Honest Richards car empire got quite a bit of press attention at the end of November 2002, with free publicity on the Watchdog programme and promises from their CEO Ian Lancaster that things would get better. Whilst many of you may consider my ramblings "selfish" as I only talk about my experience, you may wish to consider my situation if a purchase from Virgin Cars is on your list of priorities.
I ordered a vehicle at the end of May 02, with delivery indicated at 18 weeks - early October 02. Initial order payment of £100 and deposit of over £3,000 (15%) were paid within 24 hours of receiving notification. The initial emails were promising, highlighting the stages involved, but it all got a little worrying when I didn't get any info for over eight weeks in June/July 02!
Then they dropped the big one - "production delays" - your car won't be delivered until late December 2002. Many enquiries, emails, letters to their CEO resulted in the lame excuse of their franchised dealer forgetting to take account of the summer factory shutdown. A well informed dealer I thought!
OK, no problems, until they sort of indicated the delivery would probably be after Christmas because they [Virgin] forgot to take account of the holidays. This would have been a reasonable excuse in their first year of trading, but not in 2002. Laughable!
Still got emails saying late December 02, until late November 02 when they requested the final balance (approx £19,000) in writing, saying the vehicle would be ready in FOUR weeks (i.e. around Christmas). Excellent I thought. Let's not delay it any further, so I paid £25 and got the bank to send the money right away using CHAPS. They duly acknowledged receipt and I thought yippee, at last I may see my new car.
Nearing the end of the four weeks, I sold my old car using Autotrader (found a buyer in 2 days, paid cash, excellent!), only to find out the next day that Virgin hadn't actually collected my car from the continent and wouldn't be doing so until early January 2003!
I hit the roof.
Time to try and get some assistance from young Sir Richard as well as trying yet again to get a personal response from Ian Lancaster, the CEO of Virgin Cars. I duly wrote to his Virgin Management address in London hoping for a swift reply.
Yet again, Mr Lancaster delegated his reply to a colleague. More apologies and promises that they would be monitoring the situation personally [rather than waiting for their Logica implemented customer management system to send out automated standard letters and responses].
A day after they were supposed to collect the car from Spain, I called Virgin to ensure this had happened. As expected, IT HADN'T, due to severe weather on the french-spanish border, and they wouldn't know until a week later.
Since I had only had a holding reply from Virgin Management, I called their offices and was told that the lady dealing with the situation was away... Strangely enough though, I got a voicemail from some senior exec in Virgin a day later saying that they'd call back later in the day - they didn't though.
So here I am, having to hire a car until Virgin can actually deliver a vehicle I was originally promised some THREE months ago.
No car.
No money.
And a garage full of special accessories ready for installation.
Oh yes, to top it all, they'd quite happily refund all the monies I've paid to date. Well that's just brilliant, considering that they'd sell it to someone else anyway, probably for a higher price due to the shorter lead time. I won't let them get away with it.
Any ideas on what I should do?
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Take your money back before they go bust!
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As consumers, we happily sign contracts with minimal alteration when presented to us by suppliers. A simple penalty clause for late delivery would have concentrated the thoughts of Mr Branston's minions.
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Sorry to those who just lost a note. However, T.Lucs - your reply was so ridiculous that I just was not going to let it stand, so I removed the relevant thread parts.
If you have something useful to say, then by all means do so. But if you have nothing useful to say, then say nothing.
Mark.
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Strange that they ask for full payment even before the car was actually in the UK.
Your story is not uncommon though.Actually only 3 months late is quite good compared to some stories i've read in motoring press . Friend at work had a Golf which was 6 months late.....
I dont understand why people use brokers because its so simple to go direct to the dealer abroad. Most speak perfect English and are wise to the UK import business.
Hope it turns up soon.....
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While it is annoying to get a delayed delivery date it is nothing unusual whether buying though a main dealer or the internet. Your mistake was selling your car before delivery. good savings can be made via the internet but press coverage has highlighted the pitfalls, be patient.
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I can really sympathise with the message because I had a similar experience with Vigin Cars and ended up without a car for approx six weeks (the order was ten weeks late).
I also wrote to Ian Lancaster but got a delegated reply from someone else. I also wrote emails and letters to the general address, which were not replied to.
When I submitted my order (approx 2 years ago), there was no cash refund although you could order a readily available car. However as I was happy with my car specification and the price (about 13% off), I just waited.
Having read further correspondance on this topic in magazines and websites, although it was incredibly frustrating at the time, I was very lucky only to be 10 weeks late (there appear to be some people who are approaching a year in arrears).
My advice would be to hang in there and wait unless you feel that by getting the funds back and going to another importer, you feel you can beat the residual lead-time for delivery you have left.
Good luck on it anyway
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Something I can't understand here.
If you're dealing with a solvent company why should you ever need to pay more than a nominal deposit (£250-£500) at the point of ordering and then pay the balance once you see and inspect the vehicle ready for delivery??
MM
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Exactly. No way would I part with money before getting the goods! Unless it goes into a holding account out of the clutches of creditors, in case the Co. goes down.
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Pay your deposit on a credit card, then you get the card company directly involved in the finances of the transaction, including protection in the event of insolvency, IIRC
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It does say in their documentation that you settle the final balance about three to four weeks before you get the car. I assume this allows them to pay their dealer abroad, inspect the car, transfer it to the UK and deliver it. In my case it did work and three weeks later my car was delivered (although it does take a leap of faith to sign what was the biggest cheque of my life for something that was not even in the country).
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Yes indeed. The first documentation we had in May 02 said get the car after three weeks. It is now six plus weeks. I have little faith in Branson's enterprise actually delivering. [A thought: since they're only agents, the car is now mine and I could legally go and collect it from the supplying dealer...!]
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MM,
I assume that, very unfairly, Virgin want the money up front to pay the supplying dealer so as to have the car released to them. That way, they avoid any substantial outlay or risk of their own whilst generating a very nice income.
It is my view that full payment shouldn't be made to the intermediary until the vehicle is in front of you, ready for delivery. Alternatively, the money should be paid to the original supplying dealer, not to the intermediary, and the contract should make it clear that the car is *your* property immediately upon such payment.
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What about complaining to the DTI?? This fiasco has gone on too long with a large number of people suffering due to broken promises courtesy of Virgin. I am no lawyer, but if I am not mistaken, if the seller has breached his part of the deal, the buyer has the right to claim damages. Yes, this will involve going to courts, but until one of us goes to courts and gets something done about it, Virgin will keep on repeating this. Mind you these days courts will award damages for almost anything such as mental trauma due to not receiving car, all expenses involved in hiring a replacement vehicle, loss of interest on amounts paid, expenses on the effort put in etc??. I think its time Virgin was told enough is enough.
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Trading Standards aren't really too interested in this game as they are agents, but more importantly Virgin don't specify an actual date so the "time of the essence" consumer protection doesn't really work. But at least they will register the complaint. Alternatively, www.consumercomplaints.org.uk will take submissions I believe.
Tried the DTI - they won't deal in individual cases - though if enough of us get together, some pressure could be applied.
Others also suggest registering a complaint with www.ripoff-tipoff.net.
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Marcus's version is much easier to read, but doesn't work
www.ripofftipoff.net
Could you issue a County Court claim (small claim) against Virgin for losses e,g, car hire. All the forms are easily found on the web.
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The problem is that you only authorise Virgin to purchase a car abroad on your behalf, so your contract with them is quite limited. You could give it a try, but I suspect they would just offer you your money back.
I ordered a Focus TDCi from Virgin in March on 11 weeks delivery, got it in November. What became clear was that Virgin were clearly finding it very difficult to source these cars yet they were still promising wildly optimistic delivery times (cf oneswoop at 26 weeks).
I suspect that Car Manufacturers don't want to make the process of buying a new car cheaper abroad too easy, so they restrict the supply of RHD vehicles to mainland EU dealers. So you have to be prepared for some waiting even if you buy it yourself.
Hang on and think of the money you are saving.
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I thought the EU regulations prevented manufacturers from behaving in that way and restricting supply of rhd vehicles?
teabelly
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For all of those out there looking to use an import company, and find they're reluctant to divulge the supplying dealer, I was advised to send them a SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST as per the Data Protection Act. You may have to pay a little bit (a few quid), but at least you have all the facts to hand... also if they're using some flashy software to record and manage all their customers calls, you should also get a print out of that because it is personal information.
I can publish a standard letter if you require.
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