Came to the uk for two weeks for my fathers funeral,I had my car broken into in Westminster outside my London house .Police response absolutely zero to a crime that cost me 400ukps.I also spent a few days up in Bradford where the crime of bumping someones car and then assaulting the driver and stealing his car is out of control,they do it in daylight and in the city also in the two weeks I did not see one policeman on the beat do they not exist anymore.
I also read Westminster is going to take half its traffic police and put them on the streets to cut crime .It seems to me you pay a lot of money for services that do not exist police,hospitals,trains,roads,street cleaning the list is endless where does all the money go?
One more point how do they justify the prices in motorway services and in eating places in general
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Welcome to the UK. This is what we have to put up with every day.
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Welcome to the UK, the world's fourth largest economy! Sorry about your dad, but really to enjoy our hospitality, I suggest you come back next time disguised as an illegal immigrant or a terrorist, then you will be well treated.
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Next time, to avoid motorway prices and general poor quality, use www.5minutesaway.co.uk. This gives good eating and fuel deals near motorway exits. If you come south, the new service station just before Winchester on the M3 is relatively good.
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Andy,
My condolences on your loss.
We do seem to be in a state in our nation and it does seem to be getting worse. I wouldn't put it down down to the present Government because the previous were just the same. When I was a younger man I used to believe there was a distinct difference between them. I later realised there is little to choose between political parties and that all politicians are there with themselves as the main agenda.. Red carpet trips abroad offering money to everyone but their own is part of it. Even local ones have their nose in the trough with twinning and fact finding holidays deemed to be important.
We have had every advantage over the last 30 years including North sea oil and gas but where has it all gone.
Alwyn talks of three bobbies.... We have none from around 16.00hrs and the only ones seen in the daytime are passing in a car.
Sorry to be pessimistic but what a downward spiral we have seen in the last thirty years. I sometimes think a friendly dictatorship would be preferable.
sorry....only joking
Alvin
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Andy, I know just what you mean. I have mentioned previously that I am on the local Crime Action Team and hear horror stories at every meeting. The local Police Inspector seems a genuine chap who struggles to keep a lid on crime because his politically correct bosses prefer to direct resources towards speed cameras.
He tells us he has 70,000 people to police and at any one time he has just 3 bobbies on call. He nearly lost one of those last week when, during a chase, his officer was battered about the head with a lump of wood with a screw in it. If it had not been for a member of the public who went to the bobbie's assistance it could have been much worse. Sickening. One in custody!
A local library had it windows smashed by a gang of up to 30 youths who then decided to terrorise the staff and customers at a local supermarket. Police took half an hour to arrive! And this to one of the major towns in his area.
Local shops which used to boast 7 'til 11 opening now cannot do it because staff are terrified to work at night when the yobs take control.
I was at a Council meeting last night and listened to Councillor after Councillor blame the youth leader, the police, the teachers, the Rector and anyone else they could think of because yobs had smashed up the Church Hall, leading to the loss of the youth club.
I got very hot under under the collar and said I was stunned than not one of them had blamed the yobs. I have had offers from police members of the Crime Action Team to put these louts into the Youth Offending system when something will be done to deal them.
One scheme is to warn their parents that they may be in breach of their tenancy agreement if they cause trouble locally and this has had an effect in one area trialled. Imagine losing your house because your brat is out of control!
When I asked my fellow Councillors for the names of the perps, they stutterd ERm ER, ERm "Paul and John" They had been shouting that they knew the names but when push came to shove, they poohed themselves in case of retribution.
As long as this attitude prevails,we are doomed, and those apologists for thugs will hopefully be the first to suffer!
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I used to live in Foster City, Ca.
There, any offence by the minor (under 18) gets the parents a warning. A second offence by the minor gets the parent's driving licence suspended - even where the offence was unrelated to driving.
No negotiation, no second warning - it happens with everything from truancy, through vandalism, petty crime etc.
Amazing how much people care where their children are when it could really hurt them directly.
And there isn't even a fine to pay at 10p per week for the next 1000 years.
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Sorry to hear about your Dad, Andy.
IMHO one of the reasons that the cash doesn't seem to go far is that very little actually gets to the right places. Every public service now seems to have everything contracted out, unfortunately the contracting companies don't do things for fun, they, not unreasonably, want to make a profit. There are now some very large companies who do nothing but supply services to public utilities and other large companies, they exist to do nothing else and have some pretty healthy balance sheets. This creates a situation whereby if you are still paying the person who actually 'does' the same as before then the profit must come from somewhere and you can only improve efficiency so far.
Two recent examples in the Press were the BBC paying £19 for a light bulb and the Met paying £300 for a computer password reset, wonder where the money for that came from???
Comment in the paper today hit nail right on the head; France may not be the fourth largest economy in the world or the strongest but perhaps the French like living in a country where the trains run on time and were built in the last 20 years, you can get medical treatment when you want, the education is good, the food, drink and tobacco is cheap and, above all, the police actually police. Mind you they probably pay a bit more tax, but perhaps there's more to life...
Food for thought I would suggest.
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Ironically, France had to call on beef-fed British navvies to lay down their original rail tracks. French workers had a poor diet at the time and were not strong enough.
Personally, I am agitating to have my hip replacement done in France. There are some splendid roads there too but the motorway service stations are "rip-off stops", only marginally better than ours, IMHO.
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Some good points here, as i have lived in France off and on with my french wife. The French would simply not put up with things as they currently are in Britain. We pay incidently, on adverage 15% more tax per person per yr than the French do becasue are taxes are manily indirect on Fuel, Food, Clothes, Tabacco, Drink, Cars, Education Fees, Utility Bills how can you live without some of these. Business does play an important part in our lives, but do we really want everything to be given over to private companies who are not accountable (as political associations are, such as Councils) and have 'profit at whatever cost' as their primary goal?
Stubbeness and Arogance may be the French way, but if McDonalds wants to build yet another outlet on some lovely green park, then at least the French will personally put a foot in the way when and if the state fails. I have seen local French farmers do pretty radical things to keep business (superstores) out of their villages and away from their rural and perfectly contented lives.
Maybe i will join them!
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The reason the services are now provided by private companies is that the public sector has failed for years to manage its resources/budgets and staff. A lot of privatised services are working well and making a profit - try using the docklands light railway - it is superb. Profit is not a dirty word!
What this got to do about cars anyway?
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Andy,
I am sorry to hear about your Dad, sincere condolences.
Charting a path to find the route course of the problems you raise is fraught with distortions, and they take research to put into a balanced perspective.
I have a view: The move from direct to indirect taxation coupled with the changes and influences of policies on the UK from the European Union, has distorted the availability of tax income to the exchequer. Politicians during elections also imply that they will cut taxation rather than increase it, which usually appeals to the electorate.
Meanwhile the cost of running the services- transport, police, health etc continues to burgeon. Nothing can be improved on fresh air alone, but most in this country are reluctant to support increased taxation!
Julian L
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Lekas - I had my hip done under the Tories in 1986. From first X-ray to job done in 17 months. A friend has just been told he'll have to wait at least 3 years for the same op in the same area. So much for Tony's promises.
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Andy,
Firstly, my condolences.
I choose to live here, and not in the UK. I'm sure that many of the ex-pats in the backroom are as appalled by the lawlessness going on in the uk as you are. (I live in one of the most criminal cities in the world, yet it seldom comes to my doorstep.)
To hear that you suffered crime in Westminster, home of the Mother of all Parliaments, shames me, and all other Britons. I read/see on TV daily the problems in the UK - from the UK media. It frightens me that I cannot bring my family "Home" to safety, to half-decent health care, to a law-abiding society. The British way of life has always been an example of how-to-do-things - is it any more?
Maybe Napoleon was right - Britain has become a nation of shopkeepers.
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A nation of SHOPLIFTERS would more accurately describe GB today, Ian.
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Brian.
My thoughts exactly if I could have expounded it as well as yourself.
I might vote for you if........
Alvin
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Julian
The problem is that the tax base in the UK has been expanded over the past few years to include things in indirect taxes that were never taxed before, like the "windfall" tax on utilities (= money taken away from infrastructure providers and passed back to the Treasury) ; Insurance Premium Tax (disincentive to insure cars); fines on railway companies for poor performance (= less money to be spent on railways, how is that supposed to help?); withdrawal of tax refunds on pension funds (= less money to be invested in industry).
The only thing that has not gone up is the basic rate of income tax, but since personal allowances have not been raised in line with incomes the effect is the same as if the basic rate HAD been increased. In addition any loss of income tax is being made up by employees national insurance contributions, which is tax in all but name, the link with benefits having been severed long ago.
The result is that the UK Government now takes close to 40% of the Gross Domestc Product (55% tax take less 15% given back in benefits and allowances) and this is 2.5% more than in 1996. (and set to risestill further).
Lottery money that should have gone to benefit communities has been appropriated to pay for projects which should have come out of Government funds i.e. taxes
The crying shame is that virtually the whole of the increase in taxation since 1997 has been squandered and there is no discernable improvement in either
the infrastructure or public services.
Even as a bean-counter, I have no idea where all our money has gone, but it is obvious that a good deal of it has been swallowed up in additional administration, spin doctors and politically biased publicity, mis-handling of the foot and mouth crisis, etc. Certainly on the transport front we have not got a single mile more railway or motorway out of it.
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Ian
I don't think that the "nation of shopkeepers" description is right either.
What we have become is a nation of criminals and lawyers, presided over by an elite of lawyers who have turned to politics.
With the law-abiding general public squashed in the middle.
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Ian
I don't think that the "nation of shopkeepers" description is right either.
What we have become is a nation of criminals and lawyers, presided over by an elite of lawyers who have turned to politics.
With the law-abiding general public squashed in the middle.
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Sorry to hear about your Father Andy.
As one of the (much) castigated Lawyers referred to in the above. Can I state the case for the defence.
There is no obligation to use a Solicitor in our CJS and I see people regularly defend themselves and they handle their cases quite well with a great deal of patient and tolerant help from the Court Clerks. But I make no excuse for my Profession....if lawyers are so bad don't use them, plenty of work out there. And if Lawyers become MPs well so what ? They are better placed than most to draft legistlation and actually do something about bad law.
The Criminal Courts are busier than I have ever seen them. Yes, yes this does include a large number of Traffic offences but also a huge and increasing amount of crime work, so unless these people actually arrest themselves the Police must actually be doing something, somewhere. Prisons are full to overflowing, contrary to the perceived view with a very low ratio of motoring offenders.
Youth Justice has been revolutionized in the last two years, I know a little about the way it now works (not my field thank goodness) and we put away more kids in the UK than any oher country in the Europe. People tell me that re-offending amongst the young is actually being reduced and that the small minority of Persistant Young Offenders are being fastracked to Court and to Sentence and that there are a lot of people out there working with them to reduce their criminal ways. I was talking to a colleague who said that Youth Court reports have increased in a particualr area by 298% in twelve months whether this relates to 10 or a 100 reports it is still a staggering figure serviced by the same number of staff on the Youth Team, which does tend to suggest that collars are actually being felt for something more than speeding offfences.
I agree though that this Country has become a nation of thieves, whether it is thieving from a shop or buying duty free smokes. I have a number of friends who moan about the NHS' decline but don't give a second thought to smoking fags from France.
There is an attitude abroad in the UK that laws are for other people .... after all after 25 yrs of accident free driving should I have to bother insuring two cars ?
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Pug,
There were 30000 in our prisons in 1965. If the sentencing and changes in the criminal justices acts plus parole had remained unchanged from that time I believe we would now be way over the hundred thousand mark.
I think that speaks for itself in the way that crime has increased by an incredible amount over the last 30 years.
I recall a collegue telling me that he joined the Prison Service in 1947.
In his pre-interview with the then Prison Comissioners he was told "the prison population is very high at present due to the aftermath of the war, black marketering and so forth. We expect it to begin dropping soon"
The population was then 11000.
We don't seem to have done very well since then.
regards,
Alvin
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I also posted a few days ago my motoring disappointments in UK last year. Apart from following up Ian's comments on long-term expatriation through choice and why so many opt for it (in my case I left 35 years ago to get away from a Labour govt), on those times I come to UK I always leave vowing I will never return. From the landing at LHR to the departure back again both trips were living examples of how Britain, its government and society have raised mediocrity to the level of an art form. The shoddy service and the sheer rudeness for one thing, actually that's two things, the dopey systems (call centers, bus lanes) The only things I really enjoyed were great Lincolnshire food (but miGod at what a price - I could feed 4 for dinner here for the cost of a UK pub lunch for 2), meeting other bikers and especially a group of Hog riders on my Harley trip. Plus the genuine pockets of niceness at B & B stops etc.
I don't know how you people live with the crap you get on the motoring front. Perhaps because you live there it's creeping insidiousness means you ingest and deal with incrementally: to a visitor like me it's "wow, what am I doing here". The sheer COST, and for what?
Sorry folks, whereIan and live may have high crime rates, worse driving (although I am actually beginning to doubt this conventinal wisdom having read some of these postings) now, but I'm staying put.
The Filipinos would take this rubbish for a while then they'd organize another coup and have a change. Things might not get much better but at least motion would confer an illusion of progress! Maybe you guys should get more antsy! Tolerating the stuff is the same as rewarding it. Some of the postings from govt and related loonies I just find, truly, hard to believe, like that one dredged up by Alwyn the other day. Jee-zus!!
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Growler
Which dredged up one was that?
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I also posted a few days ago my motoring disappointments in UK last year. Apart from following up Ian's comments on long-term expatriation through choice and why so many opt for it (in my case I left 35 years ago to get away from a Labour govt), on those times I come to UK I always leave vowing I will never return. From the landing at LHR to the departure back again both trips were living examples of how Britain, its government and society have raised mediocrity to the level of an art form. The shoddy service and the sheer rudeness for one thing, actually that's two things, the dopey systems (call centers, bus lanes) The only things I really enjoyed were great Lincolnshire food (but miGod at what a price - I could feed 4 for dinner here for the cost of a UK pub lunch for 2), meeting other bikers and especially a group of Hog riders on my Harley trip. Plus the genuine pockets of niceness at B & B stops etc.
I don't know how you people live with the crap you get on the motoring front. Perhaps because you live there it's creeping insidiousness means you ingest and deal with incrementally: to a visitor like me it's "wow, what am I doing here". The sheer COST, and for what?
Sorry folks, whereIan and live may have high crime rates, worse driving (although I am actually beginning to doubt this conventinal wisdom having read some of these postings) now, but I'm staying put.
The Filipinos would take this rubbish for a while then they'd organize another coup and have a change. Things might not get much better but at least motion would confer an illusion of progress! Maybe you guys should get more antsy! Tolerating the stuff is the same as rewarding it. Some of the postings from govt and related loonies I just find, truly, hard to believe, like that one dredged up by Alwyn the other day. Jee-zus!!
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Growler,
I remember which one I "dredged up" now. The nutters at
europa.eu.int/comm/transport/extra/res_urban_trans...l
Wondered if you were having a pop at me for a second.
Bon chance
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Sorry, I don't know why 2 posts. Finger trouble again maybe.
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As a Britisher, I went to India for a stint but decided to stay there.
Health care may not be free but you can always save times by going to a specialist direct. Our doctors are obliging and do not mind us calling for a quick query. If it is at night, we are referred to the right people who will inform him if things are serious. Fees are not OTT and can be off set against tax.
Service - except for govt institutions or compnys in a monopoly situ. You get good service. Yes our streets are not totally clean, but LOndon after a weekend is just as badbut a quick call to the right places sees action. Various nbeighbourhoods get together to ensure areas are clean. Unfortunately, the community feeling has vanished from the UK so no one can join together and shout.
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Alvin, you mention local politicians.
I don't know what they do with our money either.
I mentioned on a previous post that the white lines and catseyes had worn out on an unlit rural "A" road.
This piece of road was the location of a fatal accident, about a year or so ago.
Having contacted the council responsible (Epping Forest) they said that they knew about it, it needed doing, but they could not place the contract until the new financial year in April because their budget had all been allocated.
So an unsafe piece of road, acknowledged by the responsible authority to need fixing, remains unsafe for the sake of about £1,000 or so.
As an "A" road, IMHO this should be a call on national funds, not left to the whim of a local authority.
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Last year my wife had her wallet stolen while we were meeting friends at TGI Fridays in Picadilly one Saturday evening. When we called the police to report the theft we were told that we would have to make the report to our local station in Basingstoke.
Unbelievably, there are no manned police stations in the U.K.'s busiest tourist location at weekends !
Kevin...
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No, sir, Alwyn, no pops. Just couldn't believe at first that anyopne would write such drivel, I thought maybe it was the Framley Examiner....
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Did you look at the rest of the site? I sent it to the Association of British Drivers and they said:
"Shows you just how loony tune our opponents are, doesn't it? And it's EU taxpayers's money funding this rubbish! Rgds., BJG."
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I wouldn't knock benign dictatorships. Singapore and Malaysia are very nice places.
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Here some good news. Anyone on the A1 should stop at the "Jackson Stops" pub at Stretton, 30 secs off the A1. Excellent pub food. It's between Grantham and Stamford, opposite Oakham. 1/2 way between London and York.
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Oh dear, what a dreadful place we must all live in.
As you've got all the horrible kids, yobs, invisible policemen, lousy health services, expert robbers, corrupt politicians, shoulders bent with the tax burden near to where you live, that must explain why we appear to be so relatively free of most of these problems round here.
Funny thing is that when I spent working time in London, Merseyside and Manchester donkey's years ago, the general chat was substantially the same - everything going down hill-which politicians happened to be in power made not a halfpenneth of difference. And as my grandad told me in the thirties that things were pretty dreadful compared with when he was a lad, presumably it's going to continue to be the general view.
As I am opposed to presenting problems and offering no solutions, here's just one suggestion. Supply a bank of terminals at all French Channel Ports permanently tuned in to the Back Room, and all the potential immigrants trying to scale the fences (sorry, I left them out of the list of woes earlier) will high tail it to all points east as fast as their little legs will carry them.
Yours thro rose tinted (NHS subsidised) specs
Colin S
P.S Currently in process of receiving unparalled efficient series of consultation and treatment at local hospital. On my way back from last appointment, bumped into local councillor on his bike. Mind you, it was a pretty expensive bike, but as he's been doing thousands of hours of voluntarily representing my interests for twenty years, I suppose the odd corruptly-acquired bike is the least we can expect of him.
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Be careful: The NHS kill over 30,000 folks every in medical accidents!
Source; British Medical Journal
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What governments giveth they must first taketh away.....
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Bravo Colin Standing. What a moaning lot we are. Anyone got any statistics on how many expatriates come back to this ****** awful' country to spend their last few years?
The economics of running a country are quite simple - Taxes pay for Government expenditure.
Want a better NHS? - simple pour money into it!- but we musn't raise taxes must we? Especially not on anything connected with motoring.
Crack down on law breakers? but not on my speeding - I decide what is safe.
Surely in a democracy we elect the Government and we must take some responsibility if GB Ltd isn't running as we would wish.
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> Bravo Colin Standing. What a moaning lot we are. Anyone got
> any statistics on how many expatriates come back to this
> ****** awful' country to spend their last few years?
That would be my plan. As I have said before; I like the country, there are many good things that I miss.
Its possible I have a "rose-coloured" memory, but I remember liking it, and everytime I return I love it.
My wife is Chilean. And considering that England is not her country, and considering that Chile is a wonderful, civilised, 1st world country, she still loves the UK - although she hasn't lived there yet !!
> Surely in a democracy we elect the Government and we must
> take some responsibility if GB Ltd isn't running as we would
> wish.
There is not an electorate in this world that does not need to learn that lesson, and in my experience, not one of them has learned it yet.
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