Any - Reasons to buy used cars

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Sat 25 Nov 2017 18:42
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - scot22

Towards the end of another thread a comment was made that people just bought used cars to save money. This was refuted by some others and it started me thinking. I , for example will not buy a car with EPB which is becoming increasingly difficult, of the various reasons to buy, or not buy, used.

Obviously it will vary between manufacturers but is there an approximate year which was a tipping point with overhold of modern gadgetry.

As a non mechanical person I cant save money by doing work myself on a car so interested to read perspectives on deciding car age, assume able to buy any year.

Sorry for such a vague generalised post.

Edited by Avant on 27/11/2017 at 11:55

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Sat 25 Nov 2017 19:16
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - RT

As "honorary head buyer" of the families cars, I start by identifying their needs and then start narrowing down models which meet those needs - I don't have any absolute brands that must be avoided as my lifetime's hindsight shows that no brand is immune to a bad decade or two. Reports of "issues" are always overblown and if you avoided all cars with an alleged issue, you'd stick to a bike!

As the family have no interest, or knowledge, of mechanics and I'm too old to get "down and dirty" I source cars about a year old, so reasonable manufacturer's warranty still left but saving around 40% on list price.

My son runs his cars for 10+ years, balancing his gradually increasing annual repair/replacement costs against the gradually reducing annual depreciation - he runs a 2016 Skoda Octavia Estate SE 2.0 TDi, enough toys to keep him happy.

My daughter-in-law runs a 2014 Hyundai i30 Style 1.4 - no plans in place for replacement as it's her first car.

I do bully them, benignly, to get servicing done on time.

I have a 2015 VW Touareg SE 3.0 TDi, chosen by gradually whittling the long/short list down to one - bought new with a long list of options - total was twice the other two put together but it's my retirement indulgence.

My Touareg has an automatic EPB, no idea what the Skoda has but not a no-no for me anyway.

Edited by RT on 25/11/2017 at 19:18

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Sat 25 Nov 2017 19:21
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - scot22

Thanks for all the good advice set in the examples of what you do. ROB is a thread on itself but I would prefer to keep things as simple as reasonable.

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Sat 25 Nov 2017 20:46
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

I think that saying people buy used cars over new just to save money is more than a little unfair.

Most people who buy new cars change them on a regular basis, say, every couple of years. This makes absolutely no financial sense at all. The only reason to do this is the same reason people change their phones so often. Having the latest thing, the latest trend, the newest car on the street or whatever. The only way buying a new car makes sense is if you plan to keep it a long time. Such as my Mother in law, who bought her kia rio 1.4 petrol new in 2006.

A more accurate assessment of why people buy used cars over new is not because they want to save money, but because they don't want to waste it.

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Sat 25 Nov 2017 20:50
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

And by the way, i was reading about the new "renaultsport megane" in a magazine the other day. They have ditched the EPB found in the rest of the megane range for a proper handbrake, all the better for helping the back end round a sharp turn!

Vive la France!

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 11:07
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - pd

Whilst I can understand and in many way fully agree that EPBs are a bit pointless I can't think of any reason for not buying a car with one if in other respects it is the car I want / need.

They do their job OK and if implented right are painless to use and don't go wrong very often. They also make replacing rear brake pads dead easy if you've got the right bit of software!

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 11:29
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - John F

1. Value for money. There is no doubt that most depreciation occurs early. It amazes me how many make a heart over head decision to buy a new car on retirement when their mileage drops to often less than 5,000 p.a. (I bought my 49,000m 8yr old Audi just before I retired over 3 years ago - it's still only done 63,000m). New cars only make sense for high milers - or fleet buyers.

2. Reliability. Many problems seem to occur in the first few years. If these have been ironed out in the first 30,000m, there is a good chance the major bits will survive the next 100,000m

3. Cheap to run. Especially for those who do their own maintenance, as no requirement to adhere to expensive dealer-provided servicing (the cost of which is often hidden in a 'free servicing' deal and is mostly just checks done at the MoT). Insurance is usually cheaper too.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 12:16
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - RT

1. Value for money. There is no doubt that most depreciation occurs early. It amazes me how many make a heart over head decision to buy a new car on retirement when their mileage drops to often less than 5,000 p.a. (I bought my 49,000m 8yr old Audi just before I retired over 3 years ago - it's still only done 63,000m). New cars only make sense for high milers - or fleet buyers.

2. Reliability. Many problems seem to occur in the first few years. If these have been ironed out in the first 30,000m, there is a good chance the major bits will survive the next 100,000m

3. Cheap to run. Especially for those who do their own maintenance, as no requirement to adhere to expensive dealer-provided servicing (the cost of which is often hidden in a 'free servicing' deal and is mostly just checks done at the MoT). Insurance is usually cheaper too.

VFM isn't the be-all and end-all of car buying.

We give our son, daughter-in-law and two grandsons generous financial gifts routinely so I "wasted" some of the rest by buying a car that depreciated over £30,000 in it's first 2 years.

There's no pockets in shrouds.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 12:37
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - RobJP

I prefer to buy used and (hopefully) well looked-after,or nearly-new.

The current 3 series I bought 6 months old with less than 3k miles on the clock. I paid roughly 66% of list price. That was 4 years ago, and it's on 51k now.

SWMBO doesn't do much mileage. As such, buying the 5 year old petrol Forester with 87k on the clock at under £8k made perfect sense.

Far less sense is her Z4, which has done under 8k miles in the last 2.5 years.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 12:53
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - scot22

I think electronic parking brakes seem to be very much an individual issue. I don't think I would ever relax with one in case it developed a fault. Worst case scenario perhaps if it came on when overtaking. I usually over think, trying not to

I accept I can be excessively cautious. Some strong arguments to buy used. I did once , a Morris Ital. Put depreciation and repair costs together and it cost a fortune. Despite regular dealer servicing after six years, average mileage, even needed a new, recon, engine. Never again.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:41
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - John F

I think electronic parking brakes seem to be very much an individual issue. I don't think I would ever relax with one in case it developed a fault.

I have always used parking brakes sparingly to ensure longevity. Engaging first gear or P is perfectly adequate on the level, and may even result in a shallower dent if bumped in a car park. I try to remember to use mine every month or two, on the premis that 'if you don't use it you lose it'.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 22:57
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - pd

I think electronic parking brakes seem to be very much an individual issue. I don't think I would ever relax with one in case it developed a fault. Worst case scenario perhaps if it came on when overtaking. I usually over think, trying not to

Well, you could say the same about any car even 10+ years old. What if the ESP system comes on? What if the ABS false activates? The truth is this doesn't happen very often and modern cars are far safer than older ones in reality.

FWIW I have far more trouble with cable handbrakes than electric. Broken cables, delamintaed shoes (hello Volvo!), siezed calipers, malajusted bits - handbrake MOT failures are far more common on manual ones than electric.

I'm not sure electric brakes don't solve a problem which never existed anyway but they are rapidly becoming standard and car buyers expect one in many segments. Like ESP, ABS, Bluetooth, decent aircon etc. they are just becoming a standard car feature.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:26
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - John F

1. Value for money. There is no doubt that most depreciation occurs early. It amazes me how many make a heart over head decision to buy a new car on retirement when their mileage drops to often less than 5,000 p.a. (I bought my 49,000m 8yr old Audi just before I retired over 3 years ago - it's still only done 63,000m). New cars only make sense for high milers - or fleet buyers.

2. Reliability. Many problems seem to occur in the first few years. If these have been ironed out in the first 30,000m, there is a good chance the major bits will survive the next 100,000m

3. Cheap to run. Especially for those who do their own maintenance, as no requirement to adhere to expensive dealer-provided servicing (the cost of which is often hidden in a 'free servicing' deal and is mostly just checks done at the MoT). Insurance is usually cheaper too.

VFM isn't the be-all and end-all of car buying.

We give our son, daughter-in-law and two grandsons generous financial gifts routinely so I "wasted" some of the rest by buying a car that depreciated over £30,000 in it's first 2 years.

RT, I am thankful that there are so many like you, thus ensuring a good choice of VFM cars for people like me who count depreciation in the hundreds, not thousands, of pounds. (In the past 38yrs I have spent £28,000 on four cars for myself, and still have two of them - a TR7 and Audi A8; and a similar sum on the family cars, Fiesta, two Passats and a Focus, which we still have.)

I share your 'shroud' sentiment - and might add 'a man who dies rich dies disgraced' - although its author's concept of riches is probably different to ours.

Not sure why you put 'wasted' in inverted commas!

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:58
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - RT

RT, I am thankful that there are so many like you, thus ensuring a good choice of VFM cars for people like me who count depreciation in the hundreds, not thousands, of pounds. (In the past 38yrs I have spent £28,000 on four cars for myself, and still have two of them - a TR7 and Audi A8; and a similar sum on the family cars, Fiesta, two Passats and a Focus, which we still have.)

I share your 'shroud' sentiment - and might add 'a man who dies rich dies disgraced' - although its author's concept of riches is probably different to ours.

Not sure why you put 'wasted' in inverted commas!

You'd never really be thankful for any of mine when I do sell them - you don't think I sell them if they're any good?

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 16:25
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - Engineer Andy

1. Value for money. There is no doubt that most depreciation occurs early. It amazes me how many make a heart over head decision to buy a new car on retirement when their mileage drops to often less than 5,000 p.a. (I bought my 49,000m 8yr old Audi just before I retired over 3 years ago - it's still only done 63,000m). New cars only make sense for high milers - or fleet buyers.

2. Reliability. Many problems seem to occur in the first few years. If these have been ironed out in the first 30,000m, there is a good chance the major bits will survive the next 100,000m

3. Cheap to run. Especially for those who do their own maintenance, as no requirement to adhere to expensive dealer-provided servicing (the cost of which is often hidden in a 'free servicing' deal and is mostly just checks done at the MoT). Insurance is usually cheaper too.

I think that buying a new car can be a more reliable ownership experience - it really depends on the make, model (including spec) and, most importantly, the stage the car is at in its lifecycle. I will not buy a car that has just come out (1st year of production) unless the differences between it and the previous incarnation are relatively minor (say, mainly cosmetic), such as the difference between the mk1 and mk2 of the Mazda3 (I own a mk1, bought 2 years after it appeared and without any real major faults on the model variant I bought).

Going from a mk1 or 2 to a mk3, well, I only started lookinginto buying a new one this January, again, 2 years after the latest model had appeared and after the 'mid-life facelift' (barely) model appeared. I wanted to see if the newer GDI engine and other new parts (it was a far more drastic change than the last one) would hold up, relaibility-wise, before even looking to buy it or any other model in the range, a bit like the latest incarnation of the VAG TSi engine, and was (and still am) a bit hesitatnt about going for anything other than a car with the 1.4TSi (obviously not the twin charger version) as other size variants have experienced some reliability isssues (never mind other VAG issues generally compared to Mazdas or other Far Eastern makes).

The above can apply to any make, because everyone has different criteria. I find that any serious issues with a new model will emerge after the first couple of years in production, and we can see soon after whether any of them have been successfully resolved or not. A good example of this is (sorry, just an example I thought of, gleened from this week's HJ 'Agony' collumn) VAG trying to improve the reliability of the DSG auto box by going from dry to wet clutches, but it seems that even they haven't cracked that proverbial nut yet.

Until any new tech on cars is proven over the longer term (especially if its very difficult and/or expensive to repair/replace and often occures outside of the warranty period), I won't go for it unless I was forced to, even if that meant buying a second hand car. With electronic parking brakes, well, some seem to be better designed than others in terms of reliabilty. As with all expensive purchases, the best advice anyone can give is for buyers to do their homework, thoroughly, and don't rush into buying anything.

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:31
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - argybargy

Leaving aside the fact that I couldn't really afford one anyhow, I regard the price of new cars in this country as a perfect example of the very real phenomenon which is Ripoff Britain.

We Britons have a wonderful talent for moaning like Hell about everything under the sun, but there is a section of the population whose eyes glaze over with delight at the sight of the latest new model of car, TV or mobile phone and who are willing to pay full whack in sufficient numbers to allow manufacturers and their agents to make enough of a healthy profit to justify the pricing structures that allow them to keep pumping us for more and more cash.

Yes, there are deals to be had if you're willing to be assertive and walk away if necessary, and there are contributors here who clearly bargain hard when they buy a new motor. However, how many out there in the wider world just pay what the Man asks them to pay and thus help him to keep new car prices artificially high?

Edited by argybargy on 26/11/2017 at 17:33

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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:52
Any - Reaqsons to buy used cars - Terry W
Cheaper for the same spec or better motor for the same money-or some combination of the two.

There is no right answer although trading up from a new focus to a one year old mondeo may be a trivial issue, trading up to a six year old 100k S class raises a whole different set of risks..
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Sun 26 Nov 2017 17:51
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Andrew-T

In my early car-buying days I fell into the habit of buying a 2- or 3-year-old car every two or three years. That was a widely touted system aimed at avoiding the ravages of corrosion which had usually set in after 5 years or so - sometimes earlier. I did that until about the mid-1980s, when my preferred vehicle of the time, a Maxi, was no longer made. I found its BL replacement (the Maestro) a poor substitute, and switched to Pug 205s, one of which I still keep as a nostalgic toy, for use when two journeys must be made simultaneously.

By then Peugeot (among other makers) had solved the problem of body corrosion, and I started keeping cars for longer than before. I have owned my present workhorse for 9 years, and its predecessor (a 306) for 6. SWMBO kept a 205 Dturbo for 8 years. They all receive regular (but not excessive) maintenance, and breakdowns or unforeseen problems almost never happen to any of them.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 13:12
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - davecooper
On the subject of EPB's, I would much rather have one of these than a normal handbrake mounted on the passenger side of the centre console. I have recently driven two cars that have this, a SEAT Leon and a Mazda CX3 and I find it awkward having to reach across to use the handbrake. Also, if a passenger has a coat on, it can actually hinder access to the handbrake. My current car has an EPB which I am trying to get used to but I'm sure I will.
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Mon 27 Nov 2017 14:04
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Sofa Spud

People buy secondhand cars for various reasons, some of which overlap.

1) They can't afford an equivalent new car.

2) Although they can afford an equivalent new car, they don't want to splash out a big portion of their savings / income on one.

3) They want to avoid the big initial hit of depreciation.

4) There's a particular model they want which is no longer in production, e.g. Land Rover Defender.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 14:06
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - movilogo

People buy used car to save money. It is really that simple.

If new cars cost same as used cars, no one would buy used car then.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 14:44
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Andrew-T

People buy used car to save money. It is really that simple.

Strictly speaking, people buy used cars to avoid spending too much. Very few cars actually help their owners to 'save money'.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 15:03
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - gordonbennet

People buy used car to save money. It is really that simple.

No it isn't.

Some of us do not want what they make these days, and like if you go into a fish and chip shop and they only cook kebabs you wouldn't buy from them....

If Volvo still made the 940 estate as it was, with the VW LT van Diesel engine, and the simple 4 speed box with electric overdrive gearbox then by now one bought new would very likely be sitting on our drive as the near enough indestructible family mule.

Some other possibles that were never offered here if ever made would have been on my list too, such as Sonata/Magentis in estate form, or 2004 on Toyota Camry in estate form, 70 series Landcruiser with the V8 NA Diesel, in estate or pick up form.

Whilst makers keep copying each other making cloned cars of no attraction at all to me, then used cars it will be.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 16:57
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

People buy used car to save money. It is really that simple.

If new cars cost same as used cars, no one would buy used car then.

That will explain why everyone shops at Lidl or Aldi and nobody shops at Waitrose......,

oh no, wait a minute................!

As someone who has a first name uniquely associated with being simple, i feel more than qualified to assure you that most people are not quite as simple as you seem to think.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 20:57
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - barney100

Biggest cost in car ownership is buying it in the first place. It's all a matter of personal choice.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 21:49
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Big John

Biggest cost in car ownership is buying it in the first place. It's all a matter of personal choice.

Depends on how you do it:-

My current costs runnig a reasonable car for 15,000 miles a year (longish conmute)

I budget for:-

£I,200/year capital (I budget £100/month but thus far have always managed less - Last Superb mk I cost £8,200 and I got 10 years wich is £820 year)

£600/year maintenance

£400/year tyres (actually doing much better at the mo - but got stung in the past with very low profile tyres that lasted 12,000 miles and cost £1000 a set! - not current car)

£1800/year fuel (current average mpg 45.8)

£50 MOT

£150 car tax

£300 insurance

Total budget cost £4500 /year to drive to work / tour Europe which is £375 / month inclusive £100/month of which is the capital

My current strategy is to buy a cheaper end of model car at 1 year old for a Yorkshire price (Current is a 14 plate Superb II 1.4tsi bought at 14 months old for £10k). I ignore depreciation as this is included in the capital cost and with my mileage I then throw away (well sell very cheap)

I have bought new as well - once landed an end of model Octavia new for less than I could buy a two year old one for!

I've done long commutes since 1989 so I've had a bit of practice!

Edited by Big John on 27/11/2017 at 22:25

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 21:25
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - FP

Now then, Simon.

I shop at Waitrose because of the quality of the fresh fruit, meat, fish and cheese. I pay more and get more. (I also shop at Lidl for some wine and spirits, and at Sainsbury's for everything else.) I don't regard shopping at Waitrose as paying money for nothing.

That doesn't work with cars. I would never buy new; my latest car is three years old, with low mileage and most of its depreciation behind it. If I bought new (as in "shopped at Waitrose") it would have cost a lot more, but the experience of ownership would have been much the same. As far as I'm concerned, buying a new car is a waste of money.

It's not a question of having the money to buy new - I just wouldn't do it.

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Mon 27 Nov 2017 22:06
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

Now then, Simon.

I shop at Waitrose because of the quality of the fresh fruit, meat, fish and cheese. I pay more and get more. (I also shop at Lidl for some wine and spirits, and at Sainsbury's for everything else.) I don't regard shopping at Waitrose as paying money for nothing.

That doesn't work with cars. I would never buy new; my latest car is three years old, with low mileage and most of its depreciation behind it. If I bought new (as in "shopped at Waitrose") it would have cost a lot more, but the experience of ownership would have been much the same. As far as I'm concerned, buying a new car is a waste of money.

It's not a question of having the money to buy new - I just wouldn't do it.

I think you must have misunderstood what i was saying, must be my subtle(?) Scottish sarcasm!.

Movilogo states, "people buy used cars to save money. It really is that simple"

It is not that simple, in fact it is not simple at all. Going by this logic, nobody would buy from Waitrose, at least nobody who bought a 2nd hand car. You prove this not to be the case. To suggest that people only buy 2nd hand cars to save money is nonsense. Yes, there definitely will be some people for whom that is the reason, but there are plenty of people who go down this route for various other reasons, be it to not waste money, because they don't like any current cars or whatever. This has been pointed out by myself earlier on in the thread and by quite a few others.

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Tue 28 Nov 2017 16:34
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - movilogo

I have re-worded my statement as

People buy used cars (when same model is also available to buy as new) to save money. It really is that simple

This covers exceptional cases e.g. buying vintage cars :-) There could other similar fringe cases.

Not to waste money, avoding depreciation etc = same as saving money.

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Tue 28 Nov 2017 18:13
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - klu01dbt

Not just to save money, but also to make owning a car possible.

I've been driving my current car for 6 years. Cost at 2.5 years old £4000 bought for cash, value now sub £1000. Assume its worth nothing now then it has cost me less than £56 per month in depreciation. During that time insurance has varied between £250-£450, i've serviced it myself with twice yearly oil/filter changes and plugs/air filter yearly costing under £50 yearly and generally got an MOT for under £30. Other costs have been a broken clutch pedal (£30), replacement shocks and springs(about £200) a new thermostat (£13), a cam bet and waterpump change (£60) and replacement front brakes (£45). All work done by myself. The exhaust is now sounding a bit fruity and should cost between £60-200 to replace depending on whether I do it myself or get a garage to. Largest cost has been fuel £7278 over 63640 miles.

Over those 6 years I spent time as a student and as a carer with minimal income. A new car at say £200 per month would have cost me £14400 plus fuel and insurance and a deposit and servicing. No way I could have afforded this at the time. I've also learned a lot on how to look after a car and had fun doing so, with a car that if worst came to the worst I wouldn't be too sad to see scrapped or damaged.

When I buy by next car, probably in about 5 years what I want is something really simple that I can afford to replace if I need to and that I can work on myself atleast in part. A new car under warranty would not let me do that, so buying a 2nd hand car allows me to both save money and to play DIY mechanic.

Edited by klu01dbt on 28/11/2017 at 18:16

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Wed 29 Nov 2017 23:09
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - scot22

I'm impressed. both by your financial awareness and practical skills. If I'd had those Of have saved a fortune. Enjoy your motoring.

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Thu 30 Nov 2017 11:34
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - madf

When I buy by next car, probably in about 5 years what I want is something really simple that I can afford to replace if I need to and that I can work on myself atleast in part. A new car under warranty would not let me do that, so buying a 2nd hand car allows me to both save money and to play DIY mechanic.

A very sensible approach. Or buy a 4 year old car with a 1 year maker's warranty left (assuming 5 years from new) and then diy after the year's warrranty has elapsed. So if anything does go wrong after purchase, you are covered.

Did that with our Yaris and Jazz. Makes motoring less risky initially with a used car..

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Fri 1 Dec 2017 16:12
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Enjoy buying cars

Buying used can be great for, saving money, getting that dream car you want, getting older models that you prefer, . What its not great for is the hastle factor and inconvenience.

(Link deleted.)

Edited by Avant on 01/12/2017 at 16:18

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Sun 10 Dec 2017 23:53
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - liammcl

Mine is 20 years old, worth about £80 with a full tank of petrol...

positives... no power steering, no electric windows, no air con, no central locking, noparking sensors, etc etc .
ie old school.. you can feel the road.

I love mine because I have always been cack handed, mechanically,
but I've always wanted to be able to fix cars,
so this is a dream comne true..
as it's so easy to fix, and new parts are so cheap.

I can throw things in the back, eg fridge freezers, ...anything really and not worry about my "precious" car

also, no-one is going to nick it,
& any scratches , dents are a badge of honour.

There's lots of forums where there are detailed instructions to fix absolutely anything.

Depreciation, servicing, repairs , come to £80 a year.

I could understand paying ten of thousands for a car,
if it was some sort of magic carpet, which could shoot to the front in queues,
do 50 in a 30, 160 in a 70...but alas...it's only a car,
which gets me from AA to RAC :)

It starts each and every day, uses no oil or water..
and there's no dramas...
clutch is £50, head gasket is one of the easiest to do £60 etcetc

No chance of a speeding ticket , nor road rage, as I'm too slow to go racing...as so is my car :)

oh, and once in a blue moon, as a treat , I wax it ...using smart price furniture wax 35p

Liam

Edited by liammcl on 11/12/2017 at 00:00

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 08:42
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

Mine is 20 years old, worth about £80 with a full tank of petrol...

positives... no power steering, no electric windows, no air con, no central locking, noparking sensors, etc etc .
ie old school.. you can feel the road.

I love mine because I have always been cack handed, mechanically,
but I've always wanted to be able to fix cars,
so this is a dream comne true..
as it's so easy to fix, and new parts are so cheap.

I can throw things in the back, eg fridge freezers, ...anything really and not worry about my "precious" car

also, no-one is going to nick it,
& any scratches , dents are a badge of honour.

There's lots of forums where there are detailed instructions to fix absolutely anything.

Depreciation, servicing, repairs , come to £80 a year.

I could understand paying ten of thousands for a car,
if it was some sort of magic carpet, which could shoot to the front in queues,
do 50 in a 30, 160 in a 70...but alas...it's only a car,
which gets me from AA to RAC :)

It starts each and every day, uses no oil or water..
and there's no dramas...
clutch is £50, head gasket is one of the easiest to do £60 etcetc

No chance of a speeding ticket , nor road rage, as I'm too slow to go racing...as so is my car :)

oh, and once in a blue moon, as a treat , I wax it ...using smart price furniture wax 35p

Liam

What kind of car have you got Liam?.

Sounds like a great outlook though, so many people in this country view a car as a status symbol as opposed to being a means of getting from A to B.

I watched a mini series with Paul Hollywood a few months ago on the car history and culture of 3 European countries, Italy, Germany and France. The French in particular, don't really care about cars from an image point of view. Just look at the battle scars on cars and parking style in Paris. Paul met up with a presenter of the French equivalent to Top Gear, to get a 'Paris style' parking lesson. Nudging the cars either end of a slightly too small space till there was enough space for the car to fit in!. He also spoke to a French entrepeneur who had built up a business (i think it was a hotel or restaurant), he was worth millions but he drove an old Renault Clio which he'd bought from his mother!.

JK of Jamiroquai is well known for his collection of extravagant and hugely expensive cars, but when he appeared on the most recent series of Top Gear, it was revealed that his every day runabout was a fiat doblo from, i think, around 2005!.

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 14:16
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Engineer Andy

I suppose part of the 'art' of car buying is trying to find a second hand one that you can be reasonably assureed that its been driven and cared for sympathetically, as well as having a well-earned reputation for long term robustness, reliabilty and easy/cheap to maintain and repair (for general wear and tear items [hopefully which last longer than other makes, due to good design]), in addition to achieving or exceeding miminum requirements for the drive, comfort, economy and space/versatility.

Speaking personally, whilst I'm better than I used to be (thanks a lot to this forum and website) at spotting good and bad cars (especially second-hand ones), I must admit to still preferring to buy a brand new (or pre-reg with less than 2k miles), assuming I can get a really good deal, so I can guarantee that it hasn't been abused in any way (even if unconsciously, such as someone using it for short trips only). Given I always try and buy for the long term, depreciation matters less to me than if I were changing my car every 3-5 years, rather than 10+ as I do now. I normally like to hedge my bets a bit by waiting at least a few years once a car has debued for any problems to possibly appear/be rectified, as previously stated.

Sometimes we can be lucky, as Liam has to a degree (with a health dose of common sense and know-how), given his car seems to be quite old indeed, and I have reasonably as well (with help) with my Mazda, and actually I like the challenge to find such a 'gem'.

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 17:35
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - liammcl

@Andy

tbh, within a week of buying my car , the timing belt snapped !
and I had no option but go onto Youtube and follow how to replace the valves etc

It was straightforward, I just took my time, made notes, and took pics.
It cost £20 for a valve and the timing belt...

That was 55,000 miles ago !

There were little niggles along the way, but it really is such a simple car, that driveshafts, exhausts etc , are so cheap £30, and easy to do (half hour) with a few spanners..

If I'm honest, I cannot fault it at all...
I do 12,000 miles a year, and use it as a company car.
It starts each and every day...and if not...a quick google will point me in the right direction.

None of this trapsing to gareges to fix...I'm back on the road within in a few hours..

I do think the older simpler ones have a lot going for them..
and I don't really know why the government haven't banned them completely as a money making execise,
in forcing people to shell out on newer ones.

and as a side note, I fix the technology that auto-technicians use,
so I am not totally anti -tech, but .. I feel the older cars have more sould than some of these newfangled molly coddle the owners.

Saying that , some of these older cars are now tens of thousands, since the demand is growing....and the supply is dwindling !

Cheers
Liam

Edited by liammcl on 11/12/2017 at 17:37

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 17:45
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - gordonbennet

I knew it, your attitude and view of life had me suspicious for a good while, quite apart from your name, Liam..:-), but ''trapsing'' has just confirmed it, i bet my dear old late mum (an Ennis country girl till the day she died) would probably have been able to place your home county, or family home county if you, like me, are English born.

On the car front, when you want something a bit bigger, than the 106, fine and fixable machine though they are, something that can still be fixed with a normal tool kit and common sense, look for a 70 Series Landcruiser, yes still being made but many years since officially imported here.

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 19:42
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - liammcl

@Gordon

haha :)
I am indeed english born...I'm irish from the neck up :)

Funnily enough, I have just got off the phone to my brother
and we were talking about ireland.
I've , as well you could, have gotten an irish (eu) passport .

There could be some good business possiblilities over there...

I may try over there for christmas...not sure wether to go west , near Kerry
or to try near the border for the best of both worlds...

I hear they have guiness and potatoes over there.... my 2 favourite things in life :D

All the very best to you and yours Gordon
and many many thanks for all your help over the years

Cheers
Liam
ps I'll research the 70 series Landcruiser, thanks.
I was also looking at vans...maybe the older ford transit... or so
as it lends itself to man and a van jobs, temp accom whil looking for a place, and courier jobs...

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 19:58
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - gordonbennet

And all the best to you too Liam, you've been a breath of fresh air here among us (mostly) oldies with your hands on real bare knuckle bangernomics, if we've been the smallest of help oe encouragement then we're more than glad to have been so.

Transit sized vans you say, nothing beats a Toyota Hiace for bomb proof, you won't be surprised to learn it usually has Hilux derived Diesel engines.

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 17:25
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - liammcl

@badbusdriver

Hi,
I've a peugeot 106 1.1 .
A cracking little car for getting into tight parking places, too.

and quite handy for moving things about
ibb.co/evwZhw

A fun car to srice too, it's like a go cart

Cheers
Liam

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 18:39
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

@badbusdriver

Hi,
I've a peugeot 106 1.1 .
A cracking little car for getting into tight parking places, too.

and quite handy for moving things about
ibb.co/evwZhw

A fun car to srice too, it's like a go cart

Cheers
Liam

Excellent choice Liam!.

I love small cars anyway, but i have a particular liking for the little pug.

Through working at various garages and dealerships in over the course of about 15 years i had the opportunity to drive some pretty tasty and fast cars for the day, but the journeys which stick in my mind most are ones taken in small light cars with very little power!

One of these happened while working at the Peugeot dealership in Wigan in about 1995 and involved a basic bottom of the range 106. This was the 954cc version, with manual windows and mirrors, no central locking and no power steering. It was a very wet day and i had to collect it from a rural country location. It was an absolute hoot wringing out every one of its 45bhp over the narrow and twisting country roads, the size and lack of weight more than compensating for the lack of power!.

A few years later, the car hire company i was working for in Aberdeen recieved 6 106 diesels. This was the 1.5 version that replaced the earlier 1.4. I thought they were great little things. Surprisingly nippy and surprisingly 'revvy' for a n/a diesel, though i must confess they did have power steering(!)

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Mon 11 Dec 2017 19:46
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - liammcl

I do know what you mean badbusdriver

there is a sense of harmony when a little car and yourself are driving near to your limits.

Great fun.

It's almost the missing link between a coco0ned new car, and a motorbike
you are aware of the surroundings , and have to treat them withrespect.

Cheers
Liam
ps 106ers have started beeping each other round here when they pass
the brotherhood of pugs :)
pps also, it is great for playing chicken down a car parked road, as the new shiny drivers give way to my rust bucket coming thru :)

Edited by liammcl on 11/12/2017 at 19:49

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Wed 13 Dec 2017 15:09
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - fredthefifth

I love the auto hold and EPB on my 2013 Passat which I bought at 6 months old cos I couldnt afford a new one.

However ..... been thinking about replacement and the new car quotes for a Passat that I have had through CarWow have been on a par with the nearly new prices at VW dealerships.

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Wed 13 Dec 2017 23:42
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Avant

Agreed, Fred V. VWs and (even more so) Audis hold their value well, and thus nearly-new ones aren't usually very tempting. And if you go for a PCP, the retention of value can lead to a good deal.

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 00:53
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - SteveLee

I'm lucky to be able to (within reason) afford any car I want - and yet it wouldn't enter my head to buy a new car unless it was a cheap supermini or something similar. It's not a case of saving money or looking for reason to justify "used" - it's a case of not wasting perfectly good money for absolutely no return - buying new requires far more justification - a fully serviced three to four year old petrol car will generally give you four to five years of practically fault-free motoring - more if you're lucky - a four year old car will cost 25-45% of its original retail value - I tend to go for large-engined autos which usually mean they are the heavy depreciators. They are also under-stressed and less likely to be thrashed (through sheer opportunity!) IMHO buying new cars really is a mug's game. If the new car thing gives you immense pleasure - then fair enough - it's worth it to you - I just don't care about that side of car ownership! Fewer and fewer people buy cars anyway, fixed costs and the must-have-it-now mentallity of the current generation means leasing starts to look attractive.

Talking of leasing, a friend of the family just leased an Audi Q7 - their justification was the "horrific depreciation" of their last car, indeed, their old Peugeot lost 50% of its value in four years - a loss of £6000 - but - the car they lease costs £400 PCM - that's just shy of £20K in four years with NOTHING to show for it at the end of the plan - and should the main breadwinner lose thier job - the £400 per month commitment will soon drain their finances (typical one pay packet from poverty modern couple) putting their house at risk - a purchased second-hand car will still be a salable asset which might fund the mortgage for a few months to get them over the hump. Of course, when turning up in "thier" shiny new Audi the man scoffed "Still got that old Lexus?" - Ahh you mean "that" (MY!) Lexus I paid £8K cash for, which has given me four years and 50,000 fault-free miles and is still probably worth 50% of my original modest outlay? Over the same period "your" Q7 will have probably broken down at least twice and will have cost you £20K and left you with nowt - or worse - if there's any significant visible damage and/or mileage penalties due - you'll have to scrape a few grand together just to give the thing back or be forced to purchase the car at an inflated price! (which you can't afford to do anyway coz you've just wasted 20 grand) - yes, I'm crushed! No, I just don't get the attraction. Horses for courses I guess.

Motorcycles on the other hand - I usually buy new - as unknown faults can easily prove fatal on two wheels - plus depreciation is less of a factor.

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 10:14
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - Manatee

Where can I lease a Q7 for £400 a month? £700 is nearer the mark.

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 10:31
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - badbusdriver

I was thinking that was pretty cheap (unless a huge deposit was involved), I seem to remember a customer of mine telling me that she was paying more than £400 per month for an A3!. And that was a couple of years ago.

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 13:01
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - KB.

When I'm sitting in my my car, maybe having dropped the good lady off to do some shopping for example, I get the chance to watch others coming and going ... getting parked up in supermarket bays or trying to parallel park in the high street.

And I won't say that women or old men wearing some form of hat are the worst - because that would be unacceptable, wouldn't it? ... but as I'm watching the world go by I see clutches being madly slipped coz the driver hasn't got the hang of clutch control ... steering racks and tyres being strained as the driver takes full advantage of power steering allowing them to apply full lock whilst stationary ... bumpers taking little knocks coz they're not quite sure where their car starts and ends. And elsewhere I see speedbumps being used as a challenge to see whether they can get the car to take off for a few feet.

I see reports of stolen cars being offered for sale, damage being badly repaired, outstanding finance not being sorted before the car's offered for sale.

And I constantly see people boasting that when you hire a car it's obligatory to see how much tyre spin can be achieved along with checking to see how well the engine revs at maximum rpm before it explodes.

Generally speaking, when you pick up a new car the opportunities for abuse are limited to the few miles it's been driven on and off the ship and the transporter.

And since we still have freedom of choice regarding what we do with our income I'll stick with new.

Edited by KB. on 14/12/2017 at 13:03

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 17:09
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - JEREMYH

I dont buy used cars to save money

What am I saving ?

I have no intention of spending more than 1K on a car but I am a petrol head and love cars I have my own small workshop do my own work on the cars and dont go to a gargae unless completly stuck

LETS GET THIS RIGHT THOUGH

How can I be saving money if I did not buy a new car in the first place ?

I think cars are a waste of money ful stop but I love them

I have a Saab turbo convertible that I resuced from scrap and a Totyota Privia people carrier that is 17 years old and my daily driver

AM I POOR ? Am I hell ?

I dont spend any money on cars so I can spend on my house holidays ect ect or keep it in the bank In fact I have more money than my mates and neighbours as I dont waste it on buying new cars !

This is the reason to buy used cars and I will also add that most people running new cabt actully afford to buy them

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 20:19
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - SteveLee

Where can I lease a Q7 for £400 a month? £700 is nearer the mark.

I know nothing about the cost of leasing - never looked into it - that's the figure he told me - which it appears was a fib because he knows my attitude to leasing and/or that's what he told the wife!

Given that he needed a loan off me when his boiler broke down 6 months ago I doubt that he had funds tfor a large deposit!

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 21:05
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - JEREMYH

Its a bit sad if thats what you want

You could have three holidays a year in the med for that

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Thu 14 Dec 2017 21:22
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - KB.

"Its a bit sad if thats what you want

You could have three holidays a year in the med for that


Honestly not sure which post the above is in response to, but is it just, vaguely, possible that not EVERYONE regards three holidays in the Med as the yardstick by which the good life is universally measured?

Edited by KB. on 14/12/2017 at 21:23

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Fri 15 Dec 2017 07:47
Any - Reasons to buy used cars - JEREMYH

Its a lot better than sitting in traffic in a Q7 thats on the knock

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