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Tesla still out front - badbusdriver

Reading a road test in Car Magazine between the new Hyundai Ionic 5, the new Audi Q4 e-tron, the Polestar 2 and the Tesla Model 3.

What struck me was despite all three of the others being younger designs than the Tesla, its battery efficiency was still ahead of them, markedly so in the case of the Polestar (and that is without taking into account the benefits of the Supercharger network)

The energy used on test was measured and compared to the manufacturers claims.

Tesla: 4.0 miles per kWh vs 4.2 claimed

Audi: 3.6 miles per kWh vs 3.5 claimed

Hyundai: 3.4 miles per kWh vs 3.3 claimed

Polestar: 2.0 miles per kWh vs 3.2 claimed

In addition, the Tesla, recently facelifted, had the best ride and handling, the best range (based on test efficiency) with over 100 miles more than either Audi or Hyundai. It was also 300kg(!) lighter in weight than the next lightest (Hyundai), and had the second cheapest list price of the four. The Audi, being the single motor model, had the lowest price, the Hyundai had the highest!. It had the second largest total luggage capacity (between 'frunk' and boot). Build quality on the facelifted Model 3 is also improved, though not up with the Audi or Polestar. Finally, though it shouldn't be that important, the Tesla was also the quickest car on test.

So while the big manufacturers are starting to get their acts together, it seems they still have work to do regarding battery management, a lot in the case of Polestar.

Tesla still out front - Terry W

The Polestar figures seem odd - the difference between claimed and actual for the others is 0.1-0.2 but for the Polestar 1.2

Other issue - to what extent does weight difference account for efficiency differences - 300kg between Hyundai and:Tesla must be ~15-20%. Consumption difference is 20% worse.

A liitle like the traditional premium sector, BMW, Merc and Audi can be competitive using a largely German cost base because of the very high volumes. Tesla seem to have the high volume EV market at present - will it last.

Tesla still out front - Oli rag
According to various reviews I’ve seen of Tesla as a company, they do seem to have a big lead technically and that gap isn’t closing. They are the company of choice ( after space x) of all the top graduates because of the way the company is run as a meritocracy.

Vw have just had a meeting of top executives, and the gist of it was that they are struggling to compete with Tesla and are very concerned about their new giga factory currently being finished in Germany. The news of this meeting states that Tesla can build a model 3 in less than 10 hours and an ID3 takes more than 30 hours to make.

It’s generally thought that VW are the best of the rest (alongside Hyundai ) of the large manufacturers, but they seem to be losing ground to a new crop of Chinese EV makers.

Tesla seems to have a lot of people for and against it, possibly because it has such a clever but abrasive leader in Elon Musk, but an increasing number of tech experts expect them to be setting the pace in EV’s into the future, while other manufacturers possibly loose their businesses and go bust.
Tesla still out front - madf
. The news of this meeting states that Tesla can build a model 3 in less than 10 hours and an ID3 takes more than 30 hours to make. It’s generally thought that VW are the best of the rest (alongside Hyundai ) of the large manufacturers, but they seem to be losing ground to a new crop of Chinese EV makers.

"It takes 15 man-hours to produce a Toyota, compared to 450 man hours to make a Russian car."

tinyurl.com/y483df43

Tesla still out front - badbusdriver

The Polestar figures seem odd - the difference between claimed and actual for the others is 0.1-0.2 but for the Polestar 1.2

Yes, the Polestar efficiency figures are poor, but I'm sure I've noticed the same in other road tests involving it alongside other electric cars.

The aerodynamics would certainly have an effect at speed, and while I'm not sure how the others fare in that respect, I do know the Tesla has a very slippery shape (along with a much lower roofline than the other three and a very small frontal area).

But as for the weights, the Tesla is 1800kg, the Hyundai 2100kg, Polestar 2123kg and Audi 2125kg.

Weirdly, Tesla are now no longer quoting battery capacity (remember when RR didn't list power outputs?, simply stating it was, 'sufficient'!) but it is estimated the Model 3 has an 82kWh battery (this was the Long Range model, not the Performance), same as the Audi. Polestar is 78kWh and Hyundai 73kWh.

Edited by badbusdriver on 05/10/2021 at 20:20

Tesla still out front - mcb100
Not sure what What Car we’re doing, but that doesn’t match my experience of driving a Polestar 2, neither does it match the experience of existing owners I speak to.
Interestingly, the latest SMMT figures show Tesla Model 3 to be the best selling car in the UK in September just gone, beating staples such as Corsa and 3 Series. And all achieved without a conventional dealer network.
Tesla still out front - John F

In today's global market it would have been more interesting to have included some of the Chinese EV makers for comparison. They will soon be making RHD versions....

Tesla still out front - badbusdriver

Not sure what What Car we’re doing, but that doesn’t match my experience of driving a Polestar 2, neither does it match the experience of existing owners I speak to.

It was Car Magazine (September) not What Car. I didn't actually say anything about how they found the driving experience of the Polestar, just the battery efficiency (and luggage space). And that isn't going to crop up on any owners radar unless they frequently find themselves running out of battery before they feel they should.

The only complaint about the driving experience of the Polestar was concerning the ride, which they found too jiggly. Other general complaints surrounded it being the least spacious car on test with the smallest amount of luggage space. But that was being compared directly with three rivals, judged by itself, these factors may not be so apparent. Also, an owner is only going to be interested in whether or not it has enough space for their needs, not whether it has more or less space than something else.

In terms of performance, the Polestar was beaten only by the Tesla. But a 4.7 second 0-60 time is hardly an embarrassment (if such things are important to you).

Tesla still out front - Ian_SW

I think most of the difference in efficiency is down to the size of the vehicles.

A Tesla model 3 would look tiny when parked next to most other electric cars, other than perhaps the Renault Zoe (though I suspect even then the Tesla has a lower roofline). It seems only Tesla has fully appreciated that when it comes to range, aerodynamic efficiency is still important particularly for motorway use, which is realistically the only time most people will drive more than about 150 miles in a day.

The problem is that most people seem to want huge SUVs rather than far more efficient saloon or estate cars, so that's where the big companies have invested their R&D cash.

It will be interesting to see how the BMW i4 fares when that comes out, as that's more like the Tesla Model 3 in terms of size/shape.

Tesla still out front - corax
The problem is that most people seem to want huge SUVs

They didn't know they wanted one until they were offered one!

Tesla still out front - mcb100
Sorry, misread the magazine title.
No need to get close to running out of charge to monitor consumption - just divide distance covered by charge taken and there’s your figure. There's a handy Driver Performance tool in the multimedia that will do the sums for you.
If the car in the article has gold brake calipers, it will have the Performance Pack. That’s an option consisting of Brembo brakes and very expensive, adjustable Ohlins dampers. That’s the firmest of the three ride options - standard suspension and 19” wheels are the softest.
My comment was also directly related to battery efficiency and not general driving impressions.
Tesla still out front - badbusdriver

I think most of the difference in efficiency is down to the size of the vehicles.

The Tesla is the longest of the four cars on test, and while it is the narrowest, the difference between it, the Polestar and the Audi is only 15mm. Widest is the Hyundai which is 40mm wider than the Tesla.

Yes the Tesla has the lowest roofline, but the difference between it and the Polestar isn't that big at 36mm. Tallest is the Audi which is 189mm taller than the Tesla.

A Tesla model 3 would look tiny when parked next to most other electric cars, other than perhaps the Renault Zoe

Not sure about new cars, but if you look at the used EV's on Autotrader far more of them are smaller than a Tesla Model 3 than are larger. And yes, the Zoe is taller than a Model 3, also taller than the Polestar 2

Tesla still out front - Xileno

I think they need to spend more time on the interiors. From what I've read the fit and finish is not up to the main German rivals at this price point. Also that huge touch-screen just looks like an after thought.

Tesla still out front - badbusdriver

I think they need to spend more time on the interiors. From what I've read the fit and finish is not up to the main German rivals at this price point.

That does seem to be an issue, though as I said, the Model 3 has just been facelifted and it was mentioned in the article that build quality has been improved (even though it still wasn't at the level of the Audi or Polestar).

The overall shape and proportions of the Hyundai was mentioned as being slightly deceiving. From a distance, you might think it the size of a Golf, because those are the approximate proportions, but in reality it is quite a bit bigger!. It does result in a huge cabin though, rear seat accommodation in particular is very generous indeed.

Tesla still out front - Engineer Andy
Not sure what What Car we’re doing, but that doesn’t match my experience of driving a Polestar 2, neither does it match the experience of existing owners I speak to. Interestingly, the latest SMMT figures show Tesla Model 3 to be the best selling car in the UK in September just gone, beating staples such as Corsa and 3 Series. And all achieved without a conventional dealer network.

It's a 'false reading', as has previously been stated in the forum, because they send across their cars in a few big chunks, thus one month has great sales figures, followed by another 5 (? perhaps 3 or 4) of non-existent ones.

Tesla still out front - Steveieb

Here is a reminder that petrol cars still have a future

https://youtu.be/Hatav_Rdnno

Tesla still out front - Terry W

Leaving aside its environmental qualities, the base model costs £41k.

For around £30k you are into mid-range premium cars - Audi A4, BMW 3 series, Merc CLA together with performance versions of other manufacturers - Octavia VRS, Leon Cupra etc.

Fuel at (say) 40mpg is ~15p per mile. Electric will work out at ~5p per mile.

It will take 10 years to pay back the savings in fuel costs. Most new car buyers keep a car for 3-4 years on PCP.

It is not that EV makes no sense - but miles per kilowatt is but one part of the equation!

Tesla still out front - Ethan Edwards

Interesting. I get about 3.8miles per Kwh out of my Vauxhall Mokka e. So it's doing alright being a lot cheaper than all of your examples.