I won't go into this in too much detail, but basically I have got a car that has been seriously clocked and initially the "small-time" dealer refused to take it back - now he says he will LESS £300 "for inconvenience and hassle". Regardless, I know my rights (I've had the car less than a week) and whether he knew about it or not the car is not "as advertised".
I have also since discovered that the current MOT according to VOSA website is showing as a PETROL model not DIESEL. Although on the reverse of the doc it says if you have reason to believe it was issued incorrectly you have to contact them within 30 days. It is just over that period now but surely they should be interested in this? Maybe this is a simple error on the part of the station but surely this also invalidates the MOT?
I've been in bits about this and very upset so please no lectures.. just tea, sympathy and good advice please. xx
Sam
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good advice please. xx Sam >>
contact www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/ for advice. They are very helpful by all accounts.
And xx to you too! ;-)
Edited by jbif on 22/10/2009 at 21:05
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My huge sympathies to you.
I don't see why you should pay £300. Any inconvenience and hassle is purely of the dealer's own making. The fact that he firstly refused to take back the car and has now changed his mind suggests to me he knows he hasn't a leg to stand on.
Be firm, stick to your guns, don't get angry and try not to let it get to you.
Best of luck!
Edited by ChrisPeugeot on 22/10/2009 at 21:29
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Trading Standards should be a good avenue to go down too. Once someone of authority has put a bit of pressure on this 'dealer' I dare say he will buckle and give you a full refund. Don't accept anything less, get your money back and walk away - do not buy anything else from him!
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Thank you
I have been keeping an eye on what he is selling; mainly through Gumtree. I notice some of the vehicles are Cat D, mine wasn't but that didn't stop him from selling me a clocked motor. Although Trading Standards are helpful he told me today he would not accept the car back at all and just to take him to court, as he wouldn't take it back without the log book which I don't have yet and probably won't for weeks.
Like you say why should he get away with this. He doesn't know the law clearly or chooses not to...
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Get some big mates to have a word with him, if they turn up on motorbikes, so much the better.
Often saves loads of time, I believe !
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hi.on the odd occasion ive been involved with trading standards ive found them pretty useless.
its simplicity itself to issue a claim through the small claims court .the cost to you is about £90 ,thats all you risk.The other party cannot claim for expenses,legal or otherwise.
If the dealer has sold you a clocked car , and you can prove it,hes commited a criminal offense as well as a civil one ,If you think he has money to refund /reimburse you ,issue a writ in the small claims court .If he doesnt attend ,the court bailiffs will seize his property and auction it to pay you . Also because its an offense of deception call in to your local police station . Dealers haver no defense against selling a clocked car,the law says that they should always make the checks .Its a pain ,but do pursue this dealer.
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well first thing i would do before anything is sound the mot station out
they have the most to lose if they have tested a cloned car
they might even buy the car off the customer to keep a clean slate
any mot station worth its salt wont deal with a dodgy clocking motor trader
go there to morrow daisy lee and sound them out
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I don't actually think he himself clocked it, but I can't be sure. He has no excuses as you say he should have checked it all out. I did, (albeit a bit too late)
Now he is claiming not to be a dealer
BUT I HAVE SEEN ALL HIS OTHER ADS ON GUMTREE and it's listed as TRADE.. I've saved them, and they are still on there.
Spineless **** has now spoken with my other half and says he'll take the car back less £500!!
With regards to the small claims I have gone through this before and it is long and drawn out, but I think I will pursue it anyway and also pay the peelers a visit too. I'm not sure about the MOT station it may well have been an honest mistake but does it invalidate the MOT? I have yet to ring the number on the back.
Thank you x
daisy lee aka miss scatty
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I agree with the other chaps, grit your teeth and get him through small claims. By the way you save £5 if you do it online. NO MERCY.
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...no mercy...
A lot of people on here are urging the OP to pursue this hard, go to court and so on.
All bread and circuses for us bystanders, but there is stress and aggro involved and it might not turn out as well for the OP as you all think.
Refund less a few hundred quid seems quite attractive to me.
No hassle, line drawn, move on, and look forward to choosing the next car, hopefully making a better job of it.
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"Peace in our time"
Let it go this time, let it go next time, let it go forever.
If we all took your advice, dodgy dealers would have a field day.
Sometimes you just have to stand up and fight.
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I'd be far more stressed by losing £x00 to some pond-life dealer than I would by following a legitimate case through the Small Claim Track of the County Court!
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Refund less a few hundred quid seems quite attractive to me.
Full refund sounds even better. If this shark pulls a scam like this habitually, the same car could earn him 'a few hundred' every few months. Nice work if you can get away with it.
Why should the OP pay x-hundred for the inconvenience? The dealer should pay her for (perhaps unknowingly) selling an overpriced car.
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There is another tactic I would be considering.
Accept the partial refund and then sue the dealer for the amount withheld.
Far better to only 'bet' £300 or £500 at court than the whole cost of the car.
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SFAIK Small Claims fees do not exceed £100 max - they were nowhere near that when I used the system and in any event, if you win you get your fees paid by the person against whom you are claiming. I do not see how OP can lose this case, on the reported facts, if they pursue it. What do DVD or PU think?
Edited by Armitage Shanks {p} on 24/10/2009 at 16:49
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.. I do not see how OP can lose this case, on the reported facts, if they pursue it....
AS,
Long experience of the courts has taught me how unwise it is to make bold predictions.
If the OP loses the case, she is stuck with the car.
If she accepts the partial refund she is rid of the car and has lost a maximum of £3/500, which it might be possible to recover.
It is not good tactics to stake the whole price of the car at court, when you only have to stake a few hundred.
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I can only speak from my own experience and a clear case of wrongdoing by a person with whom I had had dealings was recognised in court with appropriate financial compensation and costs paid to me. These people will try it on and win because the public give up and the nasties win by default not by the merit of their case. I had a recent successful foray with the Financial Services Ombudsman and was amazed to find that 75% of Barclays customers who complained got a ruling in their favour and a staggering 95% of Lloyds Black Horse complainants also got a favourable ruling. Does anybody reading this thread think that OP has been treated honestly or fairly or legally, on the facts reported?
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Your call to consumer direct may be the tipping point for the "home" Trading Standards covering his area to launch an investigation into the dealer. It is normal for the local TS to speak to the dealer regarding a complaint of this nature. However, if there are 1/2 dozen or so recent complaints, they may descend on him. TS have enormous powers to enter a business premises and seize documents, computers etc. Refusal to hand over what is required is an obstruction and, itself, prosecutable.
Best of luck
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You're very upset about it, and so would I be in your situation. However, there are times when it's better to forget one's rights and take the easy way out. It sounds like a very messy affair, and £300 may be a small price to pay to get yourself out of it. It's worth thinking about. Peace of mind is worth a lot.
Edited by L'escargot on 24/10/2009 at 16:59
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I still think a few hefty mates and a "quiet word" would sort this out in no time.
Risky ? maybe, but sometimes it's the only thing that these people understand.
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I still think a few hefty mates and a "quiet word" would sort this out in no time.
Not to be recommended. What if his mates are bigger than you mates? Then you might have much bigger problems!
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...Risky ? maybe, but sometimes it's the only thing that these people understand...
You never know what you might be taking on.
Historically, dodgy motor traders have connections with the criminal underworld for the supply of 'wheels' - getaway and general purpose.
When I worked for a franchise dealer, one of the traders left a sawn-off shotgun in the boot of a car he had borrowed, supposedly to get bids on.
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Take some advice before launching into legal action. If the dealer followed the disclaimer procedure for the mileage and did not specifically tell you the mileage was genuine then you may not have a good case.
Many dealers (including franchised ones) follow a very strict set of rules to leave them little reponsibility on mileage by basically saying in the small print that the car is sold with the mileage incorrect.
Whether you have a case or not depends on how the car was presented and what your invoice days.
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You are dealing here with a thug get your 300 pound or whatever and walk away.Small claims courts or whatever it will go over him ,i have met these type of people not worth it and your health is more inportant.
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Just tell the guy you will not pay him £300 but want all your cash back or you will report him to trading standards.... probably better by recorded delivery.
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barney with respect do you honestly believe this now non trader will be interested in a letter from trading standards?
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Currently, my partner is pursuing an ex "friend" through the courts; it has been horrendous as they claim poverty even though we know it's not the case; finally an attachment of earnings order was placed on them, but it's taken nearly 2 years to get it. It seems that just because you get a judgement placed in your favour, it DOES NOT guarantee a payout back. I know they would find in my favour but it is really a hideous process.
I am inclined to take the money but I am not prepared to forgo the 500, he isn't what I consider to be an "underworld" dealer, I feel more someone who has tried to make a quick buck at selling a few cars and has come unstuck; like some others have said he could do this many times over a returned car, nice little earner.
what we have decided to do is to go down, get our initial money and get the rest from him another way.. not sure which way yet but he hasn't met my other half...lol
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I am inclined to take the money but I am not prepared to forgo the 500,
£300 from your initial post? Or is it now £500?
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>> I am inclined to take the money but I am not prepared to forgo the 500 £300 from your initial post? Or is it now £500?
its all in the fred rtj 70
good on yer daisy lee
hope everything goes cool :-)
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He initially said £300 when I first spoke to him Wednesday,
But yesterday rose the figure to £500 after speaking to my fella.
He is planning to sell the car on!!!
He can get *********
It's just wrong, wrong wrong.
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Hi everyone
I just wanted to update this thread.
Took the car back and got all my money back less £500 of it.
He knows full well the cars history as I made it quite clear to him, sob story followed about how the person he bought it off had been very bad to him, and he was seriously out of pocket.
Well, guess what, as we speak the same car is back up for sale on Gumtree for even more that what I bought it for. Thieving pink fluffy dice, same "clocked" mileage, everything.
While according to the Police they can't arrest someone for selling a clocked car (as they can't prove who did it) they can if that person KNOWS.
What goes around comes around.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 31/10/2009 at 17:16
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Are you presuing the £500 through small claims court?
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Pursue him all the way. If not he will only do it over and over again. At the minute he has made a tidy £500 profit out of you.
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Get your £500 quid back or get a tin of nitromors, then one dark night......................
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Local paper would love a story about dodgy dealer knowingly selling a clocked car. Put the scumbag out of business with any luck.
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Unless of course he advertises in it........
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