Some of my friends have children of varying ages from 1 to 8 years old.
Some of them do not own a car and sometimes I do carry their children in my car without any child seat (short distances within town, not on motorways)
[1] Am I breaking the law? Can I be prosecuted?
[2] What is the law exactly? I don't see any point buying child seats which I use only rarely
[3] People don't use child seats in taxis. Are they specially exempted?
If I'm breaking the law, what is the best approach for me? Polite refuse carry their children?
Any suggestions welcome.
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Yes, you are breaking the law. If your vehicle is physically capable of taking appropriate child seats or restraints, you must not carry children without them. I believe there is a specific exemption concerning taxis.
RoSPA's website is an excellent source of impartial advice (and sobering facts) on these matters.
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Any child under the age of 12 or 135cm in height must use an appropriate child restraint or seat, by law. This is enforced by a fine of up to £500!
All you need to know (and the exceptions) are explained fully here:
www.childcarseats.org.uk/law/index.htm
Edited by DP on 05/05/2009 at 21:19
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I do carry .. children in my car without any child seat (short distances within town not on motorways) [1] Am I breaking the law? Can I be prosecuted?
Quite likely, but not necessarily.
If I'm breaking the law what is the best approach for me? Polite refuse carry their children?
Get them to buy a booster seat and carry it in the boot.
www.dft.gov.uk/think/focusareas/children/childinca...w
Note, if you arrange beforehand to take the child(ren) in your car, you need a seat.
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We keep a couple of cheap booster seats in the garage as we shift grandkids about once a week. They collect and return their seats, and would not dream of getting in a car and not putting on seatbelts. A little training goes a long way! Having any children in a car is a huge responsibility, take good care of them, it should not need a law to enforce common sense.
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When I was young, we used to climb over the back seat into the back of the estate and slide around on corners and under braking. Life was much more fun in those days, before 'fear' became the new religion.
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Give that man a coconut! As I was typing my first entry, I was wondering who'd be the first to come along with a "My dad used to impale us kids on iron spikes. Never did us any harm."
My own parents took what I now recognize as outrageous risks that I wouldn't dream of perpetrating now on my children. A booster seat costs peanuts, yet benefits from knowledge gained through millions spent on crash tests. My parents' generation didn't know this stuff - although with one an engineer and the other a doctor they could probably have worked some of it out; we do, and would anyone here seriously argue against putting it into practice?
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I am no fan of the invasive health and safety policies that increasingly dictate our lives, but for the trivial (in the scheme of things) cost and inconvenience of child seats, and the obvious benefits, it's a no brainer to my eyes.
I used to climb all over the back of the car when it was in motion. Never got a scratch. But then our car was never involved in a crash. Pot luck. If the worst happens, I know they stand half a chance that I wouldn't have at their age.
Edited by DP on 05/05/2009 at 23:34
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I do not think it unreasonable of you to request the parents provide a suitable seat - booster seats can be very cheap (Lidl and Aldi again!) and many 'pram' type combinations seem to have a car seat incorporated into them for younger children. The fines are high and paid by you, as the driver.
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I remember measuring myself in primary school and I was 140cm tall it seems quite stupid that I would have had to have a booster seat if the law applied back then. Back then I would be lucky if I got a rear seat belt!
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A seatbelt yes, but a bespoke seat for an older child is daft, you don't get any safety devices on most public transport. You don't have to wear a helmet in a car yet, despite the risk of head injuries, you have to draw the line somewhere, and of course people should be able to use a booster seat if they like, but without nanny-state dictat. What if you see your neighbours or friends with their children walking along in the rain and want to give them a lift? You can't these days, unless you happen to have a boot full of assorted seating paraphernalia..
Edited by Hamsafar on 06/05/2009 at 00:02
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I have a very strong willed 2 year old. She hates being strapped in. We've had many tantrams because of the child seat nanny state law. Try telling a 2 year that she has to be strapped in for her own good. She just doesn't understand. It's got to the point now where we try to time car journeys, particularly long ones, to when she is due to take a nap in the hope she will sleep through the journey. The other problem we have with my daughter in the car is that she will slip out of her shoulder straps. However tight I pull the straps she will slip her arms free.
We often visit Thailand. Getting there can be a problem because my daughter also doesn't like being strapped in the plane. However once there she is happy because the Thais are much less concerned about strapping children down than in the UK. Their road safety culture is non-existent. To my western eyes it's scary but it doesn't bother the Thai people.
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I would never, ever, let my two and a half year old grand-daughter into a car without a proper child seat. Couple of times we've used a taxi, we simply advise the taxi company that we need a child seat - and they are happy to arrange, although they like a little notice to ensure the driver picks up the seats / boosters.
My hate is that, when we travel by bus, there is no way that we can secure the little one - and our local bus service (the one that comes before second - no advertising!) is not known for their smooth driving - more of bunny-hop imitators.
But getting back to cars, A__a have a car seat on offer for 3years plus at only £25, and it converts into a booster cushion for when the kids get older. First child seat cost me about £100 - but that's a small price to pay to protect any child - heavens, it's less than the cost of 3 rounds of golf!
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It becomes ridiculous though, doesn't it? Should you check the NCAP ratings of vehicles before you allow your children to be carried in them?
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I have a very strong willed 2 year old. She hates being strapped in.
You let a 2 year old give you the runaround? Wait untill she is a teenager if you cant handle her now!
Edited by Old Navy on 06/05/2009 at 09:55
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You let a 2 year old give you the runaround? Wait untill she is a teenager if you cant handle her now!
I don't. She gets strapped in whether she likes it or not.
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I don't. She gets strapped in whether she likes it or not.
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Great stuff, soon it will become habit and she will do it herself without a thought.
Good luck with 12 - 15 years time.
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No need to quote from any of the above comments.
I have two children, now 10 and 5 years old. Both used to play up about sitting in their seats and being strapped in - oldest on a booster, younger on a proper child seat. Just over a year ago however we were involved in an accident where a van driver failed to make a corner and hit us head on. I got out with three broken ribs, both children escaped with bruising from their seatbelts, and were obviously both severely shocked.
Speaking with one of the paramedics on the way to hospital he told me that from the state of the car we were lucky not to need cutting out of the wreckage, and that if the children had not been securely strapped in proper child seats there would have been every chance of a fatality.
This accident happened on a regular journey home from school, on a road we know well, at a low speed (I stopped before the van hit us, the car was actually shunted several yards back up a verge). Please remember you don't know what's coming round the next corner or how fast it's coming. It simply is not worth taking the chance even for a short journey with your own or anyone's children.
Needless to say both my children now put their seatbelts on and keep them on without needing to be told.
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Sobering story AshT, glad you all came through it ok.
I think there should be a properly funded programme to take a crash simulator, ( the seat on a ramp type ), to all schools on a regular basis to demonstrate the effect of a bump at a few mph. Education, regularly reinforced tends to be remembered.
I did a cycling proficiency course and test and had my bike safety checked at school 50 odd years ago, does this, or any road safety training still happen?
Edited by Old Navy on 06/05/2009 at 12:26
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As an adult,I started wearing seatbelts before they became mandatory because a friend of mine was involved in an accident in a Mini where the car virtually stopped at the windscreen-he got out with a large diagonal bruise and no other injuries.
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Ask around and see if friends' children have outgrown a serviceable seat. I often see them given away on FreeCycle. I would not carry a child without one.
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