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"Does this mean that the next generation of cars will be without foglamps?"
I think it could well do. I suspect that in may cases front foglamps are largely ornamental, and do very little that a sst of good headlampd can't.
Anyone seeing this care to mount a defence of foglamps (front ones, that is - I don't think anyone would quarrel with the usefulness of rear foglamps, although I question the parentage of people who use them in heavy rain rather than fog)?
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My current and last cars had them, but the number of times I actually used them is probably in single figures. Because I only by used, if it ain't got them, I ain't going to fork out several hundred quid to have them fitted - it's just another expensive bit of glass/plastic for stones to smash in to.
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I think it could well do. I suspect that in may cases front foglamps are largely ornamental, and do very little that a sst of good headlampd can't.
The main advantage is that fog lamps are (should be) fitted much closer to the road than headlamps. This means that when driving in fog at night, the road is lit, but there is markedly less light reflected back to the driver being off-axis.
We only get really bad fog for a few days a year here, but when we do it's real pea-soup stuff. I would hate to be stranded at night with a car without front fogs - even the Fabia has them, and I think it's got one of the best non-Xenon headlight setups I've driven.
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>>rear foglamps, although I question the parentage of people who use them in heavy rain rather than fog
Their use is permitted during reduced visibility. I'll use mine mostly, but not exclusively, on motorways when spray causes problems. I started doing this when I witnessed the improvement it gave as a vehicle disappears into the mist as it overtakes lorries.
I suspect a major problem is the proximity of the rear fog light switch to the heated rear window switch, the driver not knowing or understanding what they do and not recognising the warning light, so they put them on at random. I know at least one driver in this category.
If you wish to continue questioning my parentage, I can produce their marriage certificate. ;>)
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The last time I used fog lights(with head lights) I was driving home, cautiously, in fog with snow and mud along the road edges. An oncoming car zipped past and smashed my door mirror.
I'm not impressed with fog lights.
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>>rear foglamps, although I question the parentage of people who use them in heavy rain rather than fog
For the above reason, I think that rear fog lights should be banned. I can see the merits of having a brighter lamp in seriously reduced visibility..but...many people abuse the damned things by having them on when they shouldn't, which has the effect of blinding people behind them or giving the following driver an irritatingly bright focal point to put them off everything else they should be looking at.
I'd include rainy conditions in that. Rear fog lights prevent you from noticing brake lights as quickly as you could.
On very foggy roads, you shouldn't be driving fast anyway, so the need for a brighter lamp would to some degree be negated, as you shouldn't be catching people up all that quickly.
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I'd ban rear fog lamps. They are truly awful things most of the time, because of their constant misuse..and...for me, that includes rain.
They mask brake lamps and provide an irritatingly bright focal point, that can have you potentially miss other things.
On the occasions they are relevant, you shouldn't be driving very fast anyway, so catching someone up in a pea souper shouldn't be that much of a drama.
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It's illegal to use fog lamps in this country unless visibility is less than 100m and I doubt that occurs very frequently. Trouble is people don't know how to use them and will have them on with the headlights or use them all the time as if they were auxiliary lights. Rear fog lamps are more useful if used correctly.
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All of my cars have pairs of foglamps mounted high up or even in the main light clusters, leading to then looking very much like brakelights. A single low mounted foglamp is a much better idea but less aesthetic to the overall design of the car, although the Focus seems to achieve it nicely.
I will only put them on in extreme conditions, and a nice touch in the Audi is that I cannot turn off my lights without the foglights also going off, never to come back on again unless I specifically do so. Why all cars cannot have this design feature I do not know. "Stay on" foglights combined with paired layouts are in my opinion anyway, the biggest problem.
Given that car designers can do such wonderful things with suspension and handling setups that accommodate (keep alive) the most stupid of drivers, why they can't also do the same for foglight abusers is curious.
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Westpig wrote:
On the occasions they are relevant, you shouldn't be driving very fast anyway, so catching someone up in a pea souper shouldn't be that much of a drama
I recall driving on the M3, waayy back in the mid-90's, in fog so dense I felt uneasy at about 20mph, only to have various BMWs flash past me so fast I suspected they must be equipped with thermal imaging.
Or maybe they were just running on that lovely assumption that all motorways are safe and have no obstacles on them.
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I can think of worse, in vogue extras we don't need. For example - headlamp washers.
When was the last time you drove anywhere and thought "God that trip was hairy! My headlamps were filthy!".
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Several occasions when the roads have been plastered with rocksalt and it's been around freezing. The light output from the headlights plummeted. Wiping with a tissue helped for only a short while.Very unpleasant trips.
Yet to be established if the headlight washers on my Skoda are actualy effective. They come on , like it or not, every few washes when headlights are on.
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I think its been mentioned in prior BR threads, if the fog lights are on the car should be speed restricted, no need for fast speeds if they are really being used for their purpose. There should also be big fines for using them when not required, a few more police checks would be a good thing in my eyes.
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When was the last time you drove anywhere and thought "God that trip was hairy! My headlamps were filthy!".
I think the issue is that UK weather is generally quite temperate - it doesn't get that cold, it doesn't get that hot, it doesn't often rain or snow very heavily, thunderstorms aren't really that big a deal, and fog is rarely thick enough to need a rear fog light.
For the rest of us in Europe or further afield, the weather is much more extreme, unpredictable and dangerous. That's where those extras become essentials.
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Ah bathtub, so you're one of those idiots that blinds following drivers for no reason, a bit of (even bad) spray does not justify the use of rear fog lights, they invariably mean your brake lights are invisible to the following driver. Rear fog lights are for extremely foggy situations as a last resort to give the guy behind some chance of seeing you in pea-soup conditions. Rear fog lights are so abused - I agree - they should be banned.
Front ones work for the reasons given by someone else above, you are lighting the road up whilst reducing reflected glare - something even the best modern projector-beam headlights cannot do as they are mounted too high up.
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