I've got a Defender 200tdi and she runs like a dream for 100 miles of so then get lumpy and underpowered for a few seconds and cuts out. Looks like it's some kind of fuel issue as if I remove the fuel filter and turn the ignition over fuel comes through - if I then empty the filter and replace it works fine again for 100 miles of so. Full power when going and no visible signs of anything untoward. I've replaced the fuel filter to no effect, replaced the lift pump .. still no effect and even replaced the petrol cap as someone mentioned it could be a vacuum build up. Still happening and not sure where to look next. Spoke to a local mech and his view was 'hmmm ... fuel ... could be anything' !
Anyone here any ideas on possible solution of next point of action?
Edited by Pugugly {P} on 04/01/2008 at 17:52
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Is the tank vent through the filler cap? Some vehicles have a separate breather pipe which can get blocked. Years ago I had a diesel escort on which the breather tube blocked up. The pump was sufficiently strong to collapse the steel fuel tank before the engine stopped. I drove home with the filler cap off with no problems.
Is there a big hiss of air when you remove the filler cap? Some cars do this a bit anyway so it's not a definitive test.
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When you say the fuel comes through when you turn the ignition - does this one have a tank-pump?
When you empty the filter; then it's OK for another 100 miles?? Is something blocking the filter? A bacterial contamination like the Freelanders?
Or is the time spent with the filter, allowing the stop solenoid to cool down?
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what if you just turn it off and on again without fiddling with the filter? Reason for asking if there's something in the tank being sucked onto the pickup pipe, it'll drop off when the engine stops and work until it gets sucked up again. Unlikely but happened to someone I know.
Chris
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Thanks for the ideas guys .... certainly feels more like a blockage of some sort. If I just leave it for a few minutes and attempt to restart the engine then it fails again almost immediately. I've tried a few things and the filter fiddle seems to be the only consistant way of clearing the issue.
Tried running without a filler cap and still get the same issue. The tank pickup is an interesting one though as I'm wondering whether I have rubbish in the tank that getting picked up and chucked through - although I get the same issue with a full tank as an empty one.
The Landy tends not to be used that much (it's a 110 and we have a 90 and a Disco so the 110 is for special occasions like the run to the dump !) which might indicate some kind of rubbish in the tank I guess???
Just one of those really frustrating issues that niggle away at my sanity !
Anyway ... a few things to try ... thanks tons for the advice and anything to add would be equally appreciated.
Brilliant forum with some genuine detailed help ... cheers guys and gals.
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Try taking the pin out of the stop solenoid.
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Hi Screwloose ... Thx for that .. will do ... doesn't sound as if it should be too difficult ... well here's hoping anyhows ! Will give it a try and report back.
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If you take the pin out of the stop solenoid, work out how you are going to stop the engine again before you start it.
You might want to stall it in a high gear if it's a manual, and the clutch is strong.
You might want to block the intake manifold with a wooden board - i.e., you'll take off the rubber/plastic trunking first.
I don't know what other options are available on your engine - there's a fuel tap on top of the fuel filter on my MB diesel.
Number_Cruncher
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That's the only thing that I can think of - there's something her that I can't quite get my head around.
Is this a factory-built 200, or a retro-fit into a V8? Does it really have fuel flow with just the ignition on? It shouldn't have a tank pump, just the lift pump on the block.
Has it had a Disco-type sedimenter fitted, [not standard on UK-spec 110] or does it still have the petrol filter on the bulkhead out-rigger?
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Hi again ... it's a factory built 200tdi and it has the lift pump (small pump that I've just replaced) on the block. Hasn't had the Disco-type sedimentor fitted so just a standard petrol filter (which has also been changed).
The failure sounds (to my uninformed ears) like fule starvation of some sort as you initially feel it miss then power drops away and it lurches to a halt. Pressing the accelerator doesn't increase revs just lurches it. Doesn't stall though and strangely sounds okay on idle ... just won't move. Can stop it and restart after a few minutes whereby it drives ok for 20 yards or so then goes again. Only clean way to clear it is the filter thing ... whereby it's fine for a reasonable period.
This is one of those problems that is really puzzling as the setup is so basic there can't be too much to go wrong .. just being a real pain to track down.
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Oh sorry ... forgot to add ... only has fuel flow with the engine running (not ignition on) ... sorry if this confused.
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So it will idle smoothly after it loses power? Even more bizarre. Forget the stop solenoid, they're often troublesome on these, but I can't see one causing idle-only and they're a right pig to change.
What do you empty out of that filter? Clean diesel - or black fuel? Did fitting a new filter make any difference - even for a short while? Was it a genuine one from the dealers - or....? Do you have your own supply, or is this forecourt fuel?
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Hi Screw - The filter is a standard job from components supplier and it's just standard forecourt diesel. When I empty the filter it's just nice clean clear stuff. Although it idles fine it get's lumpy when you depress the accel. so my thoughts are that it's getting fuel but now enough - the more I think about it the more it feels as though it's got to be some kind of blockage.
It's only done about 70k and the engine and block is in really decent kilt, always been well maintained (was owned by NI Coastguard) and not a spot of rust on it hence the reason for persevering. I can see this is confusing you as much as it does me now ... sorry matey !
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1 ,it could be a floater in the tank blocking fuel pipe and when you open filter it breaks suction and lets it back to the tank
2 partial internal collapse of the rubber pipe as the fuel pipe comes out of the tank ,bits of rubber close the pipe to stop revs but not enough to stop engine
been there with both faults ,200tdi is a good engine so worth persevering with it
good luck
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crowman
Yes; this is a weird one. Floating debris is the obvious - but why 100 miles? It should be fairly random.
What about engine breathers? Is there any way that a vacuum is forming in the crankcase and stopping the lift-pump diaphragm from rising? [I take it that this problem occured before the new lift-pump and the new filter were fitted? Neither of them are Britpart are they...?]
Next time it happens; remove the feed pipe from the inj pump and see if there's fuel coming through. Could any of the nylon fuel pipe be getting hot from proximity to the exhaust and sucking flat?
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Hi,
I just found this thread via a Google search - I have a Defender with a 200tdi (from a Discovery) that exhibits exactly the same symptoms. I was gutted to find that no solution to the problem was ever posted on this thread.
Does this forum support any mechanism for contacting other members? I could drop the original poster (crowman) a line to see if he ever got to the bottom of the problem. It's driving me round the bend at the moment!
Thanks in advance,
Ian.
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Hi Ian,
I noticed you had the same problem quite a while back, I now also have the same problem and am struggling to find the solution, how did you get on?
Kind regards,
Callum
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