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Tue 24 Jan 2023 15:57

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

Should the MOT laws be changed so that vehicles are checked less frequently or is the MOT just another tax on those who get their vehicle serviced regularly?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 16:13

All - MOT every 2 years? - badbusdriver

Should the MOT laws be changed so that vehicles are checked less frequently or is the MOT just another tax on those who get their vehicle serviced regularly?

No, it shouldn't.

For the simple (and frankly obvious) reason that not everyone has their car serviced regular, or indeed care whether or not their car is safe to be on the road.

Edited by badbusdriver on 24/01/2023 at 16:14

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 16:16

All - MOT every 2 years? - mcb100

No great hardship spending an hour a year at the MOT bay. Even multiplied by three for the three family cars.
If nothing else, it gives me chance to get underneath and have a good look around.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 17:09

All - MOT every 2 years? - Xileno

The current system seems to work well and keeps the worst heaps off the road. I think the local garage I use charges £40 - irrelevant in the overall cost or running a car. If there's something wrong, I want to know about it. I have the car MOT'd and serviced together so no extra visit needed.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 17:16

All - MOT every 2 years? - Adampr

I keep buying cars from my.village garage. They do free MOTs for life and I can walk home in five minutes, so all good for me!

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 17:23

All - MOT every 2 years? - elekie&a/c doctor

Having been an mot tester in a previous life , I think it would be a good idea to standardise the test fee for all stations with no discount. Garage workshop costs including calibration of the equipment and testers wages have increased considerably recently. Looking at the state of some of the cars on the road, especially tyres and lights, I think they should make the first test after 2 years and then annually.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 18:19

All - MOT every 2 years? - Andrew-T

I believe testing in France is biennial ? I also think the system we have is a sensible compromise. Some owners do little more than put fuel in as required, and possibly check tyre pressures. At least the MoT test should prevent too many dangerous road users. It used to be possible to get an MoT pass at some dodgy backstreet places - does that still happen ?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 18:26

All - MOT every 2 years? - Metropolis.

I am in favour of less testing but perhaps it could coincide with them no longer salting the roads, must cause a huge amount of danger in corrosion of key components and hardly improves the taste.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 18:38

All - MOT every 2 years? - gordonbennet

I am in favour of less testing but perhaps it could coincide with them no longer salting the roads, must cause a huge amount of danger in corrosion of key components and hardly improves the taste.

Indeed, not only does the salt make everything filthy dirty its destructive and damaging to everything it touches and it gets everywhere.

I understand the Japanese use something completely different on their roads, and its well know that grey imports from Japan are typically as rust free at 10/15 years aold as a 1 year old car would be here.

As for testing, no i'm quite happy with annual, we're fairly unusual here the regulars in taking an interest and looking after our cars fairly well, but look at the queries that have come here over the years from strangers, ie engines run low on oil multiple times, you can only hazard a guess at the neglect the rest of the car suffers...the rest of us have always had to bow to and suffer for minorities, that's been the same for ever and shows no signs of inproving.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 18:53

All - MOT every 2 years? - Metropolis.

Interestingly, the Japanese MOT equivalent (the Shaken) is every 2 years.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 19:17

All - MOT every 2 years? - badbusdriver

Interestingly, the Japanese MOT equivalent (the Shaken) is every 2 years.

But it is very strict

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:23

All - MOT every 2 years? - Metropolis.

Good point, it would be interesting to see direct comparisons. I think ours is pretty thorough

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 00:07

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

Interestingly, the Japanese MOT equivalent (the Shaken) is every 2 years.

But it is very strict

Actually, I've seen a "classic" go through the Jap test and it didn't look as strict as The Yook test, but it is EXPENSIVE, which is of course what it is for.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 00:38

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

Subaru did a kei car that looked quite like a mini-VW Beetle. Here’s a vid of one going through the (famously allegedly anal?) Japanese inspection.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzmAmjgGa1U&feature=related

Doesn’t look as tough as the UK MOT to me, if thats typical, and complete.

Last UK one I did the guy was swinging on a pry bar and generally beating the s*** out of it looking for flaws, and I've had testers hit my welding with a BFH quite hard for quite a long time (in clear violation of the MOT rules) before they got tired..

But that might involve getting ones immaculately Japanese white overalls dirty

Edited by edlithgow on 25/01/2023 at 00:51

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 07:54

All - MOT every 2 years? - nellyjak

I understand the Japanese use something completely different on their roads, and its well know that grey imports from Japan are typically as rust free at 10/15 years aold as a 1 year old car would be here.

True...I bought my Estima @ 13 years old and was amazed at the underside condition...incredibly clean and free of rust.

It was then undersealed as part of the purchase agreement and 7 years later it's still excellent and passes every MOT with no advisories...it's 20 years old next month and amazes the MOT guy every time. Both he and I have seen vehicles less that 5 years old in much worse condition.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 19:36

All - MOT every 2 years? - Will deBeast

I'm more concerned that someone can pass a driving test at 17, and never have a day of top-up training in their life.

As a minimum, people should redo their theory test every x years. And ideally they should have a supervised drive with an instructor every y years.

Poor driving causes more collisions than neglected cars.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:20

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

A car passes an MOT on one day. In the time till the next one it can be illegal for any number of reasons. The MOT is often as not for the garage trade to find work. The lawless and there are quite a few of them drive untaxed and uninsured and I don't think that they worry about an MOT. My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem so that's some £400 for nothing.

The chap that has a ""free"" MOT for life and again there are plenty of outlets offering this, how thorough do they think their test is going to be? Can you think that a garage is going to waste 45minutes doing this?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:23

All - MOT every 2 years? - Metropolis.

A free MOT was the most expensive MOT I ever had!

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:29

All - MOT every 2 years? - Adampr

A car passes an MOT on one day. In the time till the next one it can be illegal for any number of reasons. The MOT is often as not for the garage trade to find work. The lawless and there are quite a few of them drive untaxed and uninsured and I don't think that they worry about an MOT. My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem so that's some £400 for nothing.

The chap that has a ""free"" MOT for life and again there are plenty of outlets offering this, how thorough do they think their test is going to be? Can you think that a garage is going to waste 45minutes doing this?

Well, I think it's going to be as thorough as any other. Not very, but they will check it all off.

How does a garage 'find work' with an MOT? By highlighting dangerous faults and developing issues?

As for £400 for nothing....do you go to the dentist and have a little sulk because you don't need any fillings?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:50

All - MOT every 2 years? - badbusdriver

Should the MOT laws be changed so that vehicles are checked less frequently or is the MOT just another tax on those who get their vehicle serviced regularly?

A car passes an MOT on one day. In the time till the next one it can be illegal for any number of reasons.

The MOT is often as not for the garage trade to find work.

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem

Does the word "contradiction" mean anything to you?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 22:42

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

Should the MOT laws be changed so that vehicles are checked less frequently or is the MOT just another tax on those who get their vehicle serviced regularly?

A car passes an MOT on one day. In the time till the next one it can be illegal for any number of reasons.

The MOT is often as not for the garage trade to find work.

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem

Does the word "contradiction" mean anything to you?

The first sentence is just a question not necessarily my view. to prompt debate

The 2nd and 3rd are facts

The forth one you have decided to curtail so the true meaning is lost

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:01

All - MOT every 2 years? - Andrew-T

A car passes an MOT on one day. In the time till the next one it can be illegal for any number of reasons.

The MOT is often as not for the garage trade to find work.

The 2nd and 3rd are facts ...

I don't think you recognise what a 'fact' is. Unless you have statistics showing that about half the MoTs carried out cause unnecessary work. By definition a test is not allowed to include any 'work' unless the owner asks for it.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 20:56

All - MOT every 2 years? - Bolt

How does a garage 'find work' with an MOT? By highlighting dangerous faults and developing issues?

Or finding faults that did not exist which I have come across a few over the years, and failed cars for no real reason other than to get work. it was common practice for some garages whom got a bad name for conning those that had no idea they were being conned

so yes it did happen, possibly still does judging by the state of some cars I see...

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 21:22

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

""does a garage 'find work' with an MOT? By highlighting dangerous faults and developing issues?

As for £400 for nothing....do you go to the dentist and have a little sulk because you don't need any fillings?

You are rather naive if you think that the motor trade is honest

As for my £400 well I have already paid the garage to service the car so it should be road worthy or I am being naive but wait the same garage is doing my MOT! So are they charging me for the MOT or charging me again for the elements that are in the service?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 21:28

All - MOT every 2 years? - Xileno

I prefer the French system where the MOT is separate from the garages that do repairs.

I'm sure there are some rogue garages out there. Same as any trade or profession then.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 23:26

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

I prefer the French system where the MOT is separate from the garages that do repairs.

I'm sure there are some rogue garages out there. Same as any trade or profession then.

You can (or could) achieve this in The Yook by going to MOT only test centres. I used Royal Borough of Enfield when I lived in London (who also serviced the council bin lorries), initially because they could handle my oversized Renault Dodge, but I subsequently used them for cars too. No commercial incentive to fail.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 21:31

All - MOT every 2 years? - veloceman

Maybe depending on mileage rather than age?
Ultimately won’t cost much if your motor passes. If it fails then different story and rightly so.
For me stick as it is now.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 22:07

All - MOT every 2 years? - Adampr

""does a garage 'find work' with an MOT? By highlighting dangerous faults and developing issues?

As for £400 for nothing....do you go to the dentist and have a little sulk because you don't need any fillings?

You are rather naive if you think that the motor trade is honest

As for my £400 well I have already paid the garage to service the car so it should be road worthy or I am being naive but wait the same garage is doing my MOT! So are they charging me for the MOT or charging me again for the elements that are in the service?

If you don't understand the massive difference between service work and an MOT inspection, there is no point carrying on with this discussion.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 22:34

All - MOT every 2 years? - alan1302

The chap that has a ""free"" MOT for life and again there are plenty of outlets offering this, how thorough do they think their test is going to be? Can you think that a garage is going to waste 45minutes doing this?

Would they not be more strict and find more things to get their 'free' MOT money back from you? They don't offer the free MOT deal because they don't think they are going to get money out of you.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:08

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

The chap that has a ""free"" MOT for life and again there are plenty of outlets offering this, how thorough do they think their test is going to be? Can you think that a garage is going to waste 45minutes doing this?

Would they not be more strict and find more things to get their 'free' MOT money back from you? They don't offer the free MOT deal because they don't think they are going to get money out of you.

So are you saying the free MOT outlets will go looking for work to recoup their money?

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:14

All - MOT every 2 years? - alan1302

The chap that has a ""free"" MOT for life and again there are plenty of outlets offering this, how thorough do they think their test is going to be? Can you think that a garage is going to waste 45minutes doing this?

Would they not be more strict and find more things to get their 'free' MOT money back from you? They don't offer the free MOT deal because they don't think they are going to get money out of you.

So are you saying the free MOT outlets will go looking for work to recoup their money?

Yes

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 22:55

All - MOT every 2 years? - Andrew-T

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem so that's some £400 for nothing.

So is the news that your car is fault-free of no value to you ? Are you suggesting that an MoT costs money only if something fails ? That would be very interesting ....

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:05

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem so that's some £400 for nothing.

So is the news that your car is fault-free of no value to you ? Are you suggesting that an MoT costs money only if something fails ? That would be very interesting ....

How can it be news when the garage has serviced it, surely they are going to charge me for any repair they may have to make. Or are you saying I should not trust the garage.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 10:27

All - MOT every 2 years? - Andrew-T

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem so that's some £400 for nothing.

So is the news that your car is fault-free of no value to you ? Are you suggesting that an MoT costs money only if something fails ? That would be very interesting ....

How can it be news when the garage has serviced it, surely they are going to charge me for any repair they may have to make. Or are you saying I should not trust the garage.

No, I am reminding you that servicing will not discover all MoT failure points, just as an MoT will not discover whether a car needs a service. It is convenient to do both tasks at the same time, but they are complementary.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:18

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

Here in Taiwan, inspection is every six months, but it is cheaper and a more limited in scope systems check (brakes, tyres, lights, emissions) without all that “”testers discretion” jive I found such an arbitrary and capricious PITA in The Yook.

Suits me, but then I fiddle with things quite a lot, so I have a fairly good idea what the status is. I don’t miss the UK MOT at all, but I’d think the trade would miss it lots.

Whether a Taiwan stylee regime would be appropriate for the general population in The Yook I dunno. Average fleet age is probably a bit higher there, and there is more of a corrosion issue, so I’d guess road safety might take a small hit, but it’d be very small. IIRC a tiny proportion of accidents are attributable to vehicle status, the vast majority being caused by pilot error.

Accident prevention is probably a dwindling part of the MOT’s role anyway, which I’d guess is mostly these days about getting mystery lights on the dashboard to go away. On my recent UK visit I noted a depressing lack of “bangers” on the road. Don’t remember seeing one, though perhaps surprisingly I saw one or two in (famously anal pre-Fukushima) Japan.

These days its largely about pollution prevention, and that is going away with the IC engines demise anyway.

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Tue 24 Jan 2023 23:37

All - MOT every 2 years? - Bolt

These days its largely about pollution prevention, and that is going away with the IC engines demise anyway.

who said ice was going away, not even certain pollution will go away either, its all assumptions as we usually do.

But agree with Doc the mot should be 2 years on new cars and remain 1 year after as too many neglect there cars which imo is getting worse when you see whats around, including the state of some second hand motors

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 00:12

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

These days its largely about pollution prevention, and that is going away with the IC engines demise anyway.

who said ice was going away, not even certain pollution will go away either, its all assumptions as we usually do.

Seriously?

UK Gov.

OK, I suppose not necessarily the unimpeachable source of wisdom and truth lately, but they are in a position to make it true if they want to, and AFAIK there is no cross-party opposition.

www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/108960/uks-2030-petrol-...e..

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 06:45

All - MOT every 2 years? - badbusdriver

The first sentence is just a question not necessarily my view. to prompt debate

The 2nd and 3rd are facts

The forth one you have decided to curtail so the true meaning is lost

The only way my curtailing your statement has lost its meaning is if you feel an MOT test itself should be free unless the car fails. Which is a truly inexplicable notion (Imagine going to a private dentist for a check-up and expecting it to be free unless you need work doing)

Otherwise, the third and fourth points directly contradict each other.

And the second point directly answers why the MOT should remain at one year intervals.

Personally, I have never got the feeling that I have ever been conned into getting work done that doesn't actually need doing, to get my van through an MOT. My current van was 9 years old with 80k miles when I bought it. It passed its first two MOT's under my ownership without so much as an advisory.

If you don't trust your garage, go somewhere else.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 08:50

All - MOT every 2 years? - skidpan

My 12year old car has passed 9 MOTS without a problem

My Caterham is 30 years old next month, Its passed all its MOT's. There was one crazy advisory when the tester said that if I presented it the next year with the same rear fog light switch he would fail it. I pointed out that the switches were as fitted by the factory, if there was really an issue all the cars sold would need to be fitted with new switches, he said his decision was final. I know the garage owner well and discussed the matter with him pointing out that I would be doing nothing since it was not a problem. He agreed and next year the tester was not there. Its about 15 years since it happened and never an issue since.

Do I regret spending over £1000 in MOT's, certainly don't. Other than the MOT the car never sees a garage and its nice to get someone else to check it over once a year. Would a garage do a "safety" check for £40 approx. I doubt it.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 11:25

All - MOT every 2 years? - John F

Yes. About time too. And also extend the new car requirement to four years.

As is so often the case, the Brits are behind in what is considered sensible and reasonable by other civilised countries, e.g. France and Japan. The quality and reliability of mechanical parts and corrosion protection are considerably better than they were when these MoT inspections were introduced, so it seems a no-brainer that the time is ripe for review of the UK MoT process which sometimes seems to be a licence for garages to print money. A proviso might be made - e.g. 2yrs or 15,000 miles, whichever comes first.

Also, it seems absurd that in contrast to the sometimes overly strict assessment of mechanical and structural functionality, our oldest car in fairly regular use (Triumph TR7) and arguably most likely to develop a potentially dangerous fault, no longer requires an annual inspection - ever!

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 12:04

All - MOT every 2 years? - movilogo

MOT does not affect cost of owning a car that much.

Government can provide lot more help by reducing fuel tax, VED etc.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 12:44

All - MOT every 2 years? - sammy1

The MOT started in 1960 some 62 years ago. When did you last see or hear of an accident primarily cased by mechanical failure. In the days of the old Morris Minor and some others it was not unusual to see a car stranded at the side of the road with a collapsed front suspension and often the different shape of the car was quite amusing. Braking and steering standards were also less efficient.. Today the likes of these old cars are not subject to an MOT test. Some of these old cars are quite valuable but could still be rust buckets and a more potential danger than your modern car. The modern car has been rigorously tested by manufactures to put up with pretty much anything that is thrown after it so an MOT inspection could well be extended.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 21:49

All - MOT every 2 years? - alan1302

When did you last see or hear of an accident primarily cased by mechanical failure.

Not something that's common I expect...so is that down to the MOT having to be done every year?

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 12:51

All - MOT every 2 years? - Andrew-T

... the time is ripe for review of the UK MoT process which sometimes seems to be a licence for garages to print money.

I don't recall ever being 'taken for a ride' by an MoT tester. The only examples I found suspicious were on the service histories of elderly Pugs I have bought - the culprit is commonly K-F, which will probably surprise no-one. One car missed a MoT (2011 I think) and the following year the unfortunate owner was relieved of about £1200, which included a 'full service'

However I suspect I was taken for a ride by a Pug dealer (now long defunct) who 'serviced' my 306 about 1998, claiming it needed both front suspension arms replacing at 25K miles. I was shown the worn items, which of course could have come off any car. None of my 306s have ever needed new suspension arms since.

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 23:00

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

Would a garage do a "safety" check for £40 approx. I doubt it.

I don't

Second car I was involved in (Triumph 1300 bought at auction by a student syndicate) we took it in for an advertised "Free Safety Check" after purchase (we were young and naive).

They gave us a VERY long shopping list of "safety issues", all of which seemed to be the product of "creative subjectivity" on subsequent detailed investigation,, and a very impressive estimate, but of course failed to identify the serious issue with the vehicle, which to be fair wasn't safety related (crack in sump causing engine oil to leak out of the differential breather)

We declined, but bought some oil and a filter off them (at garage prices so a small financial sacrifice) as a sweetner.

As a parting gesture they uber-torqued the wheels on, requiring me to nick a 12 foot scaffolding pole off a building site to get them off again, but maybe they always did that.

We had a "twist or bust" debate and, largely at my urging, bought a shiny Hilka socket set. Never looked back, and never had anything more to do with garages if I could possibly help it.

Big shiny outfit, opposite the Hunslett Grange flats in South Leeds, next to the SPAR. But they might not be there any more. The flats arent.

.Eee..anoother link wi't past gone. Ah were concieved agin tha'' chimbley!

Edited by edlithgow on 25/01/2023 at 23:29

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Fri 27 Jan 2023 11:27

All - MOT every 2 years? - John F

(Triumph 1300 bought at auction by a student syndicate) we took it in for an advertised "Free Safety Check" after purchase (we were young and naive).

They gave us a VERY long shopping list of "safety issues"......, but of course failed to identify the serious issue with the vehicle

Would that have been the nuts behind the wheel?

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Fri 27 Jan 2023 23:38

All - MOT every 2 years? - edlithgow

(Triumph 1300 bought at auction by a student syndicate) we took it in for an advertised "Free Safety Check" after purchase (we were young and naive).

They gave us a VERY long shopping list of "safety issues"......, but of course failed to identify the serious issue with the vehicle

Would that have been the nuts behind the wheel?

Always is, as already pointed out above by myself and others.

(Or it would be if that was an issue with the vehicle)

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Wed 25 Jan 2023 12:47

All - MOT every 2 years? - Crickleymal

Having driven in the USA and seen the state of some cars over there (in states where there's no MOT) I really think a regular check is warranted. As I get older and more arthritic I find I can do fewer checks on the condition of my car so I'm happy to pay for an annual safety check.

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