JCB? - never seen the RAC / AA at one yet....
Thanks, but not the most practical means of transport. (but a lot more relaible than a Ford shovel and back hoe!)
Any more practical suggestions - needs to be at least Mondeo sized
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JCB did build a rather fast "special edition" !!
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>>JCB<<
May be alot of truth in that! in fact a lot of Agricultural/Industrial diesels seemed to be a lot more robust and reliable than car diesels, and these were usually regularly thrashed to what a lot of folk would describe as "an inch of thier life", just take for example a Tractor ploughing, now thats how to work an engine! and most of them loved it! no fancy fuel either in most cases, if my experience of farm tanks are anything to go by, (water-laden red diesel mixed with surplus aga fuel/ parrafin etc). We used to get more problems with punctures and rattly cab desease than actual engine faults, Perkins always seemed a decent engine, as believe it or not did BMC which were fitted into Nuffields.
Edited by billy25 on 05/12/2007 at 15:06
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Up until recently JCB used perkins - now they design and build their own at the powersystems factory on the A50 in Derbyshire. I have had the pleasure of visiting the factory and it is fantastic. The focus they have put on quality during the assembly process is first rate. I have always admired JCB as a company and this demonstarted how good they are.
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A hard question because diesel engines are changing rapidly and frequently due to emissions legislation. Any views concerning a modern diesel will necessarily involve guesswork. My nomination for the goodies:
Oldest: PSA XUD/TUD (iron block)
Old VAG 1.9 Sdi
Fairly old: VAG PD Tdi (1.9 litre 2 valve only, up to 130 PS) Subject to correct maintenance.
New: BMW diesels - if you strike lucky with turbochargers. MB if they've sorted the glowplugs.
In the new category, DPFs of any description seem to be a cost and reliability minefield. Fuel systems made by Delphi are a well documented lottery and I have my suspicions concerning NipponDenso systems built under Bosch licence. Time will tell for these.
659.
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Honda 2.2 as fitted in the CR-V
Toyota 3.0 as fitted in the Landcruiser - I regularly seem to see these at 200,000 miles
Edited by Marlot on 05/12/2007 at 14:05
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Thinking further on this, I think a number of them are reliable; its the cost of repair when they go wrong which concerns me.
I was keen on the XC90 until I asked around and found a number of people needing new injectors at 3-4 years old. One breakdown in 3-4 years sounds reliable to me, but £1500 doesn't appeal!
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One breakdown in 3-4 years sounds reliableto me
Not to me it doesn't!
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I'm with you nick and I am regularly suprised by people who consider this to be reliable. There have been a couple of threads where people consider their cars to be totally reliable because they have only experienced 1 or 2 failures in 3 or 4 years.
I can't figure that one out.
Edited by Pendlebury on 05/12/2007 at 17:47
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Mileage and use are more relevant than time when determining reliability.
Both the following statements are true, but which sounds better:
My old Focus had one fault (but no breakdowns) in a three year period
My old Focus had one fault (but no breakdowns) in 99,800 miles of hard use.
Cheers
DP
--
04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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The Volvo D5 since 2003 (and the injector issue) has been pretty reliable, it also doubles as a boat engine.
The engine itself has proved to be pretty reliable.
In the last year on the VOC website I have seen one case of a snapped timing belt on a 50+k car.
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Jaguar. Both X Type 2.0 and 2.2 Ds are great. In estate form the X type diesel is a really excellent package. Delighted with mine.
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Don't know if it means anything apart from economics, but small VW diesels are used to power all sorts of military stuff such as generators, compressors and so on.
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Don't know if it means anything apart from economics but small VW diesels are used to power all sorts of military stuff such as generators compressors and so on.
Rolls Royce make the engines for the Comet/Nimrod planes but I would not think that the military are necessarily good at the choices they make.
Nimrods still flying because they are cheaper than buying new - maybe the VW Diesels are cheap and hence the choice of the military.
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Rolls Royce may make Nimrod's engines but diesel they are not! Military don't get much choice in what they procure; that's why our soldiers are driving around the Sandpit in soft skinned Land Rovers at a time when his Toniness has just taken delivery of an armoured Jaguar limo, cost reported at £80K. Of course he is much more important and useful than any squaddie!
Edited by Armitage Shanks {p} on 05/12/2007 at 22:05
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>>...at a time when his Toniness has just taken delivery of an armoured Jaguar limocost reported at £80K...
What happened to the Beemer and its passengers ?
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RR make very good diesels as well actually (that can run on lpg also) but they may be a bit big for a Citreon - they weigh about 230 tonnes each and power things like the Queen Mary etc.
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RR make very good diesels as well actually (that can run on lpg also)
The RR Diesels i've worked with have all been Pants! the engines produced now with RR badges on are not RR but the product of a famous Norwegian company of Bergen diesels
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In my father's fleet of trucks, we had 3 with Rolls-Royce Eagle diesels fitted - the first, a Scammell Crusader, in the mid 1970's, was fine. Later on, we had 2 Scammell Constructor 8's (these were the T45 cabbed replacements in Leyland's line up for the Octopus during the 1980's).
One of these Constructors was on quarry duty, and we found that it developed an appetite for oil, and needed pistons and liners replacing. It did this twice during the 8 years we ran the truck. During the same period, trucks with Leyland L12, Leyland TL11, and the Mercedes 14.6 litre V8s (**OM422?) ran without needing such serious and expensive work.
Looking back, I now suspect that the air filtration on the Scammell just wasn't up to quarry work, and perhaps any engine downstream of that air intake system would have suffered.
**Except for one truck with the Mercedes V8 in which was completely wrecked when one of our genius driver's changed down instead of up!!
Number_Cruncher
Edited by Number_Cruncher on 08/12/2007 at 12:27
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Strangely, the Nimrod engine is a Gas Turbine and can run on diesel (Nato F76 distillate) as when used as a propulsion engine in RN ships just like the Olympus and Tyne gas turbines, and if you fitted one (or two) to a car, imagine the "bad boy elephant's backside" of an exhaust you would have to have.
Edited by Webmaster on 08/12/2007 at 23:44
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So did Coventry Climax-petrol and diesel.
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Almost want to whisper this ! ( I might have mentioned this before ? ) The three most reliable cars I have ever had ( ie no problems at all......ever. were / is...... a Mondeo TDCI Estate.
Mondeo Diesels "Rool" OK !!!???
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Thanks 659FBE,
" My nomination for the goodies:
Oldest: PSA XUD/TUD (iron block)
Old VAG 1.9 Sdi
Fairly old: VAG PD Tdi (1.9 litre 2 valve only, up to 130 PS) Subject to correct maintenance.
New: BMW diesels - if you strike lucky with turbochargers. MB if they've sorted the glowplugs"
With this forum's help our house has got two of those. But, to get on with my life fairly efficiently I need to pull into traffic queues if / when people let me in, so we haven't got a BMW.
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Mileage and use are more relevant than time when determining reliability.
You make a good point there DP - Anything can be reliable if it is sat there doing nothing.
Edited by Pendlebury on 05/12/2007 at 21:52
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My own experience with a 2006 Mondeo diesel has been very traumatic. Only after two letters from my solicitor has my dealer finally agreed to fix the vehicle under warranty. The car has had several attempted repairs in the past so hopefully I will get a lasting cure. It seems clear that there is a lack of adequately trained people to repair these engines.
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It seems clear that there is a lack of adequately trained people to repair these engines.
And that, in a nutshell, is the problem IMHO. Yes, the engines go wrong, but getting them fixed is like pulling teeth, and turns a minor inconvenience into a stressful, and sometimes wallet emptying nightmare. If it was a case of in, fix, out, sorry sir no charge and have the next service on us by way of compensation, I'm sure you'd feel no more than mildly inconvenienced.
In fairness, while there are undoubtedly some highly skilled people in main dealer service departments, I think there are an increasing number who, beyond plugging in the diagnostic rig and following instructions, are completely incapable of fault finding and repairs beyond the really glaring obvious.
It's not just diesel engines either. See how long it takes a dealer to find an intermittent fault on a modern petrol engine that's not logging fault codes.... My last one was four months!
Cheers
DP
--
04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
Edited by DP on 06/12/2007 at 11:00
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I can understand that tracking an intermittent fault would cause any mechanic difficulty. However when the vehicle presents with a continuous and obvious fault they should be able to fix it. The impression I got from my Ford dealer was that the service manager was an administrator and no more technically knowledgable than his staff. The "repairs" consisted of replacing parts on a random basis in the hope that I would go away and not come back.
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Since 1998 I have had three French diesel cars (1 Renault, 2 Citroen), covered in excess of 300,000 miles and none of them have let me down ever.
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Since 1998 I have had three French diesel cars (1 Renault 2 Citroen) covered in excess of 300 000 miles and none of them have let me down ever.
Which is fantastic, but I suspect that it proves nothing in the same way that my Japanese diesel letting me down within the first 25k miles shows nothing useful about reliability.
It did however suggest to me that France in August was not the place to break down, it was a nightmare,
Edited by Gordon M on 06/12/2007 at 11:53
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I suspect that years of striving to make diesels as quiet and responsive as petrols has compromised the once legendary reliability. I had no qualms buying my old Pug 505 turbo diesel at 113k on the clock and it went on well over 200k with only split rubber hoses or a wiring short on the auto box letting it down (and a garage induced wheel bearing nightmare - a story in itself); the engine itself never gave any problems and servicing only consisted of oil changes at 6k-8k miles (when i remembered)
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I agree with normd2. I ran a Citroen 1.9d Xud for years without any problems at all, but I replaced it with a 1.6tdci C-Max which had a host of problems. I was offered a replacement C-Max that had an engine at 10k that sounded gruff, rattly and was covered in oil, which I obviously rejected. Having been a big diesel fan, I reluctantly went back to petrol as I am now too wary to trust a new diesel engine long term. I get about 38-39mpg from a mk2 Mondeo and 35 from a Mazda 5 which isn't great, but until there is a diesel engine out there that trades a bit of performance and refinement for a return to rock solid reliability and no huge repair bills, I'm sticking to petrol.
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Well if my Yaris diesel ever needs expensive work , I know it's cheaper to buy a complete engine with entire fuel system on ebay for £750.. or so.
The fact that they can remain unsold for months suggests the demand is not very high. The Toyota forum is hardly full of people complaining of faults on diesels despite some doing well over 100k. I have perhaps seen one: and that was over red warning lights... the engine was still running ok.
But wdik
madf
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JCB's are so cool. JCB song here, but takes a while to load. Lovely animation.
www.jcbsong.co.uk/jcbvideo.asp
All together, "And we're holding up the bypass..."
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Great song! Isn't it weird how you look at the "child" singing throughout most of the song! The magic of cartoons.
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