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Tue 5 Mar 2013 16:06

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - danielbanks

Hi All

Any help would be useful as this is new to me.

I test drove a Smart Car on the Sunday 24th Feb and it seemed fine. Only drove it for about 5 minutes as there was no petrol in it. 2007, 52,000 miles. I put a £300 deposit and would collect it on Monday

Paid the money, £3,700, on Monday and drove back home about 50miles in total. Started the car Tuesday and the engine came on. I booked the car into a mercedes specialist garage on wednesday and its been in there untill now. There is low compression in one of the cyclinders and an engine rebuild is the only option as all other possibilies have been checked. I have confirmed this with a smart car specialist who came to the same conclusion. The works will cost between £1000-£1500.

I have contacted the dealer who I purchased this off and he was very abusive down the phone and said there is no warrenty on the car and hung up.
After leaving him to cool off, and while I was doing some research on the sales of goods act and speaking to the advice line, I then phoned the dealer again. I explained that he should pay for the repair or I will accept a full refund. This time he got threating and said there's nothing they can do so contact who you like.

I have wrote all this in a recorded delivery letter and am waiting a response. I have a strong feeling he will not response to any letters I send him.

I would of course like to avoid going to court but what do you think my chances would be if this would happen?

Many Thanks in advance

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Tue 5 Mar 2013 19:17

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - tony g

Hi Daniel
Engine failure on the smart is a regular occurrence at 60k.

However that's just an observation ,and nothing to do with you case .Given that you have asked the dealer to repair the car and he's refused ,and that smart cars suffer from engine failure ,your best option is to go for a full refund .

If you paid with a credit or debit card your card company can recover the money from the dealer for you ,contact them ASAP .

If you paid by cash or cheque you need to use the small claims court ,download a copy of the application forms ,fill them in and send a copy to the dealer .Include a letter stating that if he doesn't refund you the full amount you paid ,you will begin the SCC process ,which will cost him an extra £300 .

You will definitely win your case ,the only issue will be if the dealer has funds to pay you .ultimately the court can send bailiffs to seize his goods if he doesn't refund your purchase price plus the expense you incurred in taking him to the SCC .

Good luck and please let the forum know the outcome ,your experience will help others .

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Tue 5 Mar 2013 19:57

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - Armitage Shanks {p}

Additionally

during the first six months:

The consumer returns the goods in the first six months from the date of sale and requests a repair or replacement or a partial refund. In that case, the consumer does not have to prove the goods were faulty at the time of sale. It is assumed that they were. If the retailer does not agree, it is for the retailer to prove that the goods were satisfactory at the time of sale. This comes from Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002, derived from EU Directive 1999/44/EU which became Clauses 48A to 48F inclusive of the Sale of Goods act in April 2003

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Wed 3 Apr 2013 18:42

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - danielbanks

Thank you for the reply it helped me very much and put me at some ease. And helped with reading into the sales of good act.

Just an update, in case anyone is in a similar situation.

I have sent two reordered delivery letters and an email but no response. So 5 weeks I think is a long enough time to give them opportunity to resolve the issue. So I have just filled out the forms and paid the fee to have a claim against him via the court.

Hopefully this will all go in my favour if it goes to court.

Many Thanks again

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Wed 3 Apr 2013 22:10

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - wires13

Good luck and hopefully bailiffs can find items of value if needed, i was in a similar situation some years ago owed £2000 for a new engine and gearbox after a disastrous attempt at fixing it. Bailiffs went in but they had nothing of value so i didnt recoup anything sadly. Good luck again....

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Mon 13 May 2013 13:12

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - danielbanks

Another update...a month later.

As they was not responding to my letters. Trading standards sent me the address of the registered office for the limited company. That was the last of their input.

Using MCOL, all the court letters went to the resisted trading address but there was no response. Judgement issued then entered. Warrant enforce issued then entered. This process took about 5 weeks.

After 7 days when the warrant enforcement (court bailiffs) where they are meant to update me but never I chased the courts. They put me in touch with the bailiff. The bailiff said the address given was an empty property and nothing of value would be there. He then called the defendant warning him of the judgement against him, to which he started auguring about warranty to him.

Seeing that as a dead end, some-one has suggested using 'The Sheriff’s Office'. I have contacted these people and they seem to know a lot about court processes and their bailiff procedure. I have filled out the forms for them and sent my judgement certificate. I also explained the address situation which they said was fine (and sadly common) as they will go to many addresses.

Just wondering if anyone has debt recovered by this company or heard of them? They have a show on the BBC coming in the New Year.

Also, if anyone knows if it’s legal to have a limited company registered to an address which is not actually in use. If the limited company complain they never received any documents, sure it’s their fault for supplying a ‘fake’ address.

Many Thanks again…hope someone finds my story useful in someway.

(Think I could write a book about this whole saga!)

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Mon 13 May 2013 14:05

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - nortones2

Surely the bailiffs are not limited to action on the registered premises only? Quite common for the brass plate to be an accountants address. The physical assets are at the real business premises.....

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Mon 13 May 2013 16:15

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - danielbanks

You would think so. I also added alternative address of the showroom. The court bailiff said he would go to the showroom however I have not heard nothing back.

I have been told that the court bailiffs are pretty useless as they have no power and have already been paid via the court. So they can turn up and say they tried and that’s it.

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Mon 13 May 2013 16:44

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - Bromptonaut

The Court's bailiffs are, for now, employees of Her Majesty's Courts and Tribunal Service. They're salaried staff but that doesn't mean they're not managed and working to targets etc. Thjey are undergoing a review/reform process leading to possible partnership with commercial bodies.

There's an HMCTS leaflet that exaplains Bailiff powers etc:

http://hmctscourtfinder.justice.gov.uk/HMCTS/GetLeaflet.do?court_leaflets_id=261

If you're not getting the feedback form the inidivdual bailff than ask for the Bailiff Manager or regional Enforcement Manager.

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Thu 16 May 2013 00:03

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - focussed

And any assets, equipment, tools, vehicles etc could quite possibly be owned by self-employed "sub-contractors" who operate the business and the limited company doesn't own any assets, or everything is rented or on HP or lease. Quite common on the fringes of the building trade.

It's beginning to look like "you can't get blood out of a stone" time.

It's one thing to get a judgement against a company, enforcing it is next to impossible if the company goes broke, liquidated etc.

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Thu 16 May 2013 22:24

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - galileo

And any assets, equipment, tools, vehicles etc could quite possibly be owned by self-employed "sub-contractors" who operate the business and the limited company doesn't own any assets, or everything is rented or on HP or lease. Quite common on the fringes of the building trade.

It's beginning to look like "you can't get blood out of a stone" time.

It's one thing to get a judgement against a company, enforcing it is next to impossible if the company goes broke, liquidated etc.

Unless you know where the owner lives and have large friends with balaclavas and baseball bats.

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Wed 22 May 2013 00:32

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - focussed

And any assets, equipment, tools, vehicles etc could quite possibly be owned by self-employed "sub-contractors" who operate the business and the limited company doesn't own any assets, or everything is rented or on HP or lease. Quite common on the fringes of the building trade.

It's beginning to look like "you can't get blood out of a stone" time.

It's one thing to get a judgement against a company, enforcing it is next to impossible if the company goes broke, liquidated etc.

Unless you know where the owner lives and have large friends with balaclavas and baseball bats.

Sounds like the express route to A & E or crown court to me.

Sometimes situations like these are like the lyrics from that song by Kenny Rogers:-

"You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em,

Know when to walk away, know when to run"

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Wed 22 May 2013 13:23

Smart Fortwo - Faulty Car after day 2...My chances in small court - Rats

Sometimes situations like these are like the lyrics from that song by Kenny Rogers:-
"You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em,

Know when to walk away, know when to run"

Very true, but that is often the premise these types work on, expecting you to give in, but, if you have the nerve to, then take them all the way........I did with a bathroom fitter, he must have been convinced I would give up, but no, I stayed right to the end and got my money out of him. I would have been prepared to sell the debt to a debt collection agency for a penny just to see him out of pocket!

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