Morning all,
Since changing the thermostat on my ZX I think I have managed to get an airlock. The engine temp rises normally but even at a decent temp there is no heat from the blower.
I saw a decent thread a bit ago about getting rid of airlocks in these engines but I can't find it in the archives. Can anyone tell me where I can find it ?
Thanks
Paul
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This the one?
www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=8539
Hope it helps :-) I won't suggest anything - not sure how to cure it apart from this topic says.
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A quick tip: park the car on a slope with the front at the highest level or use ramps. This will encourage air bubbles to migrate to the header tank. Release radiator cap(engine not running and cold). Start engine and run for 2 minutes with heater switched fully on. Switch off again and wait. Watch bubbles appear (hopefully)
madf
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Depending on the age of ZX, you might find there is bleed hose coming off the heater matrix connection, terminating near the fuel priming bulb. This makes life much easier! I think the heater works on flaps rather than a valve, but set it to full hot anyway.
Get the front on ramps, or on a steep drive. Fill carefully to the brim (bleed screws open) then fit a header tank (a 2 litre plastic bottle, with possibly some PTFE tape around the neck to get a good seal helps) and keep filling till you get water out of the bleed screws, then close them, and add a bit more coolant. Now run the engine (header tank in place) till the fans come in and out, keeping water in the header tank all the time. Stop engine and allow to cool, then remove the header tank and refit the cap. Take it for a run , and the coolant should settle to its own level.
If you suspect an airlock - do something about it straight away - these engines do not take kindly to being overheated at all....
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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Some progress of late,
Popped on a makeshift header tank and put the car on ramps. Filled the header and used the bleeding screws some air came out.
Then I started the engine and ran till hot, when the fan kicked in a load more water was gulped in - but not more air came out.
Current situation is that I suspect it has been bled OK, BUT the heater still blows out what can only be described as tepid - when the heater is set fully hot..
I have used radweld in the past.
Do you think I still have an airlock ?
Thanks
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Don't rule out head gasket failure here. It's often the problem when engines appear difficult to bleed.
Unfortunately these are not the most robust of engines, and don't take much overheating to lift the head gasket.
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I know what your saying, but since the engine has been working OK (before these problems) I dont think it has ever overheated..
Also, I have had a leaky heater matrix...
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Radweld: leaky heater matrix?
I suggest you have a fully silted up heater matrix.. radweld + corrosion + air = a gelatinous mess which will fill up all fine holes...
madf
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hum, guess I need to find someone who is up for the challenge of a dash out / matrix swap :-( Any budding volunteers who done this sort of stuff before !!?? Theres a beer in it.. or two!
Paul
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All,
It looks like this weekend will be the dash-out job. e.g, when I break it I'll be "dashing out" to the local garage for help!
Just before I do, I want to make sure that it is defo required.
I have bled the system (car up on ramps with a header tank and used bleed screws) pipe from the rad gets red hot OK and when i turn the heater on water was gulped from the header - does this indicate its not a heater valve problem. Bleed valves worked fine after popping a couple of bubbles out.
In summary, after bleeding it a couple of time I still get only slightly warm air through the blower - almost cold, but the rad is boiling hot..
Going from everyone's comments it look like the Matrix is at fault (possible sludge as car has 133k miles on it). Like I said before I have used radweld to solve a previous matrix leak.
Hope you'all can understand that I am double checking, before I spend 7 hours of my Saturday.
Also, someone posted an info sheet on swapping one in a 306 - can find in the archives though..
Last time I got no further than trying to unplug the speedo cable from the back of the dials - any tips on that one ???!!!
Thanks
Paul
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Heres my link to the 306 matrix job I did.
I believe Cit ZX matrix is identical.
www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=20998
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Would it be worth disconnecting the hoses from the heater and connecting a garden hose to check whether it really is blocked....could also reverse flush.
Good luck
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I'm getting pretty worried about this job already and its now where near the weekend. Dilema is: I paid £300 for the car - everything else works fine..
What if I break beyond repair ? Best garage quote is around £200.. Should I risk it or pay the piper?
Your nervously.
Paul
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Just disconnect the heater and drive without one..
madf
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>>Just disconnect the heater and drive without one..
I`m sure that will go down well on a freezing day. :-(
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Steve
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If you have time on your hands, do it yourself. The matrix costs about £30. Make sure you have all the torx screw drivers to hand, and you'll need another pair of hands to shift the dash. And dont follow haynes manual about disconnecting from engine bay, disconnect matrix from drivers compartment via 2 screws.
Good luck!
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It is with sadness I announce that I have decided to get it sorted at the local garage. Knowing a mate in the trade I have got the labour price down to £120 which I think is a more than fair price. Offset against me spending a hole weekend trying to sort it. Also, if I get any more problems then its straight back to the garage.
I have invested in the spirit of things with this car and still have a couple of niggles (rear heated screen & oil breather pipe) to sort before I'm sure it'll make it through the winter, but I think its important for me to know when I've met my match.
Having had quotes varying between £250 for the labour up to £550 I think I've got a pretty good price.
I'll report back with what is feels like to have a warm car later next week.
Thanks for everyones assistance, sorry if I've wasted anyones time.
PC
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Hello Friends,
I hope you get your problem sorted out Paul. I couldn't help thinking that you might be able to help me because I have a similar problem. My car is a Citroen ZX but it's not a turbo, just a plain 1900 diesel that's coming up to 200k. About 2 months ago I was having problems with steam coming out of the heater so I asked the man at the garage to by-pass it altogether an so now I just freeze on a cold day. BUT..the problem now, I think, is either air or water getting into the system. The car fires up and then dies after a few seconds. What was happening is that I'd be driving down he road and suddenly it would feel like the power had reduced and then it would pick up again, then die out then pick up and so on and I would chug home. This happened a couple of times and on Monday I drove it home about 20 miles and it wouldn't kick in again when I pumped the accelerator. Eventually, I got home in 2nd gear reving it at tops just to keep it from conking out.
Now when I try to start it, theres just a quick burst of life and then it cuts out. I followed the fuel lines till I got to a rubber bulb and then follow it to filter and then followed it to a bleed nipple just before the pipe entered the box with 4 pipes on it which go to the injectors. I tryed squeezing the bulb whilst opening the bleed nipple to see what would happen but it came out nice and clean with no bubble or water as far as I could tell. I tryed to start it and got the wife to squeeze the bulb at the same time but that made no odds. It still stopped after a few seconds. Also, When I was driving the car I was beginning to hear a wheezing/whistle sound when I let my foot on and off the accelerator. I'm thinking that air is somewhere being drawn in. Also, I went to the Co-op last Friday and left drips of diesel all over the carpark, which made me think that perhaps diesel is getting out of the same hole that the air is getting in?.Well, I can't think of anything else to tell you except that when I was coming home that last day, she was bellowing blue smoke and on a couple of occasions over the past fortnight the oil light has come on even though I know there is plenty of oil in the car. Well....If you've managed to get to the end of this diatribe, thanks for listening. Any suggestions/explanations would be gratefully recieved, bear in mind I'm a bit of a novice but I'll have a go if the job is relatively easy. Is there any tests I could do to find out if there is a hole somewhere? And, another question which has got me stumped is concerning how the system works. I can see how the fuel comes into the box which has feeds to the injectors, which also has the arm with the accelerator cable attached but I can't understand what the pipe does that comes out of the top of this box. It has a 3/4 inch nut which screws into the top of the box and the pipe comes out from the nut and goes over the top of the engine, down the back of the engine and then under the car somewhere. Is this pipe a feed back to the tank for excess fuel? Also, from this pipe comes another little plastic pipe which goes to the one of the injectors (strange though it only goes to one). Anyway, as you can see I'm groping in the dark and I wouldn't mind a bit of your help, thanks for any answers. Yours. Stafford
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The box is the high pressure fuel injection pump, but i don't know what the pipe that goes round the back of the engine is! i don't have this pipe on my car (same engine) but i think you may be right with your guess.
It probably is an air leak into one of the fuel supply lines.If you are leaking diesel then there must be a hole somewhere.But it is probably quite a large one so that pumping the priming bulb makes no difference. The bulb usually only helps with starting trouble only. (in my experience)
The way to find the leak is to trace each fuel line slowly and methodically and patch any holes up as you go.
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OK, bit of education first..
The 'box' is the injection pump - this raises the pressure of the fuel and controls when and how much much is injected (diesel equivalent of carburettor). The big pipe is indeed a fuel return - the fuel is used to cool and lubricate the pump internals. The small pipe is called the injector leak off pipe - a small amount of fuel comes back from the injectors, which is also used to cool and lubricate the internals of the injectors - if you look carefully you'll see small rubber hoses joining all the injectors together.
Now, if you are leaking deisel on the floor you have a leak - my guess is that the return hose is leaking where it goes down the back of the engine. You will probably need to replace this rubber pipe all the way from the injection pump to the steel pipes under the car. Air getting back into the injection pump causes all sorts of odd symptoms with not running, no power, and may upset the injection timing (hence the smoke). I would get this fixed and see where you are.
The oil light coming on is a bit more concerning - it might just be a loose connection of chafed wire, but at 200k it could mean the oil pump is worn out. I'd be tempted not to spend excessive money on this motor in case it goes bang, and find another one - they're really cheap now....
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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