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New driver - new driver paranoia - johnmazda

I am a fairly new driver in my late 30s and in the last month or so I've had my first car I've been driving almost every day. I really enjoy the experience and it helps I have a half decent car to drive. I waited several years to learn as I didn't bother to learn living in London nearly my entire life so I guess this is catching up for all that lost time.

However despite this, since I started I have developed what I would call new driver paranoia. Every week, I keep having this thought that my mistakes are being captured and watched on camera and I have had a few sloppy moments. I then go on Google maps and examine the area and try and see if there are any cameras or cctv in that specific area!

Anyway, I have received one fine so far for going down a "no motor vehicles" zone which was really annoying as the car sat nav led me down a strange road where this was (still my fault though)! And I think I may have one more to come for going down another no motor vehicles zone...sigh.

But at least these ones are just fines, and I can deal with the fines, I just can't have any points and I think that's what's stressing me out. You get 6 points and your license is revoked. And I realise this is for more serious offences but still, I am anxious because it seems harsh. I feel like this could easily happen with alot of people out there. That said, I don't speed, infact I'm very careful with this and I will never run a red light or drive recklessly, obviously but the thought or slipping up and being caught is causing this tension. It is a disruptive feeling because my driving itself is fine, I'm feeling very confident in my actual ability and skill and I do believe I drive well, it's just worrying about the odd mistake here or there and I guess being at the wrong time and wrong place.

I know most of you have been driving for many years most likely but I wonder if anyone had these same feelings when you first started to drive. I should say driving in London also can be a whole different experience than the rest of the country, where I believe the experience is so much less stressful.

Edited by johnmazda on 15/04/2023 at 23:38

New driver - new driver paranoia - Adampr

A lot of people don't have the same experience because they learn to drive when they're young and stupid; it never occurs to them that they're fallible until they end up in a field or smashing I to lamp posts. You're just feeling the natural fear of doing something inherently dangerous at an age where you can see it.

All I can say is that I have been driving for nearly 30 years and have been as much of an i**** as anyone in my teens and 20s. In that time, I have been pulled over by the police once (checking insurance details), had one speed awareness course and a couple of parking tickets (one of which I successfully appealed).

I have also driven into a field by taking a corner too fast, hit two gates posts and reversed into a fence. I have been rear-ended a couple of times, side swiped on a roundabout, have had to take severe evasive action two or three times and have managed to hit a loose caravan wheel that bounced over the central reservation.

I have sustained zero injuries, paid less than £200 in fines and course fees, not hurt anyone, had no points and had my costs covered by insurance with no problems.

Just keep being careful and make sure you have your insurance tax and MOT up.to.date and you'll be fine

New driver - new driver paranoia - gordonbennet

I don't envy you, the roads are not a pleasant place to be any more, what with the aggressive and selfish attitudes that are increasingly the norm out there though this doesn't apply just on the roads, quite apart from the rapidly increasingly surveillance state trying its best to extract cash from anyone who makes a mistake.

Only advice i can give is take your time and assume every other driver is incompetent at best.

Remember luck plays its part in getting through your motoring life without serious mishap, you can hedge things like luck your way by good preparation and keeping alert but anyone who gets through a lifetime on the road without something bad happening it wasn't just as a result of their skills as they perceive them.

New driver - new driver paranoia - nellyjak

I don't envy you, the roads are not a pleasant place to be any more, what with the aggressive and selfish attitudes that are increasingly the norm out there though this doesn't apply just on the roads, quite apart from the rapidly increasingly surveillance state trying its best to extract cash from anyone who makes a mistake.

Only advice i can give is take your time and assume every other driver is incompetent at best.

Remember luck plays its part in getting through your motoring life without serious mishap, you can hedge things like luck your way by good preparation and keeping alert but anyone who gets through a lifetime on the road without something bad happening it wasn't just as a result of their skills as they perceive them.

Couldn't agree more...I've been driving for over 50 years now and the roads, drivers and attitudes are totally different now.

As GB suggests...drive defensively and assume the worst from any fellow road user.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Surreydriver

FWIW - it is 12 points in 3 years before you lose a UK license but stay vigilant and stay safe.

New driver - new driver paranoia - skidpan

FWIW - it is 12 points in 3 years before you lose a UK license but stay vigilant and stay safe.

As far as I am aware its 6 points in 2 years for a new driver. Your license is then revoked and you have to get a new provisional when your ban ends and retake both theory and practical tests.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Surreydriver

I stand corrected, "fairly new driver" is a little vague.

New driver - new driver paranoia - edlithgow

Yup.

Doesn't go away either.

I suppose I don't think about the surveillance so much (which wasn't a factor when I learned to drive) but more about the potentially dire consequences.

These are more likely here in Taiwan, but driving is dangerous anywhere.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Engineer Andy

I don't envy you, the roads are not a pleasant place to be any more, what with the aggressive and selfish attitudes that are increasingly the norm out there though this doesn't apply just on the roads, quite apart from the rapidly increasingly surveillance state trying its best to extract cash from anyone who makes a mistake.

Only advice i can give is take your time and assume every other driver is incompetent at best.

Remember luck plays its part in getting through your motoring life without serious mishap, you can hedge things like luck your way by good preparation and keeping alert but anyone who gets through a lifetime on the road without something bad happening it wasn't just as a result of their skills as they perceive them.

Couldn't agree more...I've been driving for over 50 years now and the roads, drivers and attitudes are totally different now.

As GB suggests...drive defensively and assume the worst from any fellow road user.

I agree. I wonder if those 'pass plus' courses etc are still available, to help new drivers gain confidence, especially when driving in unfamiliar / busy areas, especially with bus lanes, etc and cameras to catch the slightest error out?

New driver - new driver paranoia - John F

..... I have developed what I would call new driver paranoia. Every week, I keep having this thought that my mistakes are being captured and watched on camera and I have had a few sloppy moments. I then go on Google maps and examine the area and try and see if there are any cameras or cctv in that specific area!

I'm pleased to see the exclamation remark helps to preclude a diagnosis of surveillance paranoia. However, the Orwellian presence of automatic disciplinary cameras monitoring bus lanes and speed are a matter of fact now. But I doubt if anyone in a M-way control room takes any notice of 'sloppy moments' and AFAIK there are no cameras monitoring the rest of the road network.

If you take care, you are unlikely to be caught speeding. Like many people, I probably break the speed limit virtually every time I drive but I have had only three speeding fines since I passed my test in 1967 (none in the past 25yrs) plus a recent (4yrs ago) speed awareness course when I was carelessly caught by a camera van doing 37 on a road recently reduced to a 30 from a 40 limit.

New driver - new driver paranoia - focussed
Consider contacting your local Institute of Advanced Motorists group to improve your skills.

Most groups will give you a free assessment of your driving standard with an observer, in your own car and highlight areas which need improvement.
Find your local group here:-

www.iamroadsmart.com/membership/local-groups
New driver - new driver paranoia - Andrew-T

<< ,,, Like many people, I probably break the speed limit virtually every time I drive but I have had only three speeding fines since I passed my test in 1967 ... >>

I guess most of us could say the same. I have never been caught 'speeding' in 60 years driving - I assume that the offence is about true speed, not the indication on my speedometer, which I know is designed to over-read by up to 10%. I exploit that 'safety margin' where I can, and like many others get slightly annoyed by conscientious drivers bimbling unnecessarily in a 30 zone at 25.

I remember being pulled over by plod once, about 1970, for having two different extra lamps on the car, one spot and one fog.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Falkirk Bairn

>>I have never been caught 'speeding' in 60 years driving -

Same here!

I learned a lot when I started with a brother's cast off scooter, a 250cc Triumph.

Even in the early 60s and comparatively empty roads you had to keep your eyes on the look out. Teaches you a lot, I can assure you.

Clean driving licence all my life, zero points - so far.

Never claimed on my insurer when the scrape, ding etc was my fault - paid that out of my pocket.

I have had the odd parking ticket, 1984 was the last one (£6).

My wife passed her test in 1969, clean licence, no claims other than against 3 or 4 against the 3rd party and has not even had a parking ticket! As she reminds me from time to time!

New driver - new driver paranoia - barney100

Apple maps is excellent at showing speed limits and upcoming cameras. If in doubt stick to thirty in towns until you see another speed showing on a sign or the map app. Keep your eyes peeled for bus lanes etc and you have a better chance of avoiding bother. We are all in the same boat or in our case car. The 20 mph zones are one thing that needs looking for.

New driver - new driver paranoia - sammy1

>>I have never been caught 'speeding' in 60 years driving -

Same here!

The word is caught. You have just been extremely lucky or where you live might be a factor. As the OP points out driving today is hardly relaxing. A lady in the Welsh town where I live has been fined for doing 24 in a 20 speed camera. It is all about revenue when you drive today so relax and take it on the chin. Speed camera vans are now not even marked around my way just a black hole in the back!

New driver - new driver paranoia - KB.

Consider contacting your local Institute of Advanced Motorists group to improve your skills.
Most groups will give you a free assessment of your driving standard with an observer, in your own car and highlight areas which need improvement.
Find your local group here:-
www.iamroadsmart.com/membership/local-groups

I also endorse the advanced driver assessment and tuition from a local group.

I expect the suggestion will be frowned upon from certain quarters as it's a far from cool thing to do. But speaking from personal experience (which may or may not count for much) I can say that when I undertook the courses and tests I was in my teens and I feel sure it prevented me from driving like a lunatic and having a string of crashes and collecting fines for this or that.. I'll admit I have had accidents in 55 years of driving and I'll own up to confessing some were my fault but I still say the extra instruction and assessments during that vulnerable period got me off to a better start than would otherwise have been the case.

I'll further admit that I no longer take refresher tests and am sure my driving could be criticized but I stand by the principle that if you did get assessed and received extra tuition and passed the advanced test you would have achieved something to be proud of and are likely to experience increased self confidence.

One other thing that I personally find helpful is to have a sat-nav on the windscreen at all times. My one happens to have a dashcam built in and might one day settle an argument or be useful to someone else but the digital readout of your speed is more accurate and much easier to recognize than the old style speedo that I would otherwise rely on - plus it turns red when you exceed the limit and it gives you warning of speed cameras etc etc..

New driver - new driver paranoia - gordonbennet

I'm not a fan of satnavs (people rely on them instead of treating them as a helpful tool), but a good point about speed limits and camera locations.

I've put digitial GPS speedometers on the dash of both of our cars, having had the benefit of digi speed readout in trucks for some years find them a lot easier to read at a glance especially when the display is so close to where you were looking anyway.

New driver - new driver paranoia - focussed

I'm not a fan of satnavs (people rely on them instead of treating them as a helpful tool), but a good point about speed limits and camera locations.

I've put digitial GPS speedometers on the dash of both of our cars, having had the benefit of digi speed readout in trucks for some years find them a lot easier to read at a glance especially when the display is so close to where you were looking anyway.

Our Accord tourer has an analogue speedo in mph and the km figures on the inner ring are tiny and unreadable at a glance so I too fitted a GPS speedo. Our recently purchased Dacia Duster has a digital speed readout and a very good built in satnav with current speed limit indication and an alarm if you exceed the speed limit by 5 kmh - the speed limit changes on the sat nav are amazingly accurate here in france, within a few metres or so.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Andrew-T

>>I have never been caught 'speeding' in 60 years driving -

The word is caught. You have just been extremely lucky or where you live might be a factor. A lady in the Welsh town where I live has been fined for doing 24 in a 20 speed camera. It is all about revenue when you drive today so relax and take it on the chin.

No, I disagree that I have been 'extremely' lucky, perhaps just a bit lucky. I try to stay aware of the speed zone I am in (that gets harder all the time) and drive within the +10% margin I believe the law and my speedo allow me. Occasionally I have realised after a few seconds that the limit has dropped, and slow down accordingly. And the times when I have exceeded the M'way limit must be in single figures - partly because I avoid them whenever a decent alternative is available.

The Welsh lady you refer to was probably driving with a speedo indication of 26-27 when she was caught, so she should have known. And 'all about revenue' is a little bit snide. It is certainly true in some places (Wales especially), but if the cameras help to persuade drivers to slow down where they need to, so much the better.

New driver - new driver paranoia - johnmazda

Many thanks to all those replied, some very useful thoughts and comments.

Yes I should have said I've only been driving about a month now, so not long really and in my inexperience there are certain things I get worried about. For example approaching lights, I'm always worried when it comes from amber to red and it can be tricky knowing when to stop. I've never gone through a red light but I have already seen a few who have gone through and many who come very close. I think though not all traffic lights have the red light cameras installed anyway...as I don't always see them on top of the traffic lights...?

As I said speeding is not an issue as I'm always staying within the limit but one thing that is confusing is sometimes Google will give you a false speed limit for some roads so that's something you have to watch out for and at times the signs aren't always obvious, so I just deliberately go slow!

@Enginner Andy, yes I have already taken the pass plus infact a few weeks ago and it was alright but I think this IAM is a great idea. I have seen some videos online and there's one guy on YT called Reg Local. I wonder how much the courses themselves cost.

@John F - "But I doubt if anyone in a M-way control room takes any notice of 'sloppy moments' and AFAIK there are no cameras monitoring the rest of the road network."

Yes I guess there can't be CCTV on every street corner.

I have a dashcam too running whenever I drive but this can be both a blessing and a curse. It will definitely help you out if something does happen in terms of evidence but on the other hand, it can be quite obsessive to watch back your mistakes and times when you think you might have done something wrong.

I do think, this fine that I received has probably put me on edge because I didn't even have recollection of going down that street.

Anyway, the novelty of driving is wearing off very gradually so I will probably drive a little less in time to come although I'm sure I will still enjoy the experience just as much.

New driver - new driver paranoia - blindspot

mate. when any driver tells me their going to drive into london for the first time, i reply good luck with that . i've heard of so many in that situation ,they got caught parking .bus lanes no right turn. let alone all the speed cameras and no go zones. just stick to regular routes for a while and learn from others mistakes ,or better still learn from the wise old owls on this site.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Adampr

Red lights you just get used to. I think they're on amber for four seconds. It's called the 'dilemma time' and is, apparently, just the right amount of time for you to be able to accurately decide whether to stop or go.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Bromptonaut

I passed my test at 17 in 1977. Got to be OK locally in the Leeds area where we lived and round and about mostly in my Mum's Mini.

By the time I could afford a car of my own I was 22 and living with friends in a shared house in Golders Green while working in central London. Even then, 41 years ago, I found driving in London pretty daunting. And that was long before multiple cameras, bus lanes and Low Emission Zones.

Two thoughts.

Firstly, I found, without going down the whole course>test route, that reading the (then) IAM guides to both ordinary and motorway driving was a massive education. You need to be looking well ahead and all around. Somebody quite recently wrote about how fighter pilots look all around; that was an education.

Secondly, at traffic lights Amber means STOP. If the light is Green then there's only one aspect that comes next...

Difference from Red is that there are defences for passing the stop line on Amber. Passing on Red is an absolute offence. From a purely practical point of view around avoiding accidents the overlap time where all lights are Red can be between nil and nanoseconds. Junction locally where traffic off the M1 and A43 meets the ring road has zero overlap; collisions between 'Amber Gamblers' is a serious risk...

New driver - new driver paranoia - johnmazda

Yes I can imagine driving in London was a very different experience to what it is now. Even when I was a kid in the car with my dad in the 90s I don't recall seeing as many cameras as I do today (not that I was paying a huge amount of attention).

With the red light cameras, as far as I understand it they take two photos and the first is triggered when the lights turn red and the second snap is a second later or something. In other words they have to ensure that both your front of your vehicle and the back of your vehicle passes the stop line...? Otherwise if it was only the back of the vehicle, then how would they get the number plate?

Also I heard even with the first snap, there is like a half second delay after the very moment the light turns red, is that correct? So to ensure that there is no discrepancy as to whether the vehicle made it through amber in time?

Furthermore, not all these traffic lights/junctions have these red light traffic cameras, and some do look different, always get confused with what's what.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Adampr

It's speed cameras that flash twice. In any case, as I said before, just don't drive through any red lights and it's all irrelevant. If it happens, it happens but it's out of your control by the time you're counting flashes etc. As above, don't drive through amber either and it definitely won't happen.

New driver - new driver paranoia - sammy1

London busy but try driving around The Arc de Triomphe for a real paranoia feeling. Driving improves for most with experience for others it just gets more sloppy. It is quite normal for ones heart rate to increase when encountering new experiences on the road but after a while things calm down and journeys become so automatic that you forget you even passed something you might have noticed.. I would leave it a while before diving into the likes of the theory envisaged by the likes of IAMs and develop your own skills first otherwise there is the danger of out thinking quite simple manoeuvres.

New driver - new driver paranoia - focussed

Red lights you just get used to. I think they're on amber for four seconds. It's called the 'dilemma time' and is, apparently, just the right amount of time for you to be able to accurately decide whether to stop or go.

Err - NO! Red means stop. Red and amber together also means stop. Green means proceed if the way is clear. www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/light-signals...c
New driver - new driver paranoia - FP

I would like to echo the general message from previous posters, which is just to concentrate on your driving. Use your satnav with common sense, follow the rules of the road, be aware of the potential stupidity of other drivers (and pedestrians/cyclists), take your time when dealing with possibly dangerous/complicated traffic situations and try to be relaxed, but vigilant at the same time.

I remember that many years ago, when I was a young, newly qualified driver, I caught myself gripping the steering wheel with great intensity and realised that I was stressing myself out.

Edited by FP on 17/04/2023 at 12:41

New driver - new driver paranoia - galileo

I would like to echo the general message from previous posters, which is just to concentrate on your driving. Use your satnav with common sense, follow the rules of the road, be aware of the potential stupidity of other drivers (and pedestrians/cyclists), take your time when dealing with possibly dangerous/complicated traffic situations and try to be relaxed, but vigilant at the same time.

All I would add is make good use of mirrors, look as far ahead as you can to give maximum time to react to slowing traffic, crossings etc.

New driver - new driver paranoia - gordonbennet

And don't forget to avoid staying alongside trucks too long, when overtaking on dual carriages and motorways try and get completely past the things, if you can't because of traffic stay back until you can get fully past then do so smartly.

Some misguided people do try and tangle with trucks, but as any copper will tell you when a truck and car/van collide there's only one winner.

New driver - new driver paranoia - Andrew-T

I remember that many years ago, when I was a young, newly qualified driver, I caught myself gripping the steering wheel with great intensity and realised that I was stressing myself out.

I remember hearing about a friend (I didn't witness it) chewing through his pipe stem while driving in Europe ....

New driver - new driver paranoia - corax

I remember hearing about a friend (I didn't witness it) chewing through his pipe stem while driving in Europe ....

What happened to the bowl? Did it drop in his lap and give him more than the traffic to worry about?