I think you'll find there will be little difference. Certainly the 3 german manufacturers have all issued strict guidelines to their existing dealers about what type and manufacturer of equipment that MUST be used and MUST be serviced/maintained/calibrated every year. Everything must be fully documented and traceable, and staff must undertake a specific amount of specialized factory training on things such as a/c, ABS etc. They are then saying that anyone who wants full approved status must comply with all these requirements, which means a massive investment in training and equipment. I doubt that many independants will realistically be able or willing to go down this route, and if they do, then they will quickly find out why dealers charge so much per hour. Sure they'll be able to undercut the dealer rates, but probably not by much. If an independant doesn't buy the official diagnostic kit (circa £8K initial purchase price)then how is he going to check for any fault codes as required on every service? If he doesn't check, and then something else fails as a result of this, ie. catalytic convertor, where is the customer going to stand, especially as many fault codes are dated?
Even if you can get basic servicing done at half dealer labour rates (parts will still be the same price), over the first 3 years of an average mileage vehicle, the savings probably won't be that great. If you throw in a couple of warranty issues that necessitate a trip to the dealer anyway, and then some haggling over whether or not it should have been picked up earlier, then the possible savings may diminish even further.
Here is an example of why the proper kit is required:- You take your newish Merc to an independant for a service. He says you need new brake pads. Unless he has the Merc Star computor, he can't fit them, as you need this to wind back the electric calipers and to depressurise the hydraulic system. It will also be needed to disable the automatic function that checks for pad wear periodically, even when the ignition is off, by winding the pads onto the discs and carrying out a calculation of pad thickness remaining. Imagine if this isn't diasabled and it carries out this check when there are no pads in there, who will pay then? Ah, you say, disconnect the battery then! That's OK of you have the Star computor to recode the keys.
I'm all for saving a couple of quid, but look beyond the oil and filter change, and look at all the other service and warranty issues that simply can't be done properly without the correct factory equipment, and that costs. Car manufacturers aren't stupid and have been looking at this for a long time, servicing is their cash cow. As a result they have been tying their products into their dealers extremely tightly, and they aren't about to let a flimsy euro law ruin that for them.
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Kal
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I can't find anything on the OFT web site to back up this claim. Nor is it clear whether, if true, this would only apply to new purchases supplied with revised warranty conditions.
Dave N
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The implication of what you are saying is that independants will be incapable of adequately servicing your Mercedes even after the warranty period ends. That should make second-hand Merc values nosedive!
Ian
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I wouldn't mind so much if my BMW hadn't just come back from its fifth visit to the dealer for the same fault! The garage agree that there is a fault but don't seem able to fix it, despite assuring me each time that they have done it.
BMW used to ring me after each service to see how good the garage were, but they seemed to stop a couple of years ago.
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A few months ago I went to a local motor industry 'bash'. I did hear a guy from the local big BMW dealers saying that BMW were sharply increasing the costs of their special tools and that no one making a investment of less than about £45k would be able to meet the requirements of servicing their cars.
On the other hand, my friend who runs his own (sizable) independed 'shop is advertising that he can service cars still under warranty. He is getting quite a few customers - not the prestige stuff, but certainly the cheaper small car owners are going to him (little Pugs, Cits, Ka etc.).
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About 18 months ago I serviced my Leon TDI at 30,000 miles myself using genuine Seat parts and Castrol GTD Magnetec. The turbo blew in spectacular style 2,000 miles later. I spoke with a local dealership and was completely honest with them about the servicing, which up until 30,000 had be carried out by another dealership.
I pointed out that I considered myself competent to service my own vehicle and had retained the reciepts for the genuine parts. I commented that I did not expect a turbo to fail at 32,000 miles. There was no attempt from Seat or the dealership to shy away whatsoever. The car was taken in by the dealership and the turbo replaced under a warranty which I had technically invalidated. It did take 5 days but I dont suppose turbo's are stock items.
I compare this with VW who refused to repair our Mk IV golf's leaking rear screen washer because the car hadn't been serviced by a dealership;
I know which manufacturer I will favour when its time to change motors!
Leon
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Well done OFT, this is really going to backfire on the consumer, especially the DIYer!
Expensive special tools, servicing made more complex by even more use of computer barriers and an array of tri-wing, hollow-spline and other sockets and spanners that we can't buy.
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Well done OFT, this is really going to backfire on the consumer, especially the DIYer! Expensive special tools, servicing made more complex by even more use of computer barriers and an array of tri-wing, hollow-spline and other sockets and spanners that we can't buy.
This regulation is not down to the OFT, it is part of wider EU competition legislation and is related to the changes to Block Exemption. It brings Europe into line with most of the rest of the world.
Cars that are difficult to service (tied into the dealer network) will have a higher overall cost of ownership and will therefore lose value more quickly
When I buy a car I always look at service issues, not just because of cost but also because of convenience issues (e.g. in the case of a breakdown). In general the Japanese have it well sorted. Their cars predominate throughout SE Asia, Australasia and much of Africa. The reason for this is that they are reliable and (relatively) straightforward to repair. Most still make available 'flash code' diagnostics, for example.
Take the dashboard of a VAG car out (e.g. an A4, as I've had to do) and when you plug all the bits back together they don't want to communicate. Do the same with a Japanese car and you don't get the same problems.
I'm not saying they are perfect, but in general they are maintainable with standard tools and there are not too many surprises.
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Aplilia is exactly right (again). Far eastern cars are so much easier to work on, and simple things like disconnecting the battery causes no problems. Try that on a Beemer or Merc, and nothing will work again as it doesn't start talking to each other. Sure, some of the designs are a bit old hat, and some of the technology is behind the times, but there is value in that if you keep the car beyond the warranty period.
Some VW dealers are having to install special ramps if they want to service the new Tourag 4X4. It consists of a regular 4 post lift, with a smaller one incorporated within it. The function of this is to support the massive jig that is needed to lower the front subframe, engine, gearbox and transfer box all as one unit. This function is required as on some engine variants the engine has to be dropped for things such as exhaust sensors and starter motors, as they can't be removed in situ.
Another little 'built-in' feature is fitted to the new Pug 807 and Citroen people carriers. They have a small tank under the car that holds diesel fuel additive. Each time you fill the fuel tank up, the ecu instructs a pump to inject some additive into the fuel tank. This is required in order to get the engine to pass the latest emission rules. It's supposed to last about 50K miles, then the engine light will show. The dealer can then check the code, refill the additive tank, and reset the code. Can you see an independant doing this? Will they even know anything about it?
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Looks like short sighted policies.
Old Mercedes used to last forevere: I can see i 2014 any Mercedes over 8 years old being scrapped as the owner cannot afford to maintain it to pass the emissions tests.
As far as electrics not talking to each other, I refuse to buy any car with complex electrics (I buy privately and keep 4-5 years) if they are likley to be unreliable.
Goodbye to BMW 7 series/ bigger Mercs ALL FRENCH cars..
Buy Japanese you know it makes sense.
As for Italian cars ..... I leave them to so called "enthusiasts"..:-) (polite word )
madf
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Just thinking this through
With the OFT ruling now in place, a couple of things will happen.
Cars will be serviced at non-franchised garages - why would you pay franchise prices to change oil and filters?
Franchised dealers will get less routine work, so there are several options:
1.Lay off mechanics and downsize.
2.Split service and sales as separate entities. Showrooms by
necessity are usually in high rate areas - service can be in
a lower rent area, probably would have to make their rates
more competitive too.
3.Increase the cost of OEM parts to offset the business going
elsewhere (not sure where the OFT would stand on this one).
Once the car is outside warranty, the value will drop consistent with the potential cost of repairs should anything go wrong.
Less complicated/easier to work on cars will retain higher values as potential servicing costs should be lower.
I don't understand the quick-fix mentality behind the diesel fuel additive, it's a totally inelegant solution.
Honda's new diesel is Euro IV compliant (and very fuel efficient) without resorting to additives and without a particle filter - this is the most modern technology without resorting to add-ons to make it work.
This is their first attempt at an in-house diesel, Citroen/Peugeot were at one acknowledged as setting benchmarks in diesel technology, the XUD unit probably introduced more people to diesel power than any other engine.
Progress sometimes takes a long road.
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which honda is the in house diesel engine being fitted to?
I looked at the civic as a replacement for Leonesses mk iv golf, but was told by honda the engine was manufactured by isuzu. That put me off somewhat.
Interested to hear if honda have since released their own...
apologies for the digression off-topic.
Leon
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New Accord - very good engine indeed, check out the facts at
www.honda.co.uk they\'ve got a micro-site all about the engine.
I\'m a tad biased as I\'ve just ordered a tourer but see what you think.
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The new Honda disel is an izusu one.
Excellent engine if I wanted a car like that or in that class I'd buy one the oposition isn't a path on it.
Izuzu know how to make excellent engine that new one is a new benchmark
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Still the problem is offical dealerships will be the only ones able to update the ECU software and car other fixes so non franchise servicing won't keep on top of problems
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The diesel engine fitted to the new Accord is a Honda unit, not Isuzu. If Honda can create a smaller range of diesels which are as good, then we are in for a treat. Imagine a car as good as the Jazz fitted with a top class diesel engine.
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