So the Kuga is a good one to think about, but the rest of the year should be interesting with some more PHEVs in the pipeline: Skoda Octavia, Renault Captur, and BMW X1 and 330e Touring. The last two may come out too expensive if some of the essentials (like lumbar support) are on the options list. That's already the case with the Volvo XC40, and Volvo petrol engines all seem to be distressingly heavy drinkers.
What about the Superb PHEV? My Mrs likes the idea of one far more than the Corolla (the dealer experience over the phone has put her off already). Seen them up for about £30K which is £6000 off with a spec that embarrasses many top executive brands. Just not sure about the sheer size of one myself. Would need to get one home to try in the garage and under current test drives rules that may be impossible.
One thing I am unsure about with PHEV's is do they charge whilst driving like a Toyota Hybrid? They would be pretty useless if all you got was about 30 miles of assistance and then reverted to a standard petrol car with a couple of hundred weight of batteries etc to car about until you plugged it in again.
I still like the XC40. The one we had for 2 days earlier this year was great (T4) but a bit thirsty, about 30 mpg for the 2 days. That model is gone now, replaced by the mild hybrid B4T but as of now never seen a word written about it. For us doing about 5000 mile a year the annual cost difference between our Pulsar and the XC40 would only be about £150 so its not worth worrying about. But if the Toyota would do 50 mpg the Volvo would cost an extra £360 a year to fuel. Still not serious but there are other things to spend £360 on.
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I read a review of a hybrid XC40 (not a mild hybrid though) in May's edition of Car magazine this morning. While the motoring press do seem to really rate the XC40, they were not too impressed with this hybrid.
Briefly, the problems (according to them) stemmed from a few areas, one of which, the ride quality, could (in theory) be avoided by going for a lower spec than the R-Design Pro with firmer damping and huge wheels tested. But in practice, apparently the hybrid drivetrain is not available with a lesser spec?.
They also said that while driven gently, the integration of the two power sources was pretty much seamless, but this was not the case if you upped the pace.
Lastly, they found the brakes very harsh and grabby. This was put down to the brake regen, but as they rightly point out, other manufacturers have managed to do this much more smoothly.
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I read a report of the XC40 Hybrid earlier this year and that was not flattering either. Unlike the T4 we had on loan (and the B4P replacement) which use a smooth 8 speed torque converter box the hybrid uses a 7 speed double clutch box which the magazine found very jerky.
With regards to ride the one we had on loan was a R-Design Pro on 20" wheels (45 profile tyres). The ride was very good but since we would get a lowere spec one with 18" wheels (55 profile tyres) I would expect it to be better.
At well north of £40000 one will not be appearing on our drive soon.
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The Superb is a bit bigger than I need but sometime fairly soon there should be an Octavia IV (i.e. PHEV) - which will have to have a cheaper list price but will be more in demand so maybe wouldn't come wth the sort of deal you've seen on the Superb. Having had three much-loved Octavia vRS estates, I certainly want to try an Octavia IV before going form on anything else.
I'm no technical expert but as I understand it, the 'normal' mode for a PHEV is with both petrol and electric motors working together. This happens unless the battery driving the electric motor is exhausted. There are then other options:
- electric-only (ideal for short journeys)
- save electric for later (journey eding in a town so petrol only until you get to it)
- engine charges electric battery (presumably reduces petrol engine's performance).
So if your 5,000 miles a year involves a lot of short journeys, say less than 20 mile round trips, a PHEV will suit you well. But if it's more like occasional long trips, with the other car used for shopping, then as you say a lot of it will be carting around a weight of batteries.
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So if your 5,000 miles a year involves a lot of short journeys, say less than 20 mile round trips, a PHEV will suit you well. But if it's more like occasional long trips, with the other car used for shopping, then as you say a lot of it will be carting around a weight of batteries.
Of the 5000 miles 2000 is covered in 2 holiday weeks leaving the rest to be spend doing short trips averaging 60 miles a week.
The Fabia seems to be doing more miles than the Pulsar since the Mrs seems to love it (so do I for that matter). Had it just over 6 months now and its done 2500 miles, over the same period the Pulsar has covered 1700. During lockdown the Mrs has been alternating cars on her weekly 80 miles round trip, that's just over a 1000 miles in each meaning the Pulsar has hardly been used, calculates as about 25 miles a week. Over the same period the Fabia has been averaging a theoretical 50 miles a week.
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What about the Superb PHEV? My Mrs likes the idea of one far more than the Corolla (the dealer experience over the phone has put her off already). Seen them up for about £30K which is £6000 off with a spec that embarrasses many top executive brands. Just not sure about the sheer size of one myself. Would need to get one home to try in the garage and under current test drives rules that may be impossible.
The Superb may need a little development work:
Skoda Superb iV fails the moose test - Teknikens Värld
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XLfyatbtGo
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One thing I am unsure about with PHEV's is do they charge whilst driving like a Toyota Hybrid?
I think you'll find the clue's in PHEV Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle.
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A PHEV will harvest braking/deceleration energy just like a normal hybrid, the plug in aspect is in addition to this, not instead of.
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A PHEV will harvest braking/deceleration energy just like a normal hybrid, the plug in aspect is in addition to this, not instead of.
The BMW PHEVs can also have the ICE charge the battery back up to 50% in the 'Sport' driving mode, as well as driving the wheels. However, this also burns a little more fuel.
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I’ve got a Kuga PHEV on order. Should be arriving next month. It’s a company car and replaces a Golf GTD estate, which has served me well.
Prior to lockdown, I was doing around 25k miles per year, so really a diesel would still make sense. However, unless you’re happy to get completely caned on company car/BIK tax, a BEV or PHEV is the only way to go. My monthly tax bill will reduce by almost £200 with the move from the Golf to the Kuga.
I’ve got a dog and a young family, so need an estate or SUV, so the BMW was out, as the 330e Touring hasn’t been released yet. Superb iV estate and Passat GTE estate were possibilities, but would have involved a monthly contribution to the lease cost. Niro PHEV was also considered, but I don’t care for the styling.
It grates with me having to pay extra for the likes of lumbar support on the BMW. Until they saw the light a few months back, they were even trying to charge for Apple CarPlay, which is included for free on most city cars!
The fact that the Kuga has a 2.5 petrol engine underneath also means a more generous mileage reimbursement under the HMRC AFR scheme, which works well for me.
Would have liked to go fully electric, but couldn’t make the numbers work in terms of journey length or lease costs.
Will be taking the opportunity to plug the Kuga in every night to maximise the electric range, keep costs down, do my bit for the environment and enjoy some ICE-free ‘silent’ running.
There’s a function to increase the brake regeneration level, so it will be interesting to experiment with the different modes and see what works best.
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I think you'll find the clue's in PHEV Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle.
A PHEV will harvest braking/deceleration energy just like a normal hybrid, the plug in aspect is in addition to this, not instead of.
2 different answers, which is correct?
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Prior to lockdown, I was doing around 25k miles per year, so really a diesel would still make sense. However, unless you’re happy to get completely caned on company car/BIK tax, a BEV or PHEV is the only way to go. My monthly tax bill will reduce by almost £200 with the move from the Golf to the Kuga.
I’ve got a dog and a young family, so need an estate or SUV, so the BMW was out, as the 330e Touring hasn’t been released yet. Superb iV estate and Passat GTE estate were possibilities, but would have involved a monthly contribution to the lease cost. Niro PHEV was also considered, but I don’t care for the styling.
I was in the same boat in 2017, going PHEV would put an extra £100+ a month in my pocket compared with my previous Volvo V60 diesel. I also looked at the then relatively new Passat GTE but the contract hire cost was ludicrous - around £430 per month if I remember correctly.
Then BMW offered a contract hire deal on the 225xe, I had a weekend test drive and I was sold. It's been fantastic. My daily commute is an 8-mile round trip so I was able to do that in pure electric mode every day.
I never bothered getting a wallbox fitted, the car's traction battery is only 7.5KW which takes 3 hours for a full charge from a domestic 13A socket.
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I think you'll find the clue's in PHEV Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle.
A PHEV will harvest braking/deceleration energy just like a normal hybrid, the plug in aspect is in addition to this, not instead of.
2 different answers, which is correct?
This is a direct qoute from Mitsubishi's website re the Outlander PHEV:
"The large capacity battery will take you 28 miles (WLTP) in pure electric mode. Add the 2.4-litre engine to the calculations and the combined range is significant. And with an ability to capture kinetic energy through regenerative braking, you have all the benefits of electric without any of the worries of running out of energy."
This is from Ford's website re the Kuga PHEV:
"Kuga’s advanced Plug-in Hybrid (PHEV) technology combines a battery-powered electric motor with a 2.5-litre Duratec petrol engine. The hybrid battery can be recharged at home or public charging stations. Energy recaptured while braking also helps charge the battery as you drive. Fully charged, the Kuga PHEV can drive up to 35miles* on electric power alone, and a total hybrid driving range of up to 465miles."
It would make no sense at all for a plug in hybrid to only be able to replenish its battery by being plugged in.
Also, another way to think about it, Kia make both plug in and non plug in versions of the Niro Hybrid. Is it likely they would develop two seperate hybrid systems which work in different ways?.
Not sure where bathtub tom is getting his info from, but as i said earlier, the plug in part is an 'addition', not an 'instead of'
The downside is price. If you have a choice between plug in or non plug in, as is the case with the Niro (and the Prius for that matter), you really need to have worked out the figures because the plug in version is more than £5k dearer than the non plug in.
Edited by badbusdriver on 27/06/2020 at 10:09
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