My parents are close to deciding to buy a VW Golf Estate 2.0 TDI 140 DSG. The only other alternative so far is a BMW 320i Touring.
The following have been test driven and EXCLUDED: Passat (too large), Touran (too wide), Volvo V50 (just didn't feel right).
Car must have automatic, park sensors, folding door mirrors, at least 2 litre engine.
I suggested Skoda Octavia Estate which they have yet to investigate.
I welcome comments.
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All together now: Legacy Sports Tourer.
Not sure on the folding mirrors - that's a very specific "must-have" any particular reason?
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Their garage has a 2.10m opening, so the push-button fold is a must to get the car in as you really don't want to have just 3cm to spare either side.
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Might be worth you knowing then that the VW mirrors don't fold all the way in. They just fold in slightly, not in the 'up and around' way that something like a Merc does.
Not sure if that's a very good explaination but hope you get the idea!
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When I look down the side of some cars, with bulging wheel arches etc.... sometimes the unfolded mirrors of cars are no wider at their end-points than the overall of width of the car's metalwork. If you know what I mean. Not all door mirrors stick out beyond the width of the actual car.
Basically folding car mirrors only useful on some cars. Had folding ones on the Mondeo and used them at times but not sure I needed to.
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As much as I would strongly recommend the Legacy Sports Tourer (or even Outback) with the new diesel engine (highly recommended on the Car website), the automatic is not available until the autumn with the new Forester (there's a suggestion for the OP) I think.
Isn't Avant very happy with his new Golf V estate?
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I should have added my Mondeo would fit in our garage (not sure how wide but wide enough to also get out) but I had the mirrors down to see where I was reversing.
As well as reversing out of the garage itself the mirrors helped you to get the car at the right angle to get off the (shared) drive - our fence is at an angle so you need to start turning the car before you're out of the garage ideally when it's as big as a Passat/Mondeo.
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>>ed to start turning the car before you're out of the garage ideally <<
That exactly the problem that my parents have. They currently have an F-reg (1989) BMW 520. Its length is always a problem, but the overall width is fine.
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Red Baron if they have the same problem as I sort of have* then the mirrors are very useful and folding them might not be great. Although folding at the last moment and then unfolding on the outside of the garage might work.
* My car normally sits on the street with my wife's small car in the garage :-)
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It'll be a good choice, Red Baron - I'm delighted with mine. Driving is fun again after a very disappointing Mercedes B-class. But I suggest your parents make sure they are allowed to take the car home as part of the test drive. My Golf's mirrors don't fold automatically, but this may be an extra - but obviously it also depends on the overall width of the car. (Come to think of it, automatic mirrors aren't much help as the engine is still running when you're driving into the garage!)
The Octavia is well worth considering too, as it's just as good to drive: the 2.0 TDI Elegance is slightly more expensive than the Golf but parking sensors are standard, as is climate control (which personally I don't mind not having, as the manual AC does the job fine). But the Golf will hold its valuie better over time.
I too looked at a BMW Touring (320d in my case) - I couldn't get on with the driving postion or gearchange, and it was £7,000 more expensive than the Golf. They could also consider an Audi A4 Avant with the same engine - lovely, but not worth the extra cost particularly as there is a new model coming out soon.
Edited by Avant on 03/02/2008 at 21:23
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Avant: thanks for that. My parents will have to establish that the mirrors can be folded with the engine still running. I read your other post you wrote about the Golf. The removal of headrests to drop the rear seat back will be a pain.
The BMW320i Touring can have the mirrors folded with the engine still running.
What is your opinion of the overall noise inside the cabin...tyres, wind etc?
Thanks
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VW group diesel engines are noisier than some others, but you only really notice it when taking advantage of the (considerable) acceleration. Tyre and wind noise are no problem.
If their alternative is the BMW 320i rather than the 320d, are they debating between petrol and diesel? The Golf estate for some reason can't be had with a 2.0 petrol engine, but the Octavia can, with a choice of 148 bhp or 197 bhp (in the vRS which is effectively a Golf GTI estate).
If it helps, here are the others which were in my shortlist:
Audi A4 Avant 2.0 TDI - lovely but I couldn't justify the extra cost as the Golf has exactly the same oily bits.
BMW 320d Touring - too expensive and we just didn't get on, as in my post above. It's quieter than the Golf and your parents may find it suits them: there are a lot of happy BMW owners out there.
SAAB 9-3 estate 1.9 TiD - very sluggish from low revs and the interior finish was very shoddy in parts.
Ford C-Max 2.0 TDCI - I could never get a test drive of the exact model and residuals are weakish; also nowhere to put your left foot when off the clutch (a more important consideration than it sounds, especially if you do long motorway trips). Focus estate - residuals even worse.
Skoda Octavia estate 2.0 TDI - as mentioned above, residuals not quite as good as the Golf but I would have had one (and been very happy with it) if the Golf estate hadn't come out when it did.
Renault Scenic - I like Renaults as I had 7 in a row between 1980 and 2001 - but quality has still not recovered from ther nadir of the early 2000s. Newish demonstrator rattkled and some trim was coming away, and the car rolled too much on corners.
I didn't look at:
Subaru Legacy - no diesel then (August 2007) and petrol consumption too heavy. No dealers near me (Berkshire)
Mazda 6 - again no dealers for miles
Vauxhall Vectra - again poor residuals and no fun to drive
Nissan Qashqai - useless dealer could never get a demonstrator - also rear visibility awful
Honda Accord - too big: our kids are grown up. Civic - claustrophobic in the back and rear visibility that borders on the dangerous.
Volvo V50 2.0D - too expensive when it's just a Focus underneath
Edited by Avant on 03/02/2008 at 23:04
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where fitted VAG group cars with foding mirors can be "folded" while the engine is running, but not above a certain speed
I find that very handy for driving through width restrictions safe in the knowledge I aint gonna destroy 150 quids worht of mirror!
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"The removal of headrests to drop the rear seat back will be a pain"
Are you sure it's really a pain. If so the previous model Mazda6 with a pull of a lever in the boot drops the seats for a flat load bay (okay one for each side) without removing headrests. And previous Mazda6 not that wide comparatively.
My last car (Mondeo) you had to remove headrests and lift the rear seat base for a flat load floor in the back. Not in the Mazda. But centre rear belt needs detaching.
If you live near Stockport I'd be happy to try the garage for size.
Edited by rtj70 on 03/02/2008 at 23:41
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My parents have always had petrol cars and a switch to diesel does worry me (mis-fueling). Hence BMW 320i, but the Golf V estate has only diesel as a real choice (a 2.0 150PS petrol would be ideal - hence the Skoda suggestion).
Any estate car longer than about 4.5 metres is out due to garage accessibility.
My parents live in Mid-Sussex and some dealers are miles away.
They also find it hard to justify spending more than 20k on a new car when it gives them what exactly?!?
The car will be used mostly for local pootling. And 4 annual trips to somewhere near Frankfurt in Germany.
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