Probably a daft question but years ago when I bought my first diesel the fuel was cheaper than petrol and you got better mpg to boot.
Whilst fuel consumption is still better of course why is diesel now so much more expensive than petrol?
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Because the Oil Cos can see a cash cow and are milking all they can.......
Bear in mind though that its currently only 5% more than petrol and as my car is 33% more efficient than its petrol equiv and costs less to tax I think I'll be keeping it..
Edited by b308 on 09/03/2008 at 19:44
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what is the average price of fuel around the country i live in plymouth
the 4 supermarkets are around the same at £102.9 unleaded and £107.9
diesel however noticed today a couple of texaco's are £109.9 unleaded
and £115.9 diesel is there anywhere dearer ?
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Saw 118.9 today, and the petrol was only 5p less!
Roll on 150ppl!
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Around south Manchester unleaded seems to be around 103.9 and yesterday I paid 110.9 for diesel.
Does anyone else get irritated by the .9 on the end of every price by the way?
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It's rip-off Britain again, as diesel is cheaper than petrol in all other countries I have looked at!
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also how you draw a round number say £15 and as you put the nozzel
back it clicks over a penny
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I think some part of the price difference is caused an idiotic Government tax manoeuvre ie something extra on diesel because so many of us use it but not that much 'cos of the better mpg - something like that!
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Brown sorry Darling is "pondering" over another 2p rise in prices.
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tax on diesel is higher than petrol and most diesel is refined in Russia as opposed to UK.
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Duty rates on petrol and diesel in UK are identical www.direct.gov.uk/en/Nl1/Newsroom/DG_066693. Lower prices in France etc are down to different taxation policies.
Current 5-7p differential is down to supply/market factors (or big oil company greed if you prefer).
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The largest slice of the cost of any fuel is tax. As of October 2007 the tax on fuels levied by Her Majesty's Government is :
* 50.35 pence per litre for ultra-low sulphur unleaded petrol/diesel
* 53.65 pence per litre for conventional unleaded petrol
* 56.94 pence per litre for conventional diesel
* 30.35 pence per litre for bio-diesel and bio ethanol
* 16.49 pence per kg for gas other than natural gas (LPG)
* 13.70 pence per kg for natural gas used as road fuel.
* 9.69 pence per litre for rebated gas oil (red diesel)
* 9.29 pence per litre for rebated fuel oil
To these figures VAT should be added (yes, tax on tax.)
To my knowledge the government does not drill for, produce, refine, transport or otherwise make any contribution to the process of filling your tank.
It just takes the money.
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Full stop affecting link to duty rates in my earlier post. Should be:-
www.direct.gov.uk/en/Nl1/Newsroom/DG_066693
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And just wait until a sizeable number switch to LPG - bet it won't just be 16.49 tax then.
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I saw this somewhere.
The proportions of petrol and diesel you can refine from a barrel of crude are pretty much fixed. Demand is higher (HGV's and home heating oil) for diesel than for petrol, especially in winter. So supply and demand economics suggest diesel will be dearer than petrol.
Discuss......
Edited by nick on 09/03/2008 at 20:45
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That is exactly right, there are more uses for the diesel fraction. Tax is the same on petrol and diesel, and has been stated, diesel is less than petrol in most countries as their governments recognise the needs of the hauliers (or in Frances case, sometimes held to ransom by them!)
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Saw this on a US forum re new Subaru diesel (I've cut it down a bit)
qte
A gallon of diesel fuel requires anywhere from 10%-20% more crude oil to make than a gallon of gasoline. That is the number one reason why diesel is more expensive than gasoline. If diesel contains significantly more oil than gasoline, why are people surprised diesel costs more?!?! Again: crude is the key ingredient for both diesel and gas. Diesel requires more of that key ingredient, and therefore costs more!
And it does not take less time/effort to refine, especially in the case of ULSD here in the US. This "argument" is really more of an urban legend at this point in time.
Also, it does not use less energy; in fact, it requires more (see above). Diesels generally make more power than gas engine of the same size because diesel fuel contains more energy than gas. And the reason diesel contains more energy than gas is because it contains more oil than gas!
And it does not pollute less, just differently. Diesel cars emit less CO2 on average than gasoline cars, but gas cars emit next to no NOx or particulates compared to diesels...hence the need for all the advanced filters and exhaust aftertreatment seen on new diesel cars.
So that's why diesel is more expensive and why diesel cars are more expensive.
unqte
This of course relates to the production cost pre-taxes and I've no idea if any of the above is true or would apply to the UK, my understanding is that the US diesel refining capacity is relatively quite small. Mind you if he's correct and when the tax on both fuels was the same why was diesel cheaper or was the price of petrol too high?
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It weighs more and has 20% calorific energy more than petrol weight for weight its probably know more efficient than petrol.
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Exact figures Diesel is 850g per litre and petrol 720g per litre.
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£1.10 a litre equates to £5 a gallon. I really am surprised we haven't had newspaper headlines!
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Our local Shell station has gone from £1.08 to £1.09 to £1.12 in about two weeks. For normal Shell Diesel Extra. Tesco is 1p more. That's painful.
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There will be no stopping them now the magical £1.00 mark has been broken.
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I saw a 1.149 for diesel on the way in this morning!
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its £1.17.9 at our local esso which is bad enough but it is the pensioners who have to decide whether to eat or buy heating oil that I feel sorriest for
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but gas cars emit next to no particulates
Oh goodness that urban myth again - of course they do, they produce far more of the smaller particulates compared to diesel engines, whereas diesels produce more of the larger ones which can be seen... and are easier to trap!!
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 10/03/2008 at 19:18
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I have just noticed that diesel (at least) has gone up again at some stations around me that's at least twice in a week!
This is going to impact on the economy in a big way if it carries on like this and NuLAB can't really add more tax to the cost can they?
Trouble is they've got themselves into such a mess he can't afford to reduce tax either unless he cuts govt. spending by a hell of a lot.
And we're still paying billions for the disaster that is Iraq and Afghanistan!!
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The government will keep taxing fuel until it judges that the public will take no more of it.
The measure of this threshold has traditionally been social unrest and civil disobedience.
For as long as motorists keep quietly paying up the government will keep increasing taxes.
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"The government will keep taxing fuel until it judges that the public will take no more of it. For as long as motorists keep quietly paying up the government will keep increasing taxes".
That's half the battle. The trouble is with us Brits is that we are far too soft and we have always allowed ourselves to be ripped off and walked all over by the government. As much as many people, including myself, have a good old moan with family and friends in the pub etc about 'rip off Britain', the government, law and order, illegal immigration, political correctness, the list goes on.., nothing will ever change unless the vast majority of the British public stand up to the government and bring the country to its knees until the government finally gives in.
Martin
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unless the vast majority of the British public stand up to the government and bring the country to its knees until the government finally gives in. Martin
Well, there are elections aren't there?
The problem is that things will carry on much the same whichever party is in power. The reason being that all the parties kowtow to big business and 'The City'. The more affluent don't want to pay more income tax, so the balance of taxation has shifted to indirect taxes on things like fuel, insurance etc.
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What could three billion have bought the country, I wonder? I remember my grandad telling me last year that New Labour has been the best Conservative government we've ever had. So it doesn't really matter who gets elected in 2009. Fuel tax isn't going to drop, even with protests. Where are they going to get their wasted 3 billion pounds otherwise?
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Protest is a legitimate part of the democratic process. It indicates that people believe they are being failed by the process. It has always been a powerful precursor of change.
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I'm not sure that's the case ... in the US, where their approach to consumer essentials is somewhat different to ours, fuel crashed through the emotive "2 dollar gallon" mark a couple of years ago and is now approaching 4 dollars ... but they seem to be by and large resigned to it rather than protesting
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Now the all important psychological £1/litre barrier has been broken, the oil companies won't hold back until they start making some decent profits on petrol at the pumps. I think the next barrier is going to be £1-50 and the rate things are going we'll be close to that soon. I reckon diesel will get to about 1-39 and stabilise for a while, a bit like when we had 79.9p/litre, it was ages before >80p was commonplace.
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Buy an old indirect injection diesel such as a Xantia/405 and run it on used, filtered chip oil. Costs me 40p a litre, delivered. I've got a tank with over 900l sitting outside. Economy is only 10% less than diesel.
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We have an old 405 in the family with over 500.000km runs on anything other than bought diesel only mod is a fuel lijne heater for winter never needs an oil change and runs every day without problems, maybe prices of old PAS diesels will start to rise as people get wise.
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Just make sure that the injection pump is made by Bosch. Some XUD engines are fitted with Lucas, which don't last with veg oil.
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I just use 100% supermarket veg oil in my XUD9. It costs me 56p/litre. That is why I do not join in the threads which are complaining about the fuel prices any more. I can't really complain about 56p/litre.
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The only problem with 56p/l Pura is a) finding it in stock, and b) standing there filling the tank one litre at a time!
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