicle you're travelling in and without a use-by date.

The system is based entirely on number plate recognition and the number tying up with an account or one off payment made on line.

There's no facility to show an Oyster style PAYG card.

Exactly my point. Why can't there be? I'm not advocating using the card in the car to be 'recognised, but having a simple way of paying a fee within (or before) the alotted time by just referencing your number plate on their system (rather like looking up your car's details on the .gov website for the car's details, MOT history, etc).

I mean, it's not as though people would want to pay for someone else's car by mistake. You could set up an account for your car (some proof of wonership might be needed), then just pay via the 'card' (like using a pre-paid debid card) or use it to 'top-up' the account if you knew you were going to make multiple trips across the bridge/through the tunnel which would then automatically have the amounts removed as you use them.

The only difference would be the system scans the number plate rather than a personal Oyster card or debit/credit card as you go past the barrier/toll point camera. You also have to wonder why the system cannot automatically credi money back when a car is sold (and the DVLA is informed) or at the very least send an email to the previous owner via their account to let them know they have X days to recredit the money, again, like you can do with the Oyster card (I think).

A shame that no-one working for the DfT (or whoevere is in charge of it) responsible for the crossing have even considered 'something', anything along these lines or similar. You have to wonder what they do all day.

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Mon 15 Nov 2021 22:50
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - silverback

Before the Dart Charge existed there was another prepayment method - you had a device you could attach to the windscreen which the barrier would detect and raise so you didn't need to stop and pay at the toll booth, but you still had to slow to a near stop. You could use the device in any car as the device wasn't registered to a specific vehicle. I suspect that the technology to detect such devices is too short range for multiple lanes at the crossing. Nowadays there are no toll booths or individual lane barriers.

The Humber bridge has both toll booths and Open Road Tolling where there is a dedicated single lane in either directions where the vehicles don't need to stop. I believe this system uses a Humbertag similar to the old Dartford crossing device. There is a lot less traffic on the Humber bridge so you can almost hold a conversation if paying the toll at the crossing without causing delay!

Finally the Dartford Crossing charge - I'TS NOT A TOLL! It's a Congestion Charge.

Originally it was stated that when the crossing had been paid for the tolls would go. As the crossing was paid for long ago (by 2003?) there were complaints that the tolls should have gone. So the tolls have gone but strangely enough it was decided that there needed to be a charge to try and discourage traffic so there is now a Congestion Charge at a similar price to the toll they said would be removed!

You can pay the Dart Charge months in advance even as a one off. If using regularly then the prepaid account is the way to go and can have multiple vehicle number plates on it. So the account is pre-paid just like an oyster card. £10 is the minimum top up payment.

Highways England run the crossing and are responsible for collecting the money. the DVLA are not involved.

www.essexlive.news/news/essex-news/dartford-crossi...2 may explain better

Edited by silverback on 15/11/2021 at 23:02

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Mon 15 Nov 2021 23:13
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Big John

You can pay the Dart Charge months in advance even as a one off. If using regularly then the prepaid account is the way to go and can have multiple vehicle number plates on it. So the account is pre-paid just like an oyster card. £10 is the minimum top up payment.

There lies the original problem if not a regular user (as mentioned above) - I had this pre loaded with nearly £20 but because of the pandemic and me not going around London or to France my account was deleted and I didn't realise. I eventually found an email buried in my spam account. How many other accounts & balances have vanished.

To be fair when I phone up I received a cheque in the post. I now have opened a PAYG account.

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Tue 16 Nov 2021 17:36
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Smileyman

I note questions about my comment that the Dart charge is a form of taxation, true, it is a toll that is only payable if the road in question is used, however it is a public highway, linking two sides of one the UK's major motorways. (Almost) all roads in the UK are public highways, built and maintained by the public purse, charging to use is to put funds into or reduce costs on the public purse, a form of taxation.

I agree there is an element of congestion charge too, being free to use at times of lower traffic levels, but the tolls were not instigated for that purpose, they have morphed to include this second aspect. (I can recall paying a toll in the 1960's when it was just the one tunnel).

Considering the "free" hours are very restricted and only overnight it is very unlikely that the likes of me would ever be able to take advantage.

Going back to the original reason for this thread, I have family members' cars included in my online account, they don't use the crossing very often so are happy to benefit from the lower fee for account usage, a couple of years ago one of them changed cars but kept his private plates, the account has not updated with the new car make / model etc.

Edited by Smileyman on 16/11/2021 at 17:41

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Tue 16 Nov 2021 17:44
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - _

Considering the "free" hours are very restricted and only overnight it is very unlikely that the likes of me would ever be able to take advantage.

When we were going regularly to the Channel crossings, I found it a good idea to be clear of Dartford before 6.00AM,the bonus was that it was free, and often got to Dover for an earlier boat...

Going next month, so will do the same thing..

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Tue 16 Nov 2021 18:29
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Bromptonaut

I note questions about my comment that the Dart charge is a form of taxation, true, it is a toll that is only payable if the road in question is used, however it is a public highway, linking two sides of one the UK's major motorways. (Almost) all roads in the UK are public highways, built and maintained by the public purse, charging to use is to put funds into or reduce costs on the public purse, a form of taxation.

It really is not. Esturial bridges and tunnels are built to remove the need for ferries (eg Forth or Humber) or avoid long diversions. At the time the project is authorised it is determined that, rather then falling on the taxpayer, the cost should be recovered over time by tolls on those actually using the facility.

You can argue over whether such tolls should ever be levied or whether (qv Scotland) they should not be adopted and abandoned where previously imposed (Skye, Forth etc) but that does not render the charges 'taxation'. If you want to avoid the Dartford tolls then, albeit at cost in time/money, there are alternatives.

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Tue 16 Nov 2021 21:16
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - alan1302

The Humber bridge has both toll booths and Open Road Tolling where there is a dedicated single lane in either directions where the vehicles don't need to stop. I believe this system uses a Humbertag similar to the old Dartford crossing device. There is a lot less traffic on the Humber bridge so you can almost hold a conversation if paying the toll at the crossing without causing delay!

No tag for the Humber Bridge - it's all number plate recognition.

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Wed 17 Nov 2021 00:01
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - Big John

No tag for the Humber Bridge - it's all number plate recognition.

Yes there is, I have one, it goes "bip" as I cross the bridge - Well it did last Friday. It uses both tag and numberplate technology if you have a Humbertag account.

It is possible to pay for a trip going through the tag lane online without a tag paying online for each crossing - "Crossings in the Tag Lane by drivers without a tag account must be paid online within 72 hours of the vehicle details being uploaded to the website. Failure to do so will result in administration charges being incurred per unpaid toll fee."

For both ways of paying the web site is a bit carp though.

Edited by Big John on 17/11/2021 at 00:05

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Wed 17 Nov 2021 21:29
Don't forget - Remove vehicles from Dartford crosssing account - alan1302

No tag for the Humber Bridge - it's all number plate recognition.

Yes there is, I have one, it goes "bip" as I cross the bridge - Well it did last Friday. It uses both tag and numberplate technology if you have a Humbertag account.

It is possible to pay for a trip going through the tag lane online without a tag paying online for each crossing - "Crossings in the Tag Lane by drivers without a tag account must be paid online within 72 hours of the vehicle details being uploaded to the website. Failure to do so will result in administration charges being incurred per unpaid toll fee."

For both ways of paying the web site is a bit carp though.

Ah, didn't know that - we have free crossings due to a Motability car but had to register the car so thought they must be only using number plate recognition as we don't have a tag.

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