I've had my current Passat TDI 115 PD estate (sport trim) since new in 2000 (pre-face lift) and am looking to change within the next 6 to 12 months.
I really like my Passat (the fuel economy has averaged over 50mpg throughout its life), but I am not at all attracted to the new model. It looks too big and to "Americanised" with all the chrome trim etc. I also do not particularly like the look of the Audi A4 Avant. A Merc. C class estate is quite appealing, but is probably a bit too pretentious for my job (I'm a self employed specialist electronic engineer and work on-site a lot) and the smaller diesels are not over fuel efficient. I do not like the look of the BMW 3 series. The Honda Accord diesel has fantastic reviews, but the estate is REALLY ugly (IMO).
So today by chance, I see the new Civic in a Honda showroom and all of a sudden I think "do I need all the space that my current Passat offers"?
I probably carry too much stuff around that I don't need on a day to day basis and I could always use a roof rack on the odd occasions that the kids bikes need to be transported!
Does anyone else agree with my sentiments (or otherwise).
The new Civic really is a looker and I've owned their motorbikes for almost 30 years with no major problems.
Do you think I'll miss the space by downsizing from the Passat?
Replies on a postcard please:-))
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What an interesting question:
I've driven big - ish motors for years, and often thought of downsizing, but never had the balls for it, in case I don't like smaller cars.
Will be interested to hear from people who have made the step!
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Nice car, I have to say. What about the Bora ? A smart car by any standards, more exclusive than many, It looks like a minature Mondeo only classier.
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The Bora is not a hatchback, (the next best alternative to an estate) so is not practical.
But thanks for the advice.
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You might be pleasantly surprised by the space in the Civic - get a salesman to demonstrate the clever stuff it does with it's seats to provide a flat base and masses of space.
I'd love one, but the only ones with the good Honda diesel engines are the 2.2 ones and they came out too expensive for me.
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Does anyone else agree with my sentiments (or otherwise).
As you asked, It's in the eye of the beholder but I think the Accord estate is positively elegant compared with Civic which is radical looking but more than a little unbalanced and heavy, especially from the rear 3/4 aspect.
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Try one and make sure you can live with the appalling rear visibility. There is an unnecessary spoiler which makes things even worse, and this is probably the first hatchback since the base model Mark 1 Fiesta not to have a bidet (rear wash-wipe). Presumably water doesn't collect on the move, but it still does when the car is parked. And with the Fiesta you could at least have it as an extra.
Appearance is a subjective thing but my impression is that visibility (and therefore safety - you are more likely to hit an unseen child when reversing than in, say, your Passat estate) has been sacrificed on the altar of that nebulous concept called style. That's not a sacrifice I would be willing to make (nor would SWMBO - her current Civic is her last).
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The Audi A2 doesn't have a rear wash wipe due to a similar spoiler arrangement to the Civic. They do get in the way and the area of glass under the spoiler (which on the A2 is what you look out of most of the time) gets very dirty, very quickly. A good dose of Rainex helps to move the water, but regular cleaning is the norm especially over the winter.
As for the the Civic being nicer looking than the Accord if I wore specs you could borrow them! I've seen a few Civics now and in my eyes it will never be a looker (but I like and owned an the A2 plenty of people say the same about them!!).
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Nick, you seem to be thinking of downsizing because you haven't found a medium sized estate that you're happy with. The Mazda6 isn't on your list - is it just that you hadn't thought of it, or is there a reason for it not to be there? Supposed to be a very user-friendly and practical design, and IMO looks far better than the Accord estate - or any other new estate I can think of, I think the only competitors in terms of looks would have been the previous Audi Avants (A4 and A6).
--
andymc
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...
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In Germany, the different Passat trim ranges (trendline etc.) have differing amounts of chrome - in particular the window surrounds. There is also an "Individual" option with dark chrome which may be more to your liking. Not sure if this is available in the UK.
BIG
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Funny thing - I started off quite liking the look of the new Civic but find the allure rapidly dimming. Japanese designs have an odd characteristic of looking very stylish for a couple of years, then suddenly seeming dated and contrived. I feel the Civic might be one of these - that see-through plastic 'grille' reminds me of the old Citroen SM and a bit style-for-style's sake. Euro designs are often more conservative but age better.
Having said all of that the Honda is probably bullet-proof reliable and the engine smoother than the VW equivalent.
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I think the front aspect is the best part of the Civic, I liked the Citroen SM even though it really was a pink fluffy dice in the true sense of the word.
Although the new 2.0TDI offering from VAG is smoother than the old 1.9 units, the Honda 2.2 diesel is on a different plane completely as regards smoothness.
As regards Euro/Japanese styling, some cars just age a lot better than their peers, from the Euro camp I'd nominate a pre-facelift Citroen Xantia, doesn't look dated now. For the Japanese I'd nominate a MK1 Mazda MX5 - timeless.
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I think the MX5 scores for longevity here because its styling is restrained - uncharacteristically so. Too often Japanese makers (possibly other orientals too) come up with a car that looks pretty decent then go and spoil it by adding tasteless trim details and vulgar styling touches.
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Too often Japanese makers (possibly other orientals too) come up with a car that looks pretty decent then go and spoil it by adding tasteless trim details and vulgar styling touches.
Thats one of the reasons i don't like the Mazda 6 - the lexus look rear lights look really cheap and tacky in my opinion.
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Still a great value for money car though.
Latest Mondeo's have now gone a bit ott on chrome trime, again very noticeable on the rear lights. IMHO this has completely spoilt the very clean understated look that previous Mondeo's had.
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Thanks for all the comments.
What I really want if I'm honest with myself, is the Honda 2.2 diesel engine in a car that I am attracted too!
The Accord saloon is okay (quite nice even) but I really need a hatchback at least (in lieu of an estate) and the Accord estate (IMHO) is awfull to look at. When you are spending upwards of £20-£25K, you need to be happy when you look at it every morning.
I don't know how Honda's sales figures are looking for the new Civic, but I have been on a 400 mile round trip today and not seen any...........that can't be good news?
I'm also being contradictory regarding the styling, as the new Civic has plenty of fake "chrome", it just seems to work better than on other models. Most of the Japanese cars (Mazda's included) have really "tacky" looking rear light clusters. The new Saab 9-3 estate also suffers from this problem in spades! Indeed the Saab 9-3 is exactly the same as the Accord.....nice saloon......horrible estate.
Help somebody, what should I buy, (good job I'm not in a rush)?
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*cough* Rover 75 Estate *cough*
Think it was in the Telegraph that you can still get them new. Worth a look anyway, you might save 10 grand. Which you can spend on diesel.
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How about an FRV? That comes with the 2.2 diesel in France so presumably in UK too.
I like the engineering of the Civic but I am convinced the front looks just like a plastic motor scooter because, sadly, that's the market Honda is aiming at. They should stick with old fogeys like me - we may be getting on a bit but we keep coming back...
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Keep coming back - up to a point! How about the CRV? Its not as long as a Passat/Accord, and has plenty of space, whilst its not a huge SUV.
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I've seen one or two new Civics on the road. They look less attractive in the metal than in the magazine photos and from some angles the mirror-like 'grille' reminds me of the days when people used to put tin foil on their grilles in winter to get their engine to warm up quicker! It's also a bit dumpy with something of the BL Allegro about it!!!
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I've got one and it's a cracking motor. Make sure you get the 2.2 Diesel though. The motor is fantastic and it handles well. Don't let any salesman talk you into the 18" rims though as it makes the car too choppy at low speeds. IO admit the styling is love it or hate it, but no regrets here. Just done 530 miles and at , cough, a wee bit above the national limit, 1500 miles on the clock and returned over 50mpg. None too shabby, as I wasn;t hanging around!
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Back to the original question - I went from a 97 Passat to a 2001 Laguna Tourer to a 2001 GolfIV. Only had to put the topbox on the Golf once, though I was glad I had a 307 SW courtesy car the other week when I wanted to move a dining room table (the 307SW was horrid, but that's another matter).
If you liked the Passat, why don't you consider the GolfV? It's bigger than, and greatly improved over, the markIV. My 105TDi MkV is 54 weeks and 37k old, has averaged (anorak on) 51.7 mpg, at its 36k service the front tyres were reported to have 4mm still. Only problem has been the replacement of the outside temerature sensor under warranty.
There is a MkV estate planned for 2007 - see
www.stern.de/sport-motor/autowelt/erlkoenige/volks...t-
Der-Hintern/553532.html
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...for some reason the new Civic reminds me of the Renault Fuego...I give Honda 18 months before they give it a rear wash-wipe...
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I've had my current Passat TDI 115 PD estate (sport trim) since new in 2000 (pre-face lift) and am looking to change within the next 6 to 12 months. I really like my Passat (the fuel economy has averaged over 50mpg throughout its life), but I am not at all attracted to the new model.
As a massive fan of the Passat, I am inclined to agree with you. The new Passat styling is a bit iffy to say the least, and there is evidence of cost-savings on the build quality too. The old Passat in a way was better than it needed to be, but I think there is now quite a rift between VW and Audi in terms of build-quality.
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