The clutch on my 1997/56k Citroen ZX 1.4i seems to be pretty worn. I'm basing this on:- Slightly awkward, scrapey gear change, improved a little but not cured by greasing linkage joints; slowly worsening over time.
- High biting point; lowering biting point makes gear change worse.
- Clutch slowly becoming less smooth, more juddery.
- Very occasional slight brief burnt smell under load.
My local Citroen authorised repairer has just taken a look at the gear change problem and said the next thing to try would be changing gear oil, but that there's not much point doing this now as the clutch will need replacing before too long which should improve gear change and would involve changing gear oil anyway. I'd like to give them the clutch job but they quoted about £350 inc VAT, Mr Clutch £200 inc VAT.
I'm not clear about what a clutch replacement actually includes. The Haynes manual recommends replacing friction plate, pressure plate assembly and release bearing as a matched set. Is that what a "clutch kit" consists of? Is that what I would get from a quick-fit clutch place? When I rang Mr Clutch they warned against leaving it too long in case the flywheel became damaged, is that legit?
Any recommendations (or otherwise) for clutch work in the Bristol area? (No libel, of course - see Naming and Shaming: www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=27804 ) Or feel free to email me: iamaluddite at yahoo dot com. I'm wary of getting stung for expensive "extras" at quick-fit outfits after reading some threads here, any advice to avoid getting ripped off?
Thanks, Dave
(Same car as "Maintaining infrequently-used Citroen ZX" www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?f=4&t=41...7 )
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Yes, sounds like typical worn out clutch. A kit should be the three items listed in the manual, it is worth doing all three.
The gearbox oil will be drained to remove the clutch anyway. I would also have the gearbox output shaft (drive shaft) oil seals replaced at the same time. The added cost as part of the total is negligable.
I live about 20 miles north of Bristol, there are several Citroen independants in my area, all good ones. Post back if they may be of interest to you.
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mjm, thanks for the advice. Yes, the independents would be of interest if you'd like to post details or email me.
Cheers, Dave
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Why would you need to drain the g/box oil to change the clutch or is there something even more peculiar about Citroens?
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Almost all FWD will need the gear box oil draining when the clutch is changed since the box needs to come out, which means removing the driveshafts from the box - and it's only the shafts that stop the oil coming out.
--
RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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DHJ,
I have used all three of these at various times.
Phil Neate, Wallbridge, Stroud 01453 752186
Moss Motors Chalford Nr Stroud 01453 885097
P&R motor services Tetbury 01666 505010
All are good, but the last one, P&R I would give an extra point to, if you see what I mean. It is an added bonus for me that they are only a couple of hundred yards from work.
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If you're thinking of doing it yourself (or just want to know more about what's involved), have a look at:
cx.podolsk.ru/xm/docum/haynes_zx/zx-06.pdf
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Thanks mjm for the contact details. Also SaabFanatic for the link - seems to be scans of the Haynes manual, which I have. Sadly I don't currently have the facilities, competence or confidence to attempt a three-spanner job myself!
I had an idea to guard against unpleasant surprises from quick-fit centres. I've read about someone being tempted by a cheap quote, only to get a call halfway through the work saying that an extra job needs doing and will cost an exorbitant amount. By then they have you over a barrel because your car is in pieces on their premises. The idea is to come up with a standard list of questions that you get them to answer, preferably in writing, when shopping for a quote, including prices for any "extra" jobs. This is what I came up with for a clutch job, just based on a few things I've read about here and in Haynes, so this is a first prototype and would benefit from expert comment.
Please give quotes for each of the following (1-5), making clear whether parts, labour & VAT are included in each case.
1) Replace clutch. Please indicate whether this includes all of: friction plate, pressure plate assembly, release bearing, gearbox oil.
2) Only if necessary, replace crankshaft left-hand oil seal.
3) Only if necessary, replace transmission shaft oil seal.
4) Only if necessary, repair sump-to-cylinder block joint.
5) Only if necessary, re-surface flywheel bearing surface.
6) Please state your hourly rate for any work (e.g. 2-5 above) additional to the clutch replacement.
7) Please state whether all clutch parts used are branded or non-brand/pattern parts, which brand will be used and whether all parts are new or reconditioned.
8) Please give details of your guarantee, including details of any limitations or exclusions.
If people think this is a useful idea, perhaps it could be developed into a section of the FAQ with questionnaires for the most common jobs, to help consumers regain the initiative. I emailed the questions to a clutch franchise this afternoon. No response yet.
Dave
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I think you are going a bit overboard, to be honest. A clutch change is an everyday procedure for most garages. The general work involved is much the same whatever the car. Even with your list the garage may find a split drive shaft gaiter or a dodgy joint. Where do you stop? In reality you have to decide whether you trust the garage doing the job. How will you know what they have done without watching them or taking it all apart to check? A good garage will want repeat busines.
The last job I had done was a cam belt change. I gave the garage a free hand to replace water pump, tensioners etc if required and left them to it. They also had a contact number just in case.
Have a look at HJ's good garage guide on this site. From memory there is on at Frenchay, north Bristol.
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I think you are going a bit overboard, to be honest.
In the case of a trusted garage, I agree and I wouldn't feel the need to go to these lengths with the garage I usually use. The problem is that they quoted £350, Mr Clutch £200. And after reading threads like "Clutch on Subaru" www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=719&v=f I feel uneasy about using that firm. That's why I tried to think of a way for us customers to arm ourselves with the means to ensure a fair deal. I still haven't had a reply from Mr Clutch to my email. I'd be interested to hear of other people's experiences with them.
Have a look at HJ's good garage guide on this site. From memory there is on at Frenchay, north Bristol.
Thanks, I wouldn't have found this without your help as it's not listed under Bristol.
Cheers, Dave.
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I agree. A clutch change is pretty bog standard. A Citreon specialist will have done dozens of these and can probably do it pretty quickly. Do however insist on a full 3 part clutch of good quality, and ask to see the old bits. I once only replaced the friction plate to save money. Hopelessly cheap-skate. In 4 months it all had to come out again. One new part will just not mesh with 2 older parts. The clutch bits are probably only £60+ from Euro Car parts. Its getting the gearbox out that is the difficult bit.
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