Ford C-Max 1.6 Duratorq CVT produces puffs of thick black smoke on pull away and also seems to have excessive smoke at certain revs (1500-1750rpm). As its a CVT it annoyingly seems to spend a lot of its time in this particular band. It doesn't seems to effect MPG (can actually get an unbelievable 58MPG on motorway at 60mph!). The car before I inherited it did have problems with stalling (I know about the transmission failure and engine management issues). The Ford dealer seems to have fixed these problems... I am wondering however if he did so by making the mixture rich in the zones when the engine/transmission would otherwise fail... Therefore causing the excessive smoke.
I know that high loads and harsh acceleration can cause diesels to smoke but beginning to think that the car is becoming a red arrow at times!
On a separate issue (I hope!) the car was recently serviced and they found that the oil was very gungey (the correct term?). They also noticed that the dipstick always seemed to have oil on it even when the sump was drained (the oil is disgustingly black). They recommended a oil flush to clear this excessive deposit away. Is this worthwhile or have a got a serious problem?
Thanks
Chris
Edited by Pugugly on 25/07/2008 at 00:21
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Can you confirm that it is a diesel ? This talk of "mixture" is not dieselish, and as for the engine spending all its time in 1500-1750rpm, then that's good as it uses the torque to waft you along.
Has the air filter been changed at any of these services, and are all hoses sealed and hole free ?
As for the flush - it depends. Whats the service interval for these cars ? One of my previous cars had 30000 mile service intervals. Fine for the fleet manager who's getting shut after 2 years, not good for you or me 4 years down the line. I got the oil changed at 12000 miles at the most. If its been left in for a while, then it may be worth doing, to get all the gunge free. That said, sometimes this causes more problems......
Any fault lights on ?
Edited by krebb industries on 16/07/2008 at 22:15
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Sorry yes its a Diesel, I know nothing (worth knowing) about diesels but assumed that it was possible to alter mixture on a modern diesel and that it might be a solution to the stalling. As its an CVT I mentioned the it holding in the 1500-1750rpm area (not I assume unreasonable)
I assume that the air filter gets changed as it is mentioned in the service schedule... but again who knows what they do!
As for the flush is it something that really cures a problem of a constantly gungey (and therefore unreliable indicator of oil level) oil dipstick?
No fault lights and it has otherwise never been anything other than a perfect very responsive and slick motor.
Thanks for the reply.
Chris
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I'm not an expert on these engines, but diesel doesn't have a "mixture" as such - it sucks in pure air and a measured quantity of fuel is injected into the cylineder. If you put more fuel in, the faster the engine goes. On an old manual pump, you could alter the idle speed by turning a screw.......different ball game with ECU controlled diesels. You can see when the fuelling is awry very easily by the smoke produced.
Something is adversly affecting the fuel/air mixture. could be incorrect timing, clogged air filter, faulty sensor on engine....how long is a piece of string ?
If there are no fault lights on, and the smoke is black, then check that the engine is breathing correclty. The air filter may be part of the service schedule, but have they actually changed it ? Is the trunking for the charge air damaged or trapped in any way ?
There may be a problem with the EGR valve too, letting too much exhaust gas back in with the charge air.
How many miles has it done ?
As for the flush, its main purpose is to clear out all the oilways in the engine, to keep the flow of oil to the extremities of the engine. Its a bit like a quick way of cleaning out your arteries. it shouldn't be necessary if the car has been looked after, and has had frequent oil changes - perhaps more frequent than the service schedule says though. I don't know why the disptick is getting fouled though. Is it definitely being pushed all the way down in the tube, to make sure that it is actually sealing itself ? If not, I suspect a mist of oil could come out, and dust getting in, thus creating the perfect breeding ground to create "gunge" !
I don't have a CMax myself, but I have seen a few smoky ones about. Do you think it will fail the MOT smoke test ?
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Diesels will always have black engine oil usually within twenty miles of being a new car and within five miles of any susequent oil change.
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Ford recommendation is 12,000 m. service;no higher.
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Its actually only done 14000 miles over 3 years and had been serviced to spec... as for whether it will fail its MOT... lets hope so as then Nationwide Autocentres will have to finally fix it under their MOT insurance. Heres hoping that finally fixing it cost less than £650!
As I said its a fine and easy car to drive just an embarrassment when it decides to settle on Red Arrow mode when cruising up any slight incline or when I pull away at the lights!
Being honest I happily warn anyone in essex to stay well away from this CVT when they see it on a forecourt in the near future!
Chris
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Is this engine a turbo?
With such a low mileage does it ever get a run at high engine speed?
I would start by looking at the EGR.
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hi guys, got no lights on within the car, i have a 54 plate, always when i start it in the morning get black smoke which i think is ok , however i have recently, whilst on the motorway seen loads of black smoke, may need a service and the turbo appears to be in working order. ???
it it worh a service before getting it to a garage ??
or possible major fault ??
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Our C~max same mileage was just as bad , has it had the ford software updates ? ~ but we also had the sudden death problem too
of power , apparently unknow to the ford dealers !!!! put ford c~ max in the search box top right and see the threads on them , this cvt model with a pug engine is one to stay well clear, get rid while its running !!!
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Took your advice and have arranged to get rid of it and replace with v. nice 1.8 petrol Focus II.
Cheers
Guys
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My daughter has this car too , and its a totally different experience and so nippy.
The C~max is a very good design and versatile but not in the cvt auto tdci model .
Ford have been very poor at not solving known problems on the cvt which are very expensive to the loyal customer , we are now with vw.
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I have had a 2004 C-Max CVT auto for a year now and get the smoke from standing start / light acceleration. It's been in the main dealer 5 times so far and the last time they had it for four days.
The problem has been reduced for a while ( one tank of fuel) by:
1. Replacing the EGR valve at £350 a throw
2. Doing a PCM upgrade
But has always come back.
My current theory is that:
1. There is a problem between the gearbox and engine management software that opens the EGR valve at the wrong time from a standing start. This means the fuelling is temporarily wrong. This causes balck smoke out the back and the engine components to start clagging up with unburnt oil and soot.
2. The EGR rapidly gets clogged up because of problem 1. and so starts to stick. This means the EGR is not set correctly at other times - such as under light acceleration. Again - the fuelling is wrong and more smoke results. And the EGR clags up even more.
3. That both problems are also made worse by the fact that the engine revs are kept very low all the time - generally <2000 revs, which isn't enough to clear out the clag.
4. That the main dealer making software changes temporarily makes the engine change its software settigns to reduce the problem. As the engine re-learns its settings the problem comes back. As it will if the EGR is changed.
For now I've given up complaining and just drive around the problem as much as possible. It can be a bonus to give the bloke too close behind a facefull of diesel smoke - they normally back off.
It's a lovely car otherwise - extremely smooth, comfortable, quiet and economical, despite its smoking habit.
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Have to agree with you it is a lovely smooth, comfortable, quiet and economical motor... I however cannot live with the smoke trail I leave behind.
I pick up my petrol ford on Monday and I can't wait to enjoy a trip down a A-Road without having the Met office announce a sudden fog bank arriving!
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My car started going into "limp home" mode on long trips, smoke problem got worse and worse and Ford dealer was unable to fix it - despite lying to me repeatedly that he had - 15 atttempts in total.
Car has been traded in in despair and at cost to me of several thousand pounds. I'll never buy a Ford again.
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