Given the well-documented problems with head gasket failures on the K series engines of the MGF, can anyone tell me if the problems have been overcome in the TF, as a friend of mine is thinking of buying one after losing his head for the third time, and being told it is too heavily pitted to be ground off!
Ta in advance
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DL is the man for this and may not agree but...
I'm aware when the Freelander head goes in a similar way often the whole engine is replaced first time, they don't mess around with just trying to do the head gasket.
M.M
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I recently purchased an MGTF. After less than 3000 miles the head gasket blew. Repaired but overheated again. Told by dealer this was due to air lock. I did't accept this so it was checked by Rover. They said that a 'restrictor' had been left out of one of the hoses - could this be true? After hearing about head gasket problems with MGTFs, should I accept the car back on this basis or insist on a new engine?
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DL - your lips are sealed. Does that involve a head gasket?
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I was hoping that Rover had sorted these head gasket problems on the K series.
Come on DL - you must have a view!!
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I thought of buying one and read up the problem pages on various MG sites. It would appear that due to the inherently poor design of the cooling system, great care must be taken when refilling the cooling system to bleed it and expell all air to avoid airlocks . If any exist overheating = warped cylinde head.
Most Rover garages know this. Independents specialising in MG do as well. Most other garages do not.
Since the motor trade rarely knows the meaning of the words " great care" I would not touch one second hand without a proper service history cariied out by KNOWLEDGEABLE garages.
Imo any manufacturer who designs and sells a car with such an engine sensitive to ANY coolant problems should ensure the cooling system is 100% fool, idiot and garage proof.
Rover clearly by their actions do not take that view.. and consequently any Rover 1.8 K series is just an accident waiting to happen .. as bourne out by the problems so well docuumented on TV by Quentin Wilson on Land Rover Defenders.. (Land Rover to their credit accept there is a problem.. Rover appear not to want to know).
madf
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Rover DO deny that there is a problem. They told me today that all the incidents reported (including mine) are isolated cases.
Does anyone know if the 'restrictor missing from the hose' was a valid reason for the overheating (obviously just another isolated case :-<)
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"They told me today that all the incidents reported (including mine) are isolated cases."
The word here is "tautolgy". ONE incident is isolated.. "all the incidents" are OBVIOUSLY NOT isolated...
Weasel words - like many politicians - trying to deny what appears to be obvious..
madf
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There have been hundreds of well documented isolated examples of this.
They've had time to get it right too, and no lessons seem to have been learned since the Triumph Stag.
Meanwhile most other manufacturers have managed to get it right, and I'm now at the stage where I'm delighted the Elise will be getting a Toyota engine.
I'd love to buy British, but the TF will be an expensive passport from frying pan to fire. If your friend likes their top down sports cars there's one option.
Sadly it's from Hiroshima.
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Ah, K-series head gaskets....
If anyone out there bought a racing-green Rover 214Si, reg. J568 UOX in September 1995, then I hope the recon. engine for which (along with a new clutch and related gearbox repairs) my mother paid £2,700 has lasted better than the original, which went pop after 34,000 miles of gentle driving and scrupulous servicing.
There is a related sorry tale concerning an extended warranty which proved not to be worth the paper on which it was (badly) printed, which is too tedious to relate.
Didn't the K-series win some sort of design award when Rover originally brought it out?
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The failure of the 'K' series head gasket is a common problem as well documented here. However, the cause was actually identified as the gasket moving whilst in situ. The fix is to fit a new gasket plus two retainig ring to the block. This was done some 12 months ago when i worked in a parts development area associated with Rover. I know the latest fix was very successful but of course there will always be head gasket failures- not just with Rovers but all cars suffer as it is a weak point in any engine. With modern day engines using less and less coolant its the weakest point that fails.
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These are the views of Robin the Technician with 35 years in the trade. I fix, therefore I am...
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Another change made was replacing the plastic (yes plastic!) cylinder head alignment dowels with metal ones. I have not been able to find out exactly when these changes were made. However I have a contact who works in a Rover dealership and he said they used to replace no end of head gaskets on the K-series, the 1.4 and 1.8 were particularly poor. The good news is he tells me they don't do nearly so many now so hopefully Rover (or PowerTrain Products) have sorted the problem.
The K-series has always been good at winning awards, it develops a lot of power for its size and is smooth and economical. However, they are in my opinion not as durable as some other engines.
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My TF has now been returned :-/
Still seems to blow hot & 'cool' through the heater so is this indicting that the coolant system is about to fail again? :-(
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Robin, I have read your article explaining that replacing the original head gasket locating plastic dowels with metal ones (I assume this is what you mean by "two retaining rings") solves the head gasket problem, but wondered whether you had heard the following theories, and what your opinions of them are:-
1. The inlet manifold gasket is a bad design/material and perishes. The subsequent leak causes the water level to drop too low, causing the engine to overheat and the head gasket to blow.
2. The head gasket leaks as a matter of course due to poor engine design and the use of a metal gasket.
I have a 1995 214 Si (1.4L) and have a brown stain on the bellhousing. I am trying to ascertain whether the leak is coming from the inlet manifold or the head gasket. I do not have an overheating problem, and am keen to avoid the scenario which so many other owners seem to have had!!
I have heard that Rover have produced upgraded head gaskets & metal locating dowels, and also a new inlet manifold gasket design/material, but am trying to put off removing the head in case the leak is actually only on coming from the inlet manifold!!!!
Your advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
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Mooseman:
I believe the inlet manifold problem you mention applies to cars with plastic inlet manifolds, and I believe these were superceded with metal ones at some point. Which do you have?
Cheers,
Mark
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Mark,
From memory (the car is at home) the inlet manifold is in plastic from the air filter through to where it passes over to the rear of the engine bay (4 plastic inlet pipes in a row). I cannot honestly say if it then fixes to a metal manifold before bolting to the head, as I haven't looked in that much detail.......does that help you?
Mooseman
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Hi,
I don't remember the details, unfortunately. It's a long time since I had once of these cars. Just mentioned it as something to get you started investigating the problem. I have a feeling it's plastic right up to where it joins the eninge - but I could be wrong.
Cheers,
Mark
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Tell your friend to avoid this car until BMW's quality control has caught up with it. Someone involved in its design told me what any enthusiast could have told the company: initial demand was grossly underestimated. The result was that production was stepped up fast without proper controls.
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BMW's Quality control???? eh?
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groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
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I thought BMW were involved originally. If not, my error, but production still outstripped quality control. Loads of things went wrong with mine.
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No...they washed their hands of the TF well before it was released, taking the Hydrolastic suspension with them!
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groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
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Rover have had many serious problems with the k seris engines as the head gaket problem this is due to the \'skeleton\' design of the aluminum block wich only has a 10mm area between water galeries and the outer perimeter of the engine as where rover fit a tin type gasket wich has a very small rubber seal to actually seal any leaks and this is a very poor design around the oil gallery so normal symtoms are a \'curry sauce\' coluor in the water bottle or in the oil.
If a rover k seris engine is overheated is is garanteed that it will blow the head gasket and could cause long term affects to the general condition of the vechicle.
There is only one small valve in a small hose located on the left hand side of the intake manifold where a small ball bearing type valve sits wich is designed to stop cooland feeding back to the bottle.
In the place that i work we have atleast 1 kseries angine a week to fix the last 1 that was fixed only had 6000 miles on the clock and had placed water in the oil.
If you have any queries on this matter e-mail me at mailto:beckett_boi_87@hotmail.com.
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Have a look at the Mg owners site.they have what they call their "Hall of shame" and anyone who's had hgf is invited to list their details.I don't believe TF's are immune from this problem
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I know very little about cars, but what's happened to mine sounds similar to what's described above. Except it's my own fault! I've got an R-reg Rover 214i 16V (I think).
Doing a motorway drive and noticed the temperature gauge was a little higher than normal. Then I lost power before the engine died on the hard shoulder. After checking under the bonnet (as if I knew what I was doing - after all, I'm a bloke!), I realised that I hadn't properly screwed the cap back on my water tank the night before. Stupid! Therefore I had a lot of steam but very little water.
This is where I get a little confused, but please stick with it. There'll be a question at the end!
I was taken off the motorway to a garage in Swindon. They said the first thing to check would be the 'inlet manifold valve(?)'. So they replaced that at a cost of just under £100 (+ labour, obviously). They then informed me that this hasn't solved the problem and water is being 'dragged through the engine'. So I was put on a truck and brought back to London. Now the car won't start at all. The garage says this is because there's no water in it. So I put water in and still nothing! I know something needs to be fixed, but I thought it'd still be drivable at least for short distances.
So has anybody have any idea what the problem is? I guess it's head gasket related. And any idea how much to fix it? I've been quoted between £600-£1000 over the phone so far, depending on the damage.
Thanks,
Craig.
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Hi, I have just had my headgasket replaced on my P reg 214si, my fault it blew in the first place as I had a leaking radiator and chose to ignore it for a while!!
I had the head gasket, timing belt (good idea to have it changed at the same time), head skimmed, new radiator and all the valves cleaned and reseated for £600 by an idependant Rover specialist, with nearly 100K on the clock the car has never ran as well now everything has settled down..
Shop around for a cheaper price as some people will take a lend when it comes to headgaskets and charge far more than they need to (according to one of my mates in the trade, whose boss wanted to charge me nearly double!!)
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