Hi,
This is my first experience with a diesel so I feel I may be missing something stupid!
Last week it rained buckets, and my Aux belt started to slip, and I saw the battery light more and more. Eventually, the car lost power, stopped and refused to start again.
I got a tow home, on the way I tried starting again under tow, and got it to start for a second then it died again.
Got it home and saw that the auxillary belt was not straight on the crankshaft pulley - was about one rib rubbing against the timing belt cover. I decided the aux belt may be harming the crankshaft pulley bearing by rubbing the timing belt cover and hence adding excess pressure so I cut it off. Car still didn't start - but now I guessed the battery was pretty dead.
I charged the battery overnight - but still no joy! Am I missing something - as far as I can tell, theres nothing powered from the aux belt that should stop the car starting (Alternator, Air con, power steering is all?) I checked all plugs in the vicinity and nothing looks loose. Found fuel inertia switch had popped up and reset but still no joy - car turns over really fast - see almost 500rpm on the speedo but nothing!
The other odd / ominous thing - the aux belt looked in good condition, but I can see big chunks of rubber on the crankshaft pulley that I originally thought to be from the aux belt - not sure where these have come from...
I did take the oil filler cap and gently turn it over to see the cams turning so I believe the timing belt is ok.
Any ideas - please tell me if I am being stupid if I shouldnt expect the car to start till I replace the aux belt!?
Edited by Pugugly on 18/11/2009 at 10:14
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I'm not an expert by any means, although I did run an '03 406 2.0HDi for a couple of years (*shudders*). I would say the engine management is "detecting" an idle alternator and is refusing to allow the engine to start for that reason. You're going to have to fit a new aux belt anyway so you may as well do it as part of the diagnostic procedure.
Hth.
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Each to his own I guess...
The big worry on an HDi is a disintegrating aux belt taking out the timing belt, if there are bits of belt floating about then I'd check the cam timing. It "should" run with the aux belt disconnected...
Oh, and stop trying to start it until you're sure about the cam timing...
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As it is turning over fast I suspect the timing belt is the problem. Best to check that first. Regards Peter
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I'm not familiar with the PUG setup re-crank sensor, but if the Aux belt was rubbing the timing belt cover then it may have been rubbing on the crankshaft sensor and destroyed it. Then there is the question, was the belt fitted wrong or has it somehow jumped across a groove due to it being loose or the pulleys misaligned.
Edited by kith on 18/11/2009 at 13:23
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Crank sensor is the other end on the bellhousing.
I'm with Peter here - the aux belt has almost certainly got in behind the cover and caused the cambelt to jump some teeth. Odds on if the rocker cover is taken off, 2 or more broken rockers will be revealed. Fit new rockers (fish all the broken bits / needle rollers out of the cam box!), fit new timing belt with correct timing, fit new crank pulley (as this is quite likely the cause of the original failure), and new aux belt, and all should be good. The design of the 2.0 8V HDi engine is such that cam belt failure breaks rockers rather than bending valves, so the head doesn't need to be lifted.
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Hi all,
Thanks for your replies - I'm quite reassured now that a timing belt problem won't have mashed the valves!
I'm still not so sure that this is a timing belt problem - when I cut off the aux belt it was "as new" not torn or otherwise. It had jumped a tooth - more detailed examination has found a piece of rubber (not from a belt, but looks more like a retaining rubber from the rad hose that runs by there) nearby melted on the crank pulley - I think this came loose, got caught in the aux belt and caused the belt to misalign on the crank pulley.
So there was no piece of belt to get into the timing belt - plus the timing belt cover is completely intact - I dont see how anything could get in there?
Although there does still remain the possibility of the timing belt failing all on its own - this is a X reg car with original belt, but has only covered 56K, so I was saving up my pennies to get the belt done at the next service (but perhaps now I will get it done sooner regardless of the problem...)
I hope to take off the rocker cover tonight or tomorrow to reveal all...
Any other ideas that may stop starting?
Edited by MikeyS on 18/11/2009 at 18:37
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ok - despite my trying to remain hopeful it looks like the timing belt has slipped!
On taking the rocker cover off I discovered 4 of the valve rockers have been destroyed - at least I know the problem.
Can anyone give me a guesstimate of the cost Im looking at from a garage (parts & labour). I guess I need:
4 new rockers & accs
New Timing belt fitted and timed up
New Aux Belt
Not really confident enough to try this myself!
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I'd add to the list a water pump, crank pulley and oil & filter change. Maybe a timing belt tensioner too though that is a part of a timing belt kit if you buy the parts that way.
Steve.
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Just over £ 450 at a guess.
£ 280 for water pump and timing belt and aux belt leaving a £ 170 for the rest.
good luck and I hope all goes well.
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Hi All,
Thanks for your knowledge!
I am just a little worried about how likely I have caused damage within the cylinders (if the valves were bent I guess I would see it, but I imagine that I could well have damaged the valve head and / or the tops of the pistons).
Is there any way of gauging the likely damage without lifting the head. My strategy for now is to fix the valve rockers etc, fit new timing belt and pulleys and try and start it up - I guess before i do this i can check the compression ratios.
Does anyone have knowledge of the innards of this engine with respect to valve clearances in the cylinder etc - I have been trying to start this engine quite a bit so I'm imagining the damage is as extensive as it is possible to be.
Toying with the idea of buying a recon engine and fitting instead - looks like I can get an engine for around £400, and with a bit of help could probably do this myself.
Any views and experience on any of this appreciated!
Thanks,
Mike
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your first course of action has to be remove crankshaft pulley bolt 22 mm socket
withdraw ckt pulley its the only way you can you can get the shredded bits of your
aux belt if these are not removed they will certainly snap your timing belt You could
at this stage remove front timing cover 10mm socket. Next remove rocker cover
5mm allen key and check forany broken valve rockers. If your timing marks check
out ok then the non start could be caused by other problems. Ie fuel cam sensor
wiring please post engine code
reguards Mickeybo
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