Apologies if this is a much-asked question...
Ever since my mates started having kids I've been mocking them for going out and changing their cars, not listening to their protestations about needing room for all of the kit etc which apparently comes free with children...? Anyway, you've guessed it - the wife is pregnant. With twins. With one I reckon we'd have been ok using either of our nice small cars (Clio and Micra), but with two I'm afraid I'm going to have to change my policy. The shame of it.
Anyway, I'm currently looking at reasonably priced 4x4s or estate cars, not really interested in people carrier type cars at the moment. Some more details, and I realise that I may need to be flexible with some of this...
* petrol engine (I'm planning on going LPG - or is that a whole other thread in itself?)
* economy would be nice of course (assuming here that more economical petrol engine = more economical lpg engine)
* not too many miles on the clock (preferably less than 30k)
* whatever features one needs from a car to keep two babies (and then kids, which I'm told they'll turn into) safe
* not too old (preferably around 3 years)
* looks are important, as is build quality
EDIT: Forgot to add the important bit - prefer to keep the budget to around £8k, but anything close enough is good enough.
Oh, if anyone knows where I can get the moon on a stick that would be appreciated too.
Not buying for another few months yet, so not looking for any offers at the moment.
So, any thoughts?
Thanks in advance,
chippy
Edited by hjchippy on 09/06/2008 at 17:59
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Standard dull suggestions would include the S-Max, the Golf Plus, Merc B-Class.
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>>Standard dull suggestions would include the S-Max the Golf Plus Merc B-Class.
Thanks for the heads-up - agree with you, not the most inspiring of cars there.
Any more?
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If you're serious about LPG then I would start by looking at which lpg conversions are any good. Then use that for a shortlist. So many people have expensive problems with lpg. I'd try to avoid the donut tanks - one thing you dont want with kids is to be stranded somewhere because you have a puncture that isnt fixable with a can of gunk.
Be aware that you may need a big car early - the 'small' car seats can often require a large amount of rear legroom to be fitted properly. And sliding doors suddenly get desirable.
Oh, I've got some sticks going cheap if you provide the moon.
Edited by adverse camber on 09/06/2008 at 18:35
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You don't need anything massive, an estate would be plenty big enough, a saloon would be OK but having a tailgate and a flat place to sit (under it) is sometimes, err, convenient .
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A friend has a Skoda Octavia, hatch I think, with the trick VAG 4X4 and 1.8 turbo petrol engine, 150bhp I think, or thereabouts. I like the way it drives very much and it hasn't given him any trouble. Bought it from a Skoda dealer in Kent which he says is very good, no-nonsense, pleasant and reassuring, cost about £6k a couple of years ago. Something along those lines might well fill the bill.
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Good point - the load area of an estate is handy for changing nappies
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Congratulations and good luck with the twins!
Firstly decide if you actually need a 4x4. If you live somewhere that suffers particularly bad weather, lots of snow, flooded country roads, you need to drive across fields etc then it makes sense. Elevated driving position is also a popular reason to buy one.
But generally speaking 4x4 will be a bit thirstier and less capable on the road than an estate car. There are a few soft roaders (Honda CRV being HJ best) that seem to offer a very good all round compromise. The Nissan X-Trail comes in a 2w drive version also and might be closer to you budget.
The second thing I would advise is don?t get hung up on the low mileage thing. A 3year old 60k miler, used everyday by a rep up and down the M6, is (on average) going to be better condition mechanically and fit and finish than a 15k example used exclusively by mum on the school run.
As far as estates go you have loads of choice.
Starting with the slightly smaller ones you wouldn?t go far wrong with a focus or astra estate. Skoda Octavia as already suggested is also very highly regarded. All pretty cheap to run, dependable, well made vehicles.
Of course you could go bigger to Mondy/Vectra land. And there also all the Japanese makes to consider, the Toyota Avensis is a very nice car, and the Mazda 6 is also extremely highly rated. Older 3 series and A4 are also in the mix.
A few wildcards you might want to consider ? Jag X-type, probably just in to price range (perhaps a little older), V50 (focus in a better suit) and a Vauxhall Signum ? nobody knows what this car is so its very good value second hand.
Maybe refine your priorities a little and come back ? there a lot to choose from!
Nick
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£7.8k will get you an 07 reg Astra 1.8 Design estate with <20k miles from Tradesales.
I would also suggest a Focus estate, although Tradesales don't appear to have any of them at the moment. We have a mk1, and I would think the presumably similar sized Astra would be plenty big enough for your needs. I think our (2.0) Focus is a great drive.
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Thanks to all for your responses. I'll take a look on Autotrader to see how they all look (I'm extremely out of touch when it comes to cars).
Thanks to Nick1975 for the pointers. I suppose what I meant to say was that I was thinking about a Jeep type thing, rather than a 4x4, so the 2WD ones are all just fine.
Essentially then:
an estate or "jeep" style car (there's probably a better way of describing a "jeep" like car, but hopefully you know what I mean) - but I would prefer the jeep style,
able to take two child seats,
plenty of room for carrying the things that come free with kids,
economical to run - thinking particularly of fuel of course. I'm likely to keep the car for a while (think at least 5 years), would estimate at 10k miles a year, so think it would probably be worth converting to LPG (asked for a rough estimate, was quoted around £1500 for conversion).
Thanks again for all of the advice. Any more for any more?
chippy
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A "Jeep style" vehicle, even if only 2 wheel drive, will have poor aerodynamics and will still be relatively poor on fuel economy and, becoming an important factor, road fund licence. Although a little extra height is useful for getting babies into the car, proper off-road style cars are too high and would be awkward, also awkward loading prams etc into the high boot. For their outside dimensions they can also be surprisingly small inside.
Why not consider the amazingly Tardis like superminis such as the Honda Jazz or Nissan Note. Our neighbour swapped a Ford Galaxy for the Note, has 2 young children and does not seem any worse off for it. We have made trips in the Jazz with 5 adults in the car and luggage for a week long holiday. Design features like the engine pushed right forward and on a slope and scooped out inside door panels maximise the inside space. Economy in all running costs is amazing and will be needed with twins to feed and clothe.
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I'd go along with the Octavia estate, for the particular reason that it's not as long as a Mondeo but has a huge amount of room for luggage with only moderate rear legroom - which shouldn't be a priority for babies. As any parent will agree, the paraphernalia for even one baby takes an amzing amount of room, let alone twins!
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As any parent will agree the paraphernalia for even one baby takes an amzing amount of room let alone twins!
Indeed! maybe chippy should use this as a criteria?
Ok chipster, off to the shop you go, and buy:
Car seats x 2
Pram/buggy
two large nappy/clothing bags...
etc etc etc,
and take them along when you go car shopping!
Check how easy the car seats are to attach - isofix for the win!
Add to that, you are still going to have to put OTHER things in - minor stuff, like shopping etc.
Check out the swing on the doors, how easy is it going to be to load and unload the sprogs?
How easy is it for passenger to access the kids through between the front seast? - very important in the event of cleaning up puke etc.
On this sour note, how easily is that upholstery going to be cleaned?
Other things to consider, who will be using the car the most - yourself or the missus?
Welcome to fatherhood.
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Or even an Octavia hatch. Big boot, a refined part-time 4X4 system that makes the car turn in wonderfully on slippery roads, and a decent turn of speed with the low-pressure turbo 1.8 petrol engine without feeling or looking particularly 'sporting'. I wonder if these are still being made? Not too thirsty either. A very good all-round package by my standards anyway.
Edited by Lud on 10/06/2008 at 17:35
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Chippy,
Although you state that you are not interested in people carrier type cars, one thing to take into account is the ease of fixing the baby carriers into position. MPVs tend to sit a bit higher off the road and so not so back breaking when loading the kids.
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I would have thought a Zafira would have been your best bet for the money available - I know it's a people carrier but a neighbour has one, and i've been very impressed with it
MVP
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It doesn't get many good reviews - certainly not one of the 'usual suspects' recommended on here but a Dodge Caliber appears to tick all the boxes you specified.
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Methinks you're still in "what I want mode", an option rarely available to parents, as you'll soon be obliged to accept!
What you "want" and what works best may differ, thus I revert to suggesting the S-Max as 1st choice. Not too large externally, more than enough internally, with thoughtful storage all over the place; good for picnics, pushchairs, matresses, wide enough to stop the children fighting each other - you name it, Ford has thought of it.
You can get the Morgan / Caterham 7 as a second car.
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Had an S-Max on hire last year. Very nice but when you say not too large, I personally thought it was and was very wide. Also I found the A pillars very intrusive but overall I would agree that it is worth a look.
You might say that you don't need a big car, but you will and you will always seem to fill it.
Can I give one piece of advice? When thinking of what to buy, do take along the pram/buggy that you might have or at least borrow one as they take up a huge amount of room. The other thing to consider is getting a smaller car and then getting a roof rack for those times that you really need to load things up.
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How about trying to find a mint example W124 E Class Estate? Engine should be fine for an LPG conversion, acres of space, bullet (and child) proof build quality, half-million mile potential and bags more character than an ordinary modern box!
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Unfortuantely you will have to increase the budget to at least £12k to get an S-Max
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When thinking of what to buy do take along the pram/buggy that you might have or at least borrow one as they take up a huge amount of room.
The best ones are the "umbrellafold", lightweight as you can get, small when folded, 6m.o. and up, though. They are not as fashionable as these dirty heavy great moulded plastic things, but they're much better all around.
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