Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights?

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 20:07
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott
Hi guys,

I've stumbled across this forum while looking into an issue I currently have and hoped I might be able to get some advice by creating an account, I hope this is okay.

Sunday July 22nd I bought an Audi A3 (2006) for my pregnant wife to use as her family car when the baby comes later this year. 63,000 miles (petrol) and we paid £4,100 cash. Car drove fine in test drive, no problems mentioned by the dealer. During the drive home the ESP light came on fleetingly and my wife said she felt like she lost power; I spoke to the dealer and they said it was likely as the car had not been driven for a while and it was blowing the 'cobwebs out' (I realise how ridiculous this may sound to people who know about cars; I am unfortunately not one of these people).

2 days later the car has lost power again when my wife is parking, she has pressed the accelerator and it has lurched toward (it's an auto) causing the door to be scratched/dented slightly.

I have called the dealer and they have asked me to bring the car in which I will be doing tomorrow. In the mean time I have taken the car to a garage I trust and they have told me the car has numerous fault codes on it one of which is for ignition coils 1 & 4 misfiring.

This morning when driving the car myself the ABS light has come on along with a large exclamation mark on the dash and the warning 'BRAKES'.

My question is what shall I do and what legal rights do i have for having the car repaired? The door damage I'm happy to cover myself and I've had a quote for £200 with a local body shop we just want the engine issues sorted. We have spent £350 on tyres and alignment as well as tax for the month and insurance so returning the car for a refund wouldn't be great particularly with the complication of the door damage.

All going well they will be reasonable and repair the car for us tomorrow but I would like to know what my rights are should they refuse.

Thank you in advance.

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 20:38
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - SLO76
I know it's a petrol but which engine is in it?
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Mon 31 Jul 2017 20:42
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott
1.6
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Mon 31 Jul 2017 20:48
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - SLO76
Is it the basic 1.6 or FSi?
At this age it'll be the older torque converter box and not the later and notoriously troublesome S-tronic too unless I'm mistaken?
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Mon 31 Jul 2017 21:10
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott
1.6 mpi - reading around I suspect possibly the ABS pump sensor has gone causing ESP issues? This is widely reported

Edited by Scott Elliott on 31/07/2017 at 21:12

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 21:22
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott
Really what I'm hoping to find out is if the dealer won't repair the car can I have it repaired elsewhere and recoup the costs?
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Mon 31 Jul 2017 21:32
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - SLO76
The ABS control module is a very common failure on VAG cars of this age. There are firms that can repair them rather than going to the cost of buying one new from Audi but it's the dealers responsibility to do so or refund you if this is found to be what is wrong. They need to have a chance to properly diagnose and fix it, you can't just fix it elsewhere and send them the bill.

www.s*******.co.uk/volkswagen-audi-abs-fault-brake-pressure-sensor-failure/

Don't know why that link isn't working but google is your friend.

Edited by SLO76 on 31/07/2017 at 21:35

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 21:41
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott

Thank you very much. So all going well they will fix the issue for me and failing that i can have it repaired myself elsewhere and persue the costs. This is what i was hoping to hear.

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 21:59
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - SLO76

Thank you very much. So all going well they will fix the issue for me and failing that i can have it repaired myself elsewhere and persue the costs. This is what i was hoping to hear.

No you can't just have it repaired then persue them for the cost, it doesn't work like that I'm afraid. If you've owned it less than 30 days you can reject it for a full refund but beyond this you have to allow them one chance to fix it first before further action. Give them a chance to see what they'll do. If you'd bought it from me I'd fix it or refund it rather than lose face and future custom.
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Mon 31 Jul 2017 23:39
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Miniman777

Give the OP has had the car 12 days, I'd reject it outright.Get advice from Trading Standards.

Reject now - not in a week or two when a fix becomes the only option. Too many issues beginning to show and dealer is fobbing OP off with any old rubbish. 63k miles on an 11 year old car is very low, and has it been verified?

It's worth adding that non-franchised dealers offer warranties from this and that provider, but history has these has shown that many of these are pretty worthless with the warranty company weedling out of the claim. Non-car folk may think £1000 parts and labour cover is OK, but on a modern car doesnt go very far when there is a serious engine or gearbox faults, and furthermore wont cover existing faults at sale time. Call me cynical, but how can the OP be assured the dealer will deal with the ESP fault correctly and not take the bulb out, for example?

While appreciating the OP is not car savvy, spending £350 on tyres and alignment immediately after purchase is pointing to 'money pit', sadly. And were the tyre suspect too?

I feel desperately sorry for people in situations like this who know nothing about cars, dont have a friend who does and are feed a line of smooth patter by the salesman, keen to offload something he knows is potentially suspect. And it's usually bought by people with limited incomes or tight budgets too. Criminal.

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 00:28
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott

Hello there - thank you for the reply. How would rejecting the car work with the damage to the door?

Edited by Scott Elliott on 01/08/2017 at 00:28

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Mon 31 Jul 2017 23:44
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott

Okay thanks again, I'll see what they say. The only thing with a refund would be the door damage and also the fact that we have spent around £400 on tyres and tax and insurance so definitely going to come out way behind if we can even get a full refund. Will report back, thanks for your insights.

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 08:32
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Bromptonaut

Citizens Advice info on troublesome sh cars:

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repai.../

Or phone the helpline 03454 04 05 06

Edited by Bromptonaut on 01/08/2017 at 08:34

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 16:19
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - pd

Citizens Advice info on troublesome sh cars:

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repai.../

Or phone the helpline 03454 04 05 06

Which is all pretty useless advice from CA in many respects. What people want advice on is questions like "the car I have bought has done 88715 miles and is 8.4 years old and the secondary air injection pump is bringing up the engine mangement light - is this something which makes the car unsatisfactory or simply deemed a minor fault which is to be expected in such a car?".

This is why the whole thing is a mess because no one can really answer and if you ask 5 people you will get 5, usualy non-commital, answers.

Edited by pd on 01/08/2017 at 16:19

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 14:35
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott

Hello there so i have dropped the car in today to be looked at and he has rang me back 2 hours later and said he has put a new alternator in and this should fix the issue; he is claiming a dodgy alternator was the cause of the warning lights coming up. This is the line he gave me when i dropped it off before he even took a look so it seems suspect (possibly he has simply cleared the codes and is now giving me the car back?)

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 15:23
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - skidpan

We have spent £350 on tyres and alignment

Why on earth would you buy a car from a dealer that needed new tyres and alignment with 2 weeks of getting it.

Since it was your choice to spend that money there is no way you will get it back even if you reject the car.

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 18:05
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott
The car needed 4 new tyres I was well aware of this when I bought it and negotiated the price, I took it straight down the tyre shop and put new ones on it. I also took an alignment package for up to 8 alignments in 2 years as it's my wife's first car and she's likely to bang it off a few curbs. I fail to see how this action exposes me to the ESP light and ABS lights subsequently coming on?
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Tue 1 Aug 2017 16:14
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - pd

Personally, bearing in mind the age of the car I don't think you are at the stage where you have a good case for rejection. It is a typical fault of a 10 year old car and you need to prove that it was somehow something extraordinary to be able to reject. A dodgy ESP/ABS system probably isn't, assuming that is what it is.

As regards the fix it will either work or not. Low or high voltage can cause electrical gremlins so is plausable but a failing ESP ECU is probably more likely. Try it, if it works then all good, if not take it back again.

As to your actual "rights" no one can give you a firm answer. It is all lost in the definition of "reasonablness" and if you get 10 people in a room you will get 10 views of what a 10 year old car will be like ranging from basically like new to at the end of design life and basically scrap. The range of views you will get here demonstrates that.

I don't rate Citizens Advice on subjects such as this as the chances are anyone who givea advice will be completely lost with the details and range fof standards of older used cars. In fact, in my experience, they are more misleadfing than helpful.

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Tue 1 Aug 2017 16:55
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - SLO76

Hello there so i have dropped the car in today to be looked at and he has rang me back 2 hours later and said he has put a new alternator in and this should fix the issue; he is claiming a dodgy alternator was the cause of the warning lights coming up. This is the line he gave me when i dropped it off before he even took a look so it seems suspect (possibly he has simply cleared the codes and is now giving me the car back?)

Easy enough to spot a new alternator and it is plausible. But yes it's not uncommon for dealers to simply clear any fault codes and hope you'll just st go away. I'm hoping this chap is trying to do the right thing however.
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Tue 1 Aug 2017 18:16
Audi A3 - Second hand car troubles - rights? - Scott Elliott

Hi thanks again for your reply. Is there anything i can get from the dealer in writing which confirms that I've taken the car into him with these issues and he has fitted a new alternator? I'm just concerned that if the problems persist and it doesnt turn out to be the ABS pump sensor then I would like something to show it's been an issue since the moment i bought the car. Also where is your dealership based? If your online persona is anything to go by i should have been buying a car from you in the first place!

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