I purchased a new Ford Galaxy TDI 115bhp in May 2001. I am very pleased overall with the vehicle - except for one thing.
The vehicle is fiited with the VAG 6 speed gearbox which is very pleasing to use once the car has warmed up, usually over a distance of 4 to 5 miles from cold, unfortunately, until then I find that the gear change from 1st to 2nd tends to 'grate'. I have tried adding an additive to the gearbox oil but it has made no real difference.I assume that the reason for this is that until high revs have been achieved,then the gearbox oil will not have reached all parts of the box? Ford dealers say it is 'within tolerance' but for a vehicle of this price I do not accept this as a valid explanation!
Can anyone out there shed any light on this annoying 'fault'
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I don't know what the level of acceptability is but it is an unconventional box;effectively two sets of intermediate ratios and two final drives-the gear lever selects bits of each to give six forward ratios-the ones I've driven have had an acceptable change but not as smooth as a conventional 4 or 5-speed.
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Whatever you do, don't tell Ford about the additive. I think you just invalidated your warranty....
Richard Hall
bangernomics.tripod.com
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Hi Richard
Thanks for your comments re: Ford warranty but needless to say that the vehicle was imported from Belgium and I didn't add the gearbox oil additive until after the world-wide 12 month Ford warranty was up. As you will probably know, the 2nd and 3rd year warranties are offered by the Ford dealer who supplied the vehicle,as this was from a dealer in Belgium I do not consider it viable to return the vehicle with any problems at this stage.
regards, Bryan
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Bryan,
I mentioned in this forum some weeks back that I use synthetic oil in the gearbox of my Triumph 2500. The gearchange is fast and smooth right from cold, which I'm fairly sure would not be the case with conventional mineral oil in this old-fashioned gearbox. The difference between the two oils is that the viscosity of synthetic oil doesn't reduce so much with rise in temperature so a grade that is already thin at low temperature can be used.
I don't know if synthetic oil is suitable for your Galaxy but an oil manufacturer should be able to tell you, and advise the most suitable grade.
Regarding oil additives, this subject has been discussed here before in some depth and I believe the concensus is that they can do more harm than good. This is certainly my own view.
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Dizzy,
The scathing comments often, and probably justifiably, directed at oil additives, are surely mostly concerned with Engine oil.
Am using Molyslip Gearbox additive with fully synthetic transmission oil in my Jap manual box and can certainly notice the improvement in driveability. Hard to imagine too that its going to have any real detrimental effect on the mechanics in this application.
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Low friction additives used not to be recommended for gearboxes because they made the synchomesh-which relies on friction-less effective.Can you still get Molycodl-it was a blend of moybdenum disulphide and colloidal graphite.
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I haven't come across Molycodl ; what a lovely golden-age sounding name. But if, as you say, jc, some friction is necessary in a synchromesh gearbox,then I probably wouldn't want to seek out an additive containing graphite.
Molyslip on their website just mention the MoS2, they don't say that their transmission product contains graphite. It probably does, though, because it turns the gearbox oil completely ....black! ..No, Johnny...!!
All I can report is that, as they say, it works for me.
It is a significant improvement over the unadorned Amsoil "GL2 thru GL5", which in turn was better than the factory fill.
Maybe because I had a problem gearbox in the first place.
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Am I missing something here, LeZebre? You wouldn't want to use an additive containing graphite in your synchromesh gearbox if some friction is necessary (which it certainly is) yet you are happy with using other friction-reducing additives! I don't follow your reasoning.
Obviously you need to lubricate the sliding and meshing parts of the gearbox but synchromesh depends on a very controlled friction between the synchro cones - to synchronise the speed of the pair of gears that are about to be brought into engagement - and this can be drastically upset if the lubricity of the oil isn't exactly as designed.
Incidentally, MoS2 (molybdenum disulphide) compounds always seem to be black but graphite doesn't come into it so far as I am aware, otherwise there would be a 'C' for carbon somewhere in the equation.
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Hi Dizzy,
Well you see, I`ve only recently learned of the rather complicated oil requirements of synchromesh gearboxes which you explain. I'm sticking to my view that transmission additives are going to do much less harm to the car than engine oil additives. However, as a result of this thread, if I hadn't already put the moly in the gearbox, then I wouldn't be adding it.
Which would be a pity, because it really does seem to have worked! As I say, maybe that`s on account of there having been a bit of a problem with the shift before.
getting back to Bryan`s Galaxy, I`d be surprised if Redline Oil don`t make an oil that would suit. They certainly make oils formulated specifically for synchro gearboxes, rather than the less expensive oils which are often used, but which may well have been originally formulated for engines, autoboxes, or rear axles.
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LeZebre,
Thanks for not ticking me off for what might have seemed an arrogant response (but wasn't meant to be). I'm pleased that moly seems to have worked for you. If it was going to give trouble I expect it would have done so quite quickly, however I'd still be inclined to go back to non-adulterated oil.
Regarding your comment about oils formulated specifically for synchro gearboxes: Presumably these oils are not intended for cars like the old Minis and some Peugeots that are designed for engine oil in their gearboxes, nor others that are designed specifically to have automatic transmission fluid in their (manual) gearboxes. I assume that the special oils you mentioned are intended only for gearboxes that were designed for gear oil.
You may know that there have been other queries in this forum and elsewhere relating to problem gear-changing and the gearbox oil always comes under suspicion because it is so easy for the wrong stuff to be put in, especially gear oil in a gearbox designed for engine oil. I find it hard to understand why modern cars should have gear-changing troubles when the correct oil has been used - What happened to progress?
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Hi LeZebre,
Yes you are right, what did happen to progress? I have been driving for 25 years now I am am amazed that the quality of gear-changes on modern day vehicles does not appear to be significantly improved over time.
Bryan
ps tanks for all your replies so far.
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Recently acquired a Peugeot with a BE3 gearbox that was notchy between 1st and second when cold, but was fine when warmed up. I drained the gearbox oil and refilled with semi-synthetic 75W80 grade gear oil (£12 for 2 litres). Result: no more notchiness when cold and smoother gearchange when warm.
The oil that came out was more viscous than the stuff I put in (both were at the same temperature) and I suspect that it was a monograde i.e. EP80 or 90.
My personal opinion is that gearbox and engine additives are no substitute for good quality lubricants and regular changes.
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Bats
I was very interested to read your comments, the symptoms you discribe are identical to what I am experiencing - notchy 1st to 2nd change, fine when warm. The air temperature has a direct effect on the gearchange aswell ie when the car has been on the drive for a couple of hours in the sunshine on a warm sunny day, the gearchange can be vastly improved even form cold so I am convinced that it is the transmission oil that is at fault!
Tell me more about your choice of replacement oil. On contacting Ford to try to find out more about the grade already installed they said it was 'a one-off' grade designed presumably for this particular 6 speed box. If this is the case then do you think it will do any harm trying the oil that you used? - did you use the replacement grade on recommendation or off your own bat! - [excuse the pun]. Incidently, the small amount of oil I drained to subsitute with the Slick 50 additive seem very viscous so in theory you would have thought that it would have been fluid enough to effect a smooth gear change even from cold!.
If I do decide to go the complete oil change route, if anyone reading this knows the amount of oil required to refill this box,[other than measuring what comes out], I would be greatful for the info.
Bye for now.
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PS Bats
Is a BE3 box anything special?
Bryan
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Bats ... I'm not familiar with the BE3 box. The Peugeot/Citroen gearboxes that I knew used engine oil. You said that the old oil in your BE3 box might have been an EP 80 or 90. Is that what the makers specified, or was this another case of a gearbox being filled with gear oil instead of engine oil? I would also be interested to know how you selected the particular grade of synthetic oil that you opted for. I hope you don't mind these questions - they are all in aid of science!
Bryan ... a higher viscosity oil is likely to make gearchanging more difficult, not more easy, since the synchro sleeves must squeeze the oil out from between them before one can grip the other, metal to metal, and so commonise the speed of the gears that they are connected to.
You said to Bats: "...do you think it will do any harm trying the oil that you used?". Please, Bryan, do not go down the 'try it and see' route! As I indicated earlier, different gearboxes are designed for different oils (engine oil, gear oil, diff oil, ATF oil) and the selection of an alternative requires great care. A too thin OR too thick oil can destroy the mechanical parts and once a too thick oil has been put in, it can be very difficult to completely remove it. Likewise, or worse, to remove an MoS2 additive!
I wonder if there is a Galaxy technical advice website that you could go to for information on your problem. Or you could try asking a reputable oil manufacturer for their recommendation.
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Bryan:
I should think you local Ford dealer's parts desk would advise you of the recommended quantity of oil?
Andy
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