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I liked the idea of a Signum as a car in 2003. When it came out the dealer they were hopeless giving info. When I got the lease/company price list they were so expensive to e a non-option.
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I expect they were expensive to lease because of the forecast heavy depreciation Rob. They were of course right. I bought mine back in July. It's a 2.2 petrol Design edition with all sorts of toys on it. It had 33k on it, one owner, FSH, dealer warranty, etc etc and was totally immaculate on a 53 plate. I paid £4750. That seemed cheap at the time but you can of course get them for much less now.
If I run it true to my usual form it will be kept until it has done at least 150k provided it doesn't start misbehaving and if I do that and even if I have to throw it away the depreciation cost per mile for me won't be too bad. ( about 4p a mile )
I have no idea what its first owner paid for it but for the sake of argument lets say £18k and assume that if I paid what I did that they got no more than £4k for it. Their depreciation cost would have been about 42p per mile.
We shall see, it has a hard act to follow.
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"I expect they were expensive to lease because of the forecast heavy depreciation Rob"
Worked that out before I saw the prices on lease ;-) What got me was the local dealer that did not know if I was anything but a private buyer did not get involved at all. I had questions. This was in 2003 too!
Basically someone in a dealer interested in a vehicle with people walking past and I tried asking questions etc. Shocking really.
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Well funnily enough I popped into our local VX dealership yesterday. only wanted a rear wiper blade which they didn't have as it turned out. Fortunately Halfords is near there so got sorted.
Back to the dealership, there was a very funky/sporty Astra coupe VXR sitting in the showroom. Not being in any great hurry I had a good old poke around it. Sat in it, folded the seats etc. Played with the switches........jolly nearly made brooom brooom noises.
Totally ignored.
Slunk off to Halfords for my wiper.
I run a small business which involves selling things. One thing I do know is that if you don't ask you generally don't get. Admittedly I wasn't there to buy a car but I'm capable of buying one and could maybe have been persuaded by an interesting deal or a new model or something. Maybe they are just punch drunk.
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Yes they were NCT5s but I thought they said "Eagle" on them too.
Just looked at one of my rear tyres on my Vectra-C - still got NCT5's fitted. They do indeed also have Eagle on them, but I couldn't recall many people referring to them other than NCTs (and of course rubbish)
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Just thought I'd mention a clever wee thing on the Signum. It is alleged by the handbook that it only needs servicing every 20k. I had decided to trust that as it appeals to my sense of frugality but have to admit it felt discomfiting to leave a car so long without some fresh oil.
Anyway, it seems the car knows better, it was serviced at 33k when I bought it at the end of July and has just gone over 45k. A little light has just started to appear on the dash on start up which has a picture of an oil can and 1000 mls. I take it the car is politely requesting an oil change some time soon.
Can hardly refuse as it has been so courteous about it......
Anyone used these fast fit type while you wait oil change services in recent times?
I'm too old and its too cold to be faffing about DIY.
I will probably just take to the indy I use for everything. He seems to know what he's doing.
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Reading this forum on the Signum with interest as you findings are the complete reverse of those with a Volvo S60. Namely, Pirelli P6000 good, Goodyear bad.
I think I've posted elsewhere the P6000 was good on Pug206 but dreadul on the Volvo. The Volvo only weighs in at a shade more than 1.5 tonnes (relatively light these days) and the Pug was made from tinfoil so weighed in at little more than a newborn baby.
I'm wondering what the optimum weight is for the Pirelli tyres ?
Edited by gmac on 13/12/2008 at 19:51
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Well to be fair gmac. The old tyres were only just legal and I guess anything would have been an improvement. Also the new ones are bad boy lower wider jobs which were sort of bound to feel grippier. I suspect I should be wearing a baseball cap now and slouching when I drive it.......
In other words, another brand might have been even better but I'm happy enough with the Pirellis for now.
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Don't get me wrong the P6000's were absolutely fine on the Pug.
The S60 comparison was exactly the same size 225/45x17.
You don't see many Volvo drivers slouched down with the back-to-front baseball cap. :)
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So HB what about the Signum in a bit more detail to fit our current £4k family car search... that could be anything from Focus to Mondeo size. Bear in mind I have the near identical Mondeo to you so will understand Signum vs Mondeo comparisons well.
Room, refinement, ride, quality feel etc.
Thanks,
David
Edited by M.M on 13/12/2008 at 21:16
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HB, where did you buy the tyres from in the end?
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Dox, I got them from the indy repair garage I use in the end. He is not a tyre specialist but is prepared to search around for deals. his prices are always competitive with the online guys for example and I trust them implicitly. I have used them for all my cars needs for years and all I can say is they don't ever need to go back between services.
I know you are local to me so if you want more detail feel free to E-mail me through the mods (if they don't mind.) Suffice it to say he is behind the "Cat" ;-)
MM, gosh that is a difficult question. I change my mind every day as to which is the better car.
I am very used to Mondeo estates. I have had three of the Mkllls and two Mklls. Prior to that I have had a few Sierras and Cortinas. I find them brilliant all rounders. The current one is extremely well appointed in the toy dept. I can sit in it for vast distances and emerge fresh as a daisy. It has been faultless and very very useful. It's a diesel and it is set up for comfort ( Ghia X ) rather than performance so it's no sports car but it is just such an easy thing to live with. Frankly, if I thought it would run forever I can't really imagine why I would ever actually need anything else except to change for the sake of it.
I should also add that I have puntuated this succession of Fords with an odd other make ( Volvo, Audi, BMW, Citroen, Renault, Rover, VW, Vauxhall ) but always seem to gravitate back to these.
I bought the Signum in the Summer on a bit of a whim because it looked so cheap. They are even cheaper now. :-(
It ought to be similar really but it is in fact quite different. For a start it's a 2.2 petrol. A lovely engine. Very smooth. Remarkably economical, 36-38 mpg depending on how it is being used. Lots of low down torque like a diesel but much quieter. The trim level I have is the "Design" package which is the allegedly sporty set up. Sort of SRi for easy counting. Firmly sprung and it corners much flatter than the Ford. However, the ultimate handling of the Mondeo was better at least until I got the new rubber on the Vauxhall.
It has very clever seats which fold flat into the floor. It can seat five and has five seatbelts but it really only has four proper seats. They are very nice half leather bucket style ones on mine. One of its party pieces is the ability to recline the back ones, and or, to slide them back or forward to either make huge legroom or a bigger boot. Ultimate loadspace is better in the Mondeo as it is physically bigger but there would not be a lot in it. I can get 14 large holdalls in the back of the Mondeo and 12 in the VX.
The Signum reminds me of a Cavalier SRi I had a squillion years ago. A bit of a bad boy in a suit. The Mondeo is somehow more comforting if that makes sense, like your favourite Auntie's cooking.
I like them both.
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It has very clever seats which fold flat into the floor. It can seat five and has five seatbelts but it really only has four proper seats.
Ultimate loadspace is better in the Mondeoas it is physically bigger but there would not be a lot in it. I can get 14 large holdalls in the back of the Mondeo and 12 in the VX.
Well, that decides it for me. I need three proper seats, and decent load space at the same time, so the signum is out. Maybe next time, when hopefully eldest child will have her own car, we can reconsider the signum! (if I have any money left....)
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Vectra Estate? with same engine.
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We've got an 06 Signum 150 CDTI Design, ex Vauxhall management (his address is still in the satnav) which came on 19s. After replacing one pair of fronts at £300 each, I decided to get a different set of wheels and on ebay found some from a Vectra (wheels and tyres, as new condition) for £300! Sold the 19" snowflake alloys on ebay - £800.
I like the Signum, its different, much nicer to drive now its on 17s.
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Thanks for the useful report HB. My Mondeo is a GhiaX too so I know exactly what you like about it.
I really liked the idea of trying a Signum but seeing photos on the net of the rear seat takes it off our list too. We regularly need to travel a 5th person on 20 mile trips and there is the future possibility of needing that 5th person to travel hundreds of miles, so I really don't want to hassle them to sit on the "perch" provided in the middle.
Interestingly one used model I found had an optional fridge fitted there!
Anyway the search continues.
David
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That photo is of the seat folded down MM. When in the upright position it is OK but I wouldn't want to sit in the middle of the back of a Signum unless there was no other method of getting back from the pub or something. My 8 year old says its OK but his automotive tastes are not yet fully formed.
If I needed to fill all three back seats on a regular basis I wouldn't buy a Siggy. They are oh so cheap now though. Glad I didn't buy a new one two or three years ago....
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"My 8 year old says its OK but his automotive tastes are not yet fully formed."
WHAT ?
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He thinks the seat is OK.
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I was more worried about his automotive tastes - I was drawing bat-winged BMWs at that age !!! Before they were invented !!!
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My 8 year old says its OK but his automotive tastes are not yet fully formed.>>
Quite... at 8 I spent time riding in the middle front seat of a Series 1 Land Rover and loved it... now I wouldn't want to do 100yds in that seat.
David
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 14/12/2008 at 14:25
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I know, I shall have to have words with him. Wouldn't want him growing up ignorant of the social disadvantages of certain car choices.......What he actually decides is of course up to him but he needs to be made aware of spoiler stigma etc.....
Trouble is I think, that the modern generation have so much more to occupy them. We lived a sort reality version of the Secret Seven childhood where a new ( second hand ) bike was a rare treat and toys consisted of Meccano, Spirograph and Dinkys finest. Just gave him my treasured Corgi James Bond DB5 which I found in my Mum's attic.
He, like most of his peers is far more taken with the entire library's worth of Playstation Games, Nintendo DS and playing on his personal notebook computer.....
The world has gone to the dogs......
;-)
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The world has gone to the dogs...... ;-)
Sometimes Humph the things you say in humour are surprisingly serious and true.
Have young children had the sort of wholesome upbringing that many of the previous generations benefitted from, i don't really think so to be honest, our time spent outdoors getting up to all sorts of real not virtual things taught us with the guidance of wiser elders to be the sort of people we are....
crackers by most accounts..;)
Not implying anything so please don't take that as anything other than a generalisation.
I'm thinking of a young lad i know, son of a relatives best friend, this little mite, a smashing child wouldn't eat proper food and had his head stuck in his blessed electronic toy all the time.
After spending an afternoon with me, during which time we washed the cars, the electronic toy was discarded and a soaking wet little lad had a whale of a time with a bucket of soapy water and a hose pipe, following that he tucked away a monster portion of proper food and was a sleepy but happy normal little boy, well as normal as anyone would be around a BR'r..;)
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Yeh that Land Rover ride when I was 8 would have been enough excitement to keep me going for a month... now our girls (11 & 13) get itchy if they aren't "doing something" every other night. We live a pretty modest and old fashioned rural life and that is how the kids have been brought up. Doesn't stop the youngest having as the top item on her printed christmas list... and I quote... "major electrical/electronic item costing about £100".
Where do they get it from?
Wait 'till they see their inheritance is a stack of sawn telegraph poles, 20 gallons of creosote/engine oil mix, post hole digger and a chainsaw!
David
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Power went out here last night - How remarkably civilising - Laptop had some power left, but modem had gone off - dug out my trusty Sony ICF-SW100 travel radio - which despite its size has a beautiful tone even on the standard 50p size speaker. Two candles added to the "warmth", however there was still a strange craving for something with a screen. We've become a very strange society.
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I know, I caught myself trying to read HJ discussion on my Blackberry while on a trip to Italy a couple of weeks ago.
Stopped after a while feeling slightly guilty and a little bit silly..
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Thinking a bit more about this apparent relative lack of interest in cars by the younger generation. ( maybe I should start a new thread " It was so much better in our day" or something) ;-)
Seriously though, I do believe it has at one level to do with the plethora of alternative stimuli available now. The other major factor being that the complexity of modern vehicles does not especially encourage the inexperienced home vehicle maintainer.
I got my first car in 1976. By dint of my finances it was a car built in the '60s and had been designed in the '50s. It was more than possible to take it apart, fix it, and put it back together with the most basic of tools and skills.
Most of my peers who had cars or motorbikes, were capable of and willing to, undertake the more straightforward maintenance tasks and attempt most repairs and service items. Including re-building rusty body panels with filler and so on. Usually without great success to be fair on that particular score.
Resultantly, I like to think we developed at least a rudimentary understanding of how the things worked and perhaps that gave us an amount of mechanical empathy.
The youth of today ( some anyway ) are interested in their cars but seem to concentrate their efforts on styling modification and seem to me at least, to have a far less developed knowledge of the basic workings of their vehicles. This is undoubtedly a result of their relative complexity but I think there is more to it than that.
I think we have moved to a mindset where we no longer try to understand how things work. I include myself in that category when it comes to IT. I have not got the faintest idea what kind of witchcraft is allowing me to type this drivel, and frankly don't care. I'm just pleased that it works and that someone is bright enough to make it work for me.
I suspect that cars are being increasingly viewed in this way. How many 18 year olds who are not following a relevant educational course could describe the workings of an internal combustion engine?
Or indeed that of a Signum if I have to drag it screaming and kicking back on topic.....
;-)
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I don't think it's just apathy, Humph. 40-50 years ago a mechanically-minded lad (or indeed lass) could change plugs and points (even I could do that and I'm no mechanic) and probably move on to bleeding brakes and replacing a head gasket, or decoking.
Nowadays you have job to find the plugs; ignition is electronic etc. Life just gets more complex, not least due to electronics.
I often give an example when lecturing - when I were a lad if you needed to learn to sweep a street, you got a broom and cart and got on with it. Now you have to learn to drive a LHD 3-ton truck on the wrong side of the road.
The point is - even if the young person is interested, what can (s)he do without a full-on training course?
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