Thanks for those interesting comments.
The number on the test cert. is VF38ERHYF81358081, and it's a June 2001 Y reg 90bhp version (no intercooler).
You mentioned the "aircraft skts." below the battery - are they literally beneath the battery? What do these aircraft skts. connect?
I noticed a wiring bunch going into a square 10cm black housing, but these were to the right of the battey housing, not below. I have disturbed this area recently because I had to change the N/S dipped beam bulb.
As said, the anti-pollution fault comes and goes.
I was told (wrongly, I suspect) that because there's an events log stored in the ECM mofule, the EMS software looks at this log and makes an "intelligent" decision as to what to do (why would it look at past events?).
I removed the EMS computer module by the way (front LHS under bonnet) and re-seated and squirted the large black plug/skt. and another smaller adjacent square connector - perhaps the diagnostic connections that lead into the socket in the cab? - when I was chasing the "intermittent cut out" fault (which thankfully is still clear). I wondered if this action clears the events log as the 12v supply is removed, or like many embedded software systems, is there a battery back-up within the EMS computer? In which case, why do people suggest removing the battery to, supposedly, clear the events log and "boot up clean" on re-connection.
Questions questions questions.
I'd love to look at the coding on these units!!!
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I had a 206 HDi and this fault that you are experiencing was cured by a trip to the delaer for a software update/download. At the risk of appearing sarcastic on Xmas day ( I am not)! the answer to
I was told (wrongly, I suspect) that because there's an events log stored in the ECM mofule, the EMS software looks at this log and makes an "intelligent" decision as to what to do (why would it look at past events?).
Because it can't look at future events. The past is all it has to go on! Perhaps I have misunderstood your question - probably!
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What..... ..for
The intricacies of the ECM's internal software must remain a mystery to all but those that write it. Your [all-important] engine code is RHY which does indeed make it a 90bhp unit built between '99 and '04, with either a Bosch or Siemens ECM, but [Thank goodness!] without an Eolys particle filter system. The ECM has indeed got a back up battery. [Many earlier systems hadn't.]
The "aircraft sockets" [dealer parlance] connect the engine loom to the body loom. They're right below the airbox; round multi-way wiring connectors; be careful - their terminals [and wiring] can crumble after only a few years of salt-spray. I'd settle for just giving them a soaking in waterproofing squirt. [Wouldn't hurt to do the same for the loom that runs below the rad.]
Code P1112 often appears after intermittent cutting-out. It's one of the few things that can stop the engine; the ECM can usually deal with the rest using "limp-home." It would be interesting to know what code comes up after an A/P fault warning. There's a couple of thousand codes to choose from; but maybe a sticking EGR valve would be top of a long list..... These can be plagued with false codes from earth-path interference; so a code-read would be a necessary first step.
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I'll have a look at those sockets - thanks for that suggestion and their position information.
Re. the A/P fault codes, when they were checking out the cut-out problem, the event log listing had some other "past" codes relating to this A/P fault , but I can't remember the numbers. I do think though it mentioned amongst other things the air mass (air temperature?) sensor circuitry ( think!) - is that the connector block and sensor array on the large corrugated hose between the air filter housing and, I presume, the turbo (next to the accellerator sensor array)? I have 'lubed and reseated these and checked for faulty plug & socket connections.
Again, thanks for the tips.
As I said, I'll have a look at those "aircraft sockets" first.
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W/f
An intake air temp sensor code [P0111 - 0114?] would probably trigger an A/P warning. [Pretty small beer in the pecking order of sensors; but the ECU can be over-sensitive to these things...]
There is a modification for the earth circuit of the MAF/IAT sensor [yes; that's it] to try and stop false accelerator position sensor codes [P0220/0221/1220/1221] being flagged. It's basically cutting the earth wires [shared by the fuel temp sensor and the APP sensor] at the MAF [terminals 3 and 6: wire coded 8094E/F - often red?] and extending it to a good earth on the engine. Rarely seems to work.
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Thanks again for that.
Out of interest then, I presume, because the Computer module has battery back-up, temporarily removing the car battery connection won't re-set the events log etc. (unless the back-up is only of duration enough (say a few minutes?) to allow a failing main battery to be changed)?
Again, I presume that these error logs must be cleared by the diagnostic unit. And, back to my original point, if they are just left, is the software intelligent enough to "look back" at these and influence the car operation (e.g....(as the programmer might note in the comments alongside the coding, "....there are numerous A/P flags, therefore it's going to run in limp mode untill these flags are cleared and the intermittent fault is sorted......"
What do you think?
PS sorry, the reply comments re. system programming were in response to Armatage Shanks' comment about the program looking at past / future events. (thanks for your input AS)
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CONCLUSION:
Fault was Fuel Pump Pressure regulator solonoid
Thanks for all of the interesting comments and help - sorry it's taken so long to report the conclusion.>> Thanks again for that.
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Glad you got there in the end; so it actually turned out to be what I mentioned in my first post....
"The running-on is the system reducing the rail-pressure to a safe level before shutting-down. or possibly the pressure-control solenoid sticking because you've been using supermarket fuel, which is a bit "dry" for these.
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Hi
I have read all your messages, and seem to have the same problem.
I have a 406 Executive HDi (136), VIN VF38E4HXF81303504, April 01 reg.
The "antipollution" light now comes on every time I start up, and the engine symbol stays on, with the car in "limp-home" mode. The engine cuts out unexpectedly when slowing down - i.e. foot off the pedal, and then can be restarted after a few seconds.
I had it into a Pug garage with the following results: (4HX BOSCH EDC15C2)
""Engine ECU
EDC15C2
Permanent fault, Additional heating circuit, Short to earth or open circuit .
Intermittent fault, Diesel pressure sensor/regulator coherence, Coherence between regulator current and diesel pressure.
Intermittent fault, Catalytic converter downstream temperature signal (cata ). Short circuit to positive or open circuit .""
The garage's report is:
""Attend to additive fault and loss of power, used pps
found various intermittent faults checked out parameters
fap filter ok and additive level not reached,
checked parameters of fuel pressure all ok at time of test.
due to experience of fault recommend hig pressure pump.
Customer to take and try""
The faults recurred within 20 minutes / 15 miles, so I took it back and they shrugged their shoulders. They think I need a new pump - about £500 + labour!!
As the car is worth at best 6-8 times that, it's not worth the expense!
I shall try using Shell or Esso diesel, and add a bit of Redex to see if that helps - or do you have other suggestions please?
Any advice gratefully received...
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This is more in the way of an enquiry. I also have an 03 406 Rapier RHY. The anti pollution fault has lit and it is in limp home mode. The engine fault light and limp home mode kick in after about 2 miles running in the morning and stay on for the rest of the day. I have had it on a computer and the fault registered is "pre-post heater relay". The car is new to me after 110,000 mile in a V reg version without these issues. Any ideas???????
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amateur
That code isn't the one causing the problem; it's very common to find it at any HDi code reading and it's usually a glow-plug or glow relay gone down.
[They don't use them to start in temperate conditions; but they stay on a long time post-start and that eats the plugs/relays.]
What did you read it with and can that tool read Peugeot P1xxx and P2xxx codes as well as EOBD ones?
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I will check and get back to you next week. Thanks for your help.
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To Screwloose. Will not be able to get the codes till next Tuesday now. Will get back to you then. Just have to limp for a week.
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amateur
That's fine. No rush; but when you come back with your codes etc. it's best to start your own thread.
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Hi.
Real-time embeded software systems normally monitor "present events" - via transducers, sensors etc, etc., over pre-determined time "slots" (milliseconds or microseconds) implimented at the software design stage, and decisions are made on these readings in "real time" (i.e. now) to activate responses of some kind.
Not unlike our MSWindows PC operating system, for diagnostic purposes, it is possible to build in an error events log store so that when an abnormal conditiion occurs, one can look at the events log table and try to determine what caused what (the problem with these systems is they just report on "condidtion", and suggest what might have caused them. For example, if there was low pressure reported from some pressure sensor, it could be a faulty pump, wiring, blockage or even the sensor itself! There is no built in component level monitoring - although there are ways of incorporating this.)
My point about a past "events log", is that some very intelligent software, if the system components were monitored at high enough speed (i.e. at regular intervals), could make use of this log and then determine the exact sequence of events, which may well point to the faulty component that started the sequence.
I doubted whether the Peugeot system in question actually does this and "looks" at the events log to influence further action later - I suspect it's a diagnostic tool only.
Hope that's cleared that one up.
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A friend had recently the same problem with 406 2.0 HDi,2001, anti-pollution system defective, cut -out the engine while driving and running a few seconds after switched-off. Checked at Pug garage:injection pump failure.diagnosis: 50 pounds, 960pounds?????? with his pump:290pounds!!!!
SNIPQUOTE!
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 06/07/2008 at 12:51
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