Posted on behalf of my mother:
Her H-Reg SAAB 900i is very difficult to start in cold weather. The car will turn over as usual (albeit seems slow to me) but will not fire. Once the day warms up a bit it usually starts OK but this is not much use to her as she needs it to get to work.
She's had the battery and plugs checked and the HT leads and distributor cap changed with no success. I've suggested they get the coil and lead changed which they are doing this week but this is clutching at straws. Also I've checked the fuel pump is working. Oh, and they had the oil changed within the last 6 months also and she doesn't use it much so no high mileages or lots of runs involved.
Does anyone have any other suggestions if changing the coil doesn't help? Apparently this one year does not have a feature connector on the ECU so they can't even plug it in and see if any faults have been registered... Does anyone know if there is any other way to find out? (I don't know what sort of injection but I can find out if necessary - I believe it's the newer B202 [?] engine if that helps)
TIA
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Looking at other posts on this forum it seems there is plenty of technical knowledge out there... Yet no-one can give me simple hints on cold starting problems???
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COuld be lots of things. You could start with the coolant temperature sensor and its wiring. Might be best to take it to a Bosch agent for some diagnostics.
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COuld be lots of things. You could start with the coolant temperature sensor and its wiring. Might be best to take it to a Bosch agent for some diagnostics.
Find in principle, however as I've pointed out in the OP, apparently the ECU has no connector so can't be hooked up to a computer for fault diagnosis...
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I agree. If you have tried to eliminate the obvious, (what about the £3 rotor arm) then a Bosch centre is a good idea. A good centre will wire the car up, leave it outside in the cold, and push it in, connect it up to the machine and watch for the problem. Usually they will do a tune up at the same time.
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Time for my party piece again: try an injector cleaner before considering anything more expensive. And, as usual, I'll add that it may not help, but it will do some good anyway. I stick to the VW/Audi Group stuff (part number G 001 700 03).
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Time for my party piece again: try an injector cleaner before considering anything more expensive.
I know they've tried Redex - would this have the desired effect or are you talking something stronger?
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>> Time for my party piece again: try an injector cleaner before >> considering anything more expensive. I know they've tried Redex - would this have the desired effect or are you talking something stronger?
A friend of mine used to work for a SAAB dealer. They always recommended using Winn's injection cleaner to their customers who had dirty injectors.
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It's worth checking the battery earth strap is not corroded, where it bolts to the battery tray.
Also, the battery voltage when cold needs to be at least 10v - anything less and you'll have trouble starting. Ideally, you need 12v or more.
There'a also the starter motor solenoid earth....!
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I'm sure any injection cleaner will do what it says on the bottle. I've used only the VAG one and it worked, specifically clearing up slow-starting and cool-running problems on an Audi 100 within a day of first use.
Note that Redex have both a Petrol Injector Treatment and a Petrol Treatment. I'd guess that the latter wouldn't add much to what a fuel with good additives (Shell, Texaco) will do anyway.
www.holtsauto.com/products/index.html
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Back on this one again I'm afraid.
I've tried the injector cleaner with no improvement. I've given the car a long (~15 mile) run at high engine speeds and varying load to clean things out and again no difference.
I'm told the car has had a new coil, new distributor cap, new HT leads, new battery, new air filter and the plugs were checked and are fine.
Once started and running the car runs superbly for its age. It is reluctant to fire even when conditions are good. It does turn over well enough though. If it does start it needs a bit of work to get it running as it ticks over low - the battery light stays on until you get it going properly.
In cold or damp conditions it is not happy about starting and this is what I'd like advice on curing.
As I've said elsewhere, we are told it cannot be put on a diagnostic computer so what else can we do?
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Rather than throwing parts at the problem, you need some proper diagnostics.
Take it to a Bosch agent and get them to test the outputs from the coolant temp sensor, crank sensor etc. They *can* easily test these in a few minutes.
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I'm with Aprilia here, but you must establish whether you have a spark at cold cranking if not then the crank sensor may be your problem, however you mention that although you can get it started the alernator light stays on, this may be telling you you have an earth strap problem somewhere. You must test for the voltage at the ECU and main ignition system. You may not be up to yhis and you require to leave the car overnight at a reputable diagnostic centre. Regards Peter
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I have just checked up on the B202 engine and according to my records it *is* possible to read fault data from this installation. In fact you can read the data yourself via 'flash codes' by shorting out two pins on the DLC. The injection system will be either a Lucas Cu14 or Bosch LH-Jetronic (2.2/2.4) and there *is* a diagnostic connector. Should be dead easy to sort out.
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Apparently there is a diagnostic connector on all variants *except* this model year. It's been to a Saab specialist who told us this as well as to a 'normal' garage. I'll suggest they find a Bosch agent and try them but you'd have thought the Saab bloke (Parkers in Sunderland for those who know the area) would know this?
Don't suppose anyone can recommend someone else in the area? (They are based on Co Durham so I can't get down often to do testing myself)
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I suspect most SAAB dealers seldom see a 13-year-old car.
Just check yourself that there is no diagnostic connector. Apparently it should be on the driver's side (probably under the dash or in the fusebox) and is a small. more-or-less square connector with three pins. Apparently all '85-93 cars should have this - I can't see why a '91 car wouldn't have it.
In the long run a Bosch agent is going to be your best bet by far.
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I suspect most SAAB dealers seldom see a 13-year-old car.
Not a Saab dealer - a specialist. We've had all but our first Saab from him and he has been on the go for years so the age of the car is no issue. I think this is the year they changed to this type of engine and for some reason the connector wasn't fitted. Indeed, I can't locate one unless it's well hidden.
Will try a Bosch place though, assuming there is a good one local to them. I have a good one near me but I doubt it's worth a 250 mile round trip to fix it...
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Actually, before we start getting overly complicated, I noticed something odd when I was working on it before. When you take the fuel filler cap off there is no flap or anything, you just get to the pipe itself. Now I must admit I can't remember about previous Saabs they have had but on both of the cars I have had there has been a spring-loaded flap which I always assumed was partly to keep the system pressurised.
Should there be a flap, and could it have any bearing on things?
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