Well then it isn't a very good gauge setup.
On the ideal gauge the needle should hang vertically at normally operating temperature (88 - 90 degrees C?). Then there needs to be noticeable scope for increase beyond the norm before you hit the red zone. And if damage will occur before you hit the red zone, well then the gauge is next to useless.
Reason for the vertical position at normal temperature is psychological. If it normally hangs exactly on the vertical, it grabs your attention very quickly (i.e. easily noticable) if there is any deviation.
Where is the temperature sensor for the gauge then if it offers a localized reading which doesn't alert you to the fact that the head is getting too hot? The historical norm is for gauge to measure the temperature of coolant just as it leaves the head, this is the information you need.
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Well then it isn't a very good gauge setup.
Indeed, it isn't.
On the ideal gauge the needle should hang vertically
No, it points horizontally. It climbs steadily to the midway point and stops. The oil temperature, meanwhile, can rise to a steady state 60-90 degrees. On a long hard motorway run (not between M4 J14-18, of course) it can rise to 120 degrees. The indicated water temperature, meanwhile, does not budge.
The speculation is that the combination of minimal coolant capacity, radiator front-engine back setup and air locks due to poor bleeding specific to the K Series engine in the MGF can result in the hotspots required to bust gaskets/warp heads.
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Warranty may well state something along the lines of
"we shall cover the cost of the replacement of the part that fails but not the cost of anything that is damaged as a result of the failure"
Basically they would pay for a new radiator but not the engine! Doubtful if a radiator would be covered by the warranty though.
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Presumably we are talking about internal corrosion of the radiator? I can't imagine sufficiently bad external corrosion at four years old - even bad external corrosion would likely result in a hole before it got bad enough to severly impede cooling.
Anyway, internal corrosion would be down to not changing the antifreeze when required or having too weak a mixture.
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My warranty specifically excludes any claims due to overheating of the engine; presumably working on the assumption that if you don't notice that temperature gauge hitting the red, it's your own fault.
However, the needly on a car with no coolant may not even budge, or stick at a static, normal, temperature. Perhaps your friend didn't check fluid levels, though I thought nearly all cars have a warning to indicate when the water level is low.
After getting the water pump changed on my old Astra I noticed the gauge moved a lot more than it did previously, shooting up in traffic jams and so on. The only time the needle on my current car moves is after climbing a very long, rough, exceedingly steep hill at which point it climbs close to the red and the fan gets some exercise. I even cut this down by doing it in second gear and putting the heating on full blast.
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Anyway, internal corrosion would be down to not changing the antifreeze when required or having too weak a mixture.
But if the car had been religiously serviced by the dealer, then the antifreeze would be new and up to strength.Wouldn't it?
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Any chance of finding out if this is just a one off, or if the radiator really *is* corroded after only 4 yrs, and the car *has* been serviced properly, then maybe the manufacturer needs to think about recalling all the cars fitted with the same radiator?
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Presumably we are talking about internal corrosion of the radiator? I can't imagine sufficiently bad external corrosion at four years old - even bad external corrosion would likely result in a hole before it got bad enough to severly impede cooling.
This puzzles me, too. My MGF radiator was replaced at 6 years because it was leaking, not because there was clogging. Is it possible for antifreeze to react with, say, windscreen washer fluid? I've had a washer bottle and jets clog with the manky gloop from the washer bottle additive. If someone had topped up the coolant from the wrong bottle, maybe?
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Yes, different types of antifeeze can react together and leave a 'gel' in the system, but would be unlikely to block it sufficiently to overheat it. However you cite corrosion as the problem here. I find it hard to believe that internal corrosion could become a problem unless the car was run on straight water. Bit of a puzzle really - maybe there is more to the story?
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I find it hard to believe that internal corrosion could become a problem unless the car was run on straight water. Bit of a puzzle really - maybe there is more to the story?
He did noticed that the heater was blowing cold at the point on his trip to work where he'd normally expect it to be blowing hot. Would a boil over empty the heater matrix? Or maybe airlock it sufficiently to stop the flow? Unless the entire coolant load was dumped earlier in the journey but that would indicate a catastrophic failure e.g. a split hose - not corrosion, surely.
I do wonder whether the dealer is trying it on? After all, it must be easier to extract paid work from a pushover customer than the hassle of dealing with the warranty company.
My warranty specifically excludes any claims due to overheating of the engine; presumably working on the assumption that if you don't notice that temperature gauge hitting the red, it's your own fault.
Seems a little harsh. How often do you look at the temperature gauge on a journey? If the engine starts running rough, then maybe, but by then the damage is done. Yet another reason not to buy a warranty.
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A corroded radiator on four year old car sounds unusual, to say the least (I would be shocked if I was told a radiator was in need of replacement at that age). We still have the original radiator on our Xantia, which is now 11 years old. No problems with overheating on that car (ever!).
When, if at all, does the coolant require replacing on an MGF?
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I don't think it is an MGF, is it, the original post was a car from the far east.
Unless MG have started production there ----
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That's me guilty of ball watching again (or typical student's error of not reading the question properly). Totally misled by earlier references to an MGF. Go to the back of the class and put the dunce's cap on!
However, the question still stands, whatever car it is. When, if ever, was the coolant due for changing?
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I would also wonder why there was no warning.Whatever car it is
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Steve
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A far east competitor which springs to mind is the MX5. The temperature gauge is on the RH side of the instrument cluster and at normal operating temperature the needle would be just about vertical. The gauge has a good amount of deflection, and serious overheating should be easily visible.
The problem is, how do you prove what? If the overheating was indicated by the gauge, and went unnoticed, how do you prove it?
Where does the dealer's responsibility end? If you ran out of fuel, is the dealer liable because the gauge wasn't noticed?
How do you prove that the coolant was wrong strength? Is there sufficient left for analysis?
I think the dealer should be approached with a little circumspection unless there is an independant inspection report available.
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A far east competitor which springs to mind is the MX5.
I couldn't possibly say. [mjm goes to the top of the class.]
The problem is, how do you prove what?
You are right, of course. There is sufficient grey area here for the dealer to squirm - maybe with justification, maybe not.
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Wish your friend luck, you never know-----
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If the car is an MX5 then I don't believe that corrosion (either external or internal) can be the cause of this problem. I have see 10 year old MX5's with rads that are spotless when you peer in through the hose stubs. The hoses themselves last years and years too. There is definitely more to this....
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Yup, mine is a circa 15 year old mx5 and original hoses, radiator etc and possibly not well maintained before I got it.
The engine is extremely robust and takes abuse well. There are many examples over 250k miles and with track use.
Now a holed radiator from a stone and not noticing the gauge - yes, that's possible.
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>>Now a holed radiator from a stone and not noticing the gauge - yes, that's possible.
But only if you dont look at the gauge.Says its driver error.Not a fault on car?
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Steve
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