Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car?

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Mon 3 Oct 2011 11:33
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Smee1976

Hi

About a year ago I traded in my car at a small car sales garage and posted the trader bit of the V5 off to the dvla. A couple of weeks later we moved house, but never thought any more about it. Last week we have received a letter from a bailiff company saying we have a £250 fine for not telling the dvla we had sold the vehicle to a motor trader plus £75 costs. Looks like they may have just traced us to our new address, but I have never before heard of a fine for not telling them we had sold the vehicle. I have heard of fines for not sorning, and for fines for the new keeper if the dvla never got our notice of selling, but this appears to be a fine just for not telling them we had sold the vehicle (even though we did post it). Is there anything we can do on this, as we genuinely did send the notice off, and this is the first we have heard of the magistrates court order they say they have.

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Mon 3 Oct 2011 15:56
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Cris_on_the_gas

Think it does say on the form that you should get an acknowledgement when you tell them anbd to contact them if you had not heard in about 4 weeks.

looks like the system went wrong and you bin fined. Seems like they are in the right and yuu'll have to pay up

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Mon 3 Oct 2011 16:23
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - geoff1248

Please note that it is not a legal requirement for you to chase up DVLA if they do not notify you that they have received your notification of change.

You are only required to post the notification off to DVLA and your statutory requirement has then been completed. It is then up to DVLA to prove that you didn't post it off NOT for you to prove that you did.

I suggestthat you do a bit more Googling and you will see what happens if DVLA do take you to court. You may be suprised....

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Mon 3 Oct 2011 17:31
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Bobbin Threadbare

That surprises me as the DVLA are usually fairly decent (in comparison to many other regularoty/governmental/legal groups).

Have a read of this: www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/watchdog/2010/05/dvla_in_the_d...l

Especially the bit about the biker called Duncan. Looks like your situation!

Also: forums.pepipoo.com/lofiversion/index.php/t48973.ht...l

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Tue 4 Oct 2011 16:15
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Dwight Van Driver

To some extent this worries me as it is not the first case I have heard of.

If on the sale of a car one has complied with the instructions of VC5 or sent a letter to DVLA notifying them of sale of vehicle then the law IMHO has been complied with.

The if no acknowledgement contact DVLA has no authority at law in fact the case of Duncan Peek at Horsham County Court in April 2010 it was stated that DVLA had NO STATUTORY POWER for anyone to ring them. Likewise in the case James COLLINS in October 2009 (http://www.tinyurl,com/3xnrdme) ( Liquid Knights long post) at Clerkenham District Court one had not to prove to DVLA that letter re SORN sent. Up to DVLA to prove otherwise.

Whilst there is statutory authority to impose an £80 surcharge if after 1 months expiration of RFL SORN is not declared - no Court involved, I do not know of the statutory authority for DVLA to impose a fine regarding the offence of failing to notify change of ownership. Such a fine can only IMHO be levied after a Couit case. Neither am I aware that DVLA can issue a FPN for this offence.

If anyone can update me where they get this authority in the letter of the law I would be obliged.

In the meantime I have written to DVLA for clarification. Will they write back?????????

DVD

Edited by Dwight Van Driver on 04/10/2011 at 16:20

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Thu 6 Oct 2011 15:13
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Dwight Van Driver

As suspected reply received this date in which they fudge the question I posed as to what authority they have to fine for failing to notify without the case going befote a Court.

Their letter ends .......asmatters of the law remain for the Courts to decide......

Have sent them another mail to clariy the SPECIFIC question I pose.

I am aware that in the case of FPN issued for a non endorseable offnce ( which this is) and the receiptient does not respond in the time limit then it is automatically recorded as a fine which could lead to the baliffs being involved.

dvd

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Tue 25 Oct 2011 15:36
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Dwight Van Driver

As promised I contacted DVLA about this and have today received their reply which basically states the 'fine' is an offer of an out of Court settlement in relation to the offence of failing to notify change of ownership.

My reply:

"'Whereas the The Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) (Amendment) (No. 3) Regulations 2003 authorises by statute, the imposition of an 80 pound supplement in relation to late taxation of a vehicle, there is (IMHO) no corresponding statutory authority for DVLA to impose a 'fine' for failing to notify change of ownership and for any penalty to be paid in respect of this offence it has to be imposed after a conviction of Guilt by a Magistrates Court.

I appreciate that DVLA appear to be offering an 'out of Court settlement' in some cases where the law has been complied with but DVLA records are at fault for not properley recording and thereby browbeating the receipient into accepting rather than entering a Not Guilty plea at Court and no fine."

.. and with that I leave the matter to rest.

dvd

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Tue 8 Nov 2011 14:02
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Red&Bold

Why do they not word is as such then? it sickens me that a government body would rather use the word "Fine" to trick the poor unsuspecting motorist into believing that they have no option but to pay rather then an "out of court" settlement. which, after much effort from DVD, they have admitted to.

Thankyou for persisting with this thread DVD so that more of us are now aware of the risks that dealing with the DVLA can bring.

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Fri 30 Dec 2011 14:33
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - kyle86

Hi

i have just recived a £250 fine as above for a van i sold in early 2010 i am 99% sure i send off the relivent documents but now im in court for non payment of fines of which i new nothing about. after reading the information you have given im thinking maybe its not my fault. Should i plead not guilty to owing the money or would these lead to further charges?.

if you could guide me in the right direction it would be much appreciated.

thankyou

kyle.

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Fri 30 Dec 2011 14:47
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Dwight Van Driver
WEho has imposed the

Edited by Dwight Van Driver on 30/12/2011 at 14:50

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Fri 30 Dec 2011 18:43
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - thunderbird

Got fine for allegedly not SORNing my car. Wrote them a letter saying it had been sent, and they cancelled fine. Mate was fined for not SORNing his when tax ran out, bit difficult because he was in Hong Kong dealing with a family emergency, he still has to pay. Must depend on who you get when you contact them. Worth a try.

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Sat 31 Dec 2011 07:32
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - Dwight Van Driver

Kyle86

I'll try again - yesterdays attempt could not be accepted.

The offence of failing to notify is on the statute books with a fine as a punishment. This fine has to be awared at a Court. As far as I am aware it cannot be dealt with by a Fixed Penalty Notice - even that if contested has to have the authjority of a Court to impose a fine.

As I mentioned in my earlier post ^^^^^^ DVLA do not have the authority to impose this fine only a Court can do so. It would seem DVLA may well be trying a new protocol in mentioning an out of Court settlement' type of fine. Where they get this authority from beats me. They do have the power to take a case to a Court for failing to notify when a fine can be imposed.

I am also at loss to understand how come a fine of £250 for an offence normally attracting just under 3 figures.

Is this 'fine' imposed by DVLA or Magistrates Court?. If the later then one should have received a summons and other paperwork.

Or is also for use of a vehicle without an Excise Licence where the peanlty is more in line with £250?.

dvd
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Mon 2 Jan 2012 10:21
Fine by DVLA for not informing them I sold my car? - oldroverboy

Very SIMPLE way of dealing with all the above problems with DVLA, write a note with the document you are sending. keep a copy,and send either recorded delivery, 75p, or get proof of postage FREE, or if it is urgent send special delivery, (yes it's a fiver) and if you call and say you have one of the above proofs they will believe you, but they have a record of the 2 payable services. worked for me when they said they hadn't received my driving licence.

Edited by OldRoverboy on 02/01/2012 at 10:22

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