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You haven't bought an iconic car, just an iconic name. The first and second gen Golf GTI's were great (and iconic) cars of their time, but then they went downhill with the third and fourth gen versions (yours is the fourth gen). After the second gen, the GTI didn't get its mojo back properly till the fifth gen with its 2.0 turbo engine and decent handling.
So, if you really think it is a good car, and you have the confidence that this 19 year old car will continue to provide reliable service for your daughters commute, by all means keep it. But don't keep it just because you think it is an iconic car, because it isn't really. And also don't keep it as a future investment because the extra mileage will have a big negative impact on its value (and that is assuming the values of the fourth gen car do start to rise which may not actually happen).
Personally, I'd get rid of it for something more suitable to a longer commute.
In addition I must say, and this is coming from someone who was working at a VW dealer in the early - mid noughties, it should be getting more than 30mpg (unless being ragged). I collected a Golf R32 once (that is a 3.2 V6 with four wheel drive) and drove it 50 miles back to the dealership under strict instructions to drive carefully(!), and it was showing 31mpg average on the trip computer by the time I arrived. I'd expect the GTI 1.8t to be getting more like high 30's, maybe just cracking 40mpg on a commute being driven sensibly. Maybe you should try and find a GT TDI of that era, i remember seeing 65mpg on the trip computer while driving one with economy in mind!.
Edited by badbusdriver on 25/06/2021 at 07:49
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Thanks for then very detailed answers.
I guess our gut feeling is that it won't be reliable for commuting but you speak to a golf gti nut and they will probably disagree and I'm sure there are gtis with 200k on the clock
But, and here is the big but, are we going to find a reliable mid performance newer car for £2500.. I guess that's the gamble and some people will say no chance and others will say yes
Cars... Pain sometimes but can't live without them
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I guess our gut feeling is that it won't be reliable for commuting but you speak to a golf gti nut and they will probably disagree and I'm sure there are gtis with 200k on the clock
There are certainly versions of the GTI which, over the years, would be considered very reliable. But I'm not sure the 1.8 20 valve (turbo or not) would be among them. It may not be that the motor is particularly unreliable as such, just that it is an old car and hence subject to the usual wear and tear. Given the amounts of money you are mentioning, I'm assuming your GTI was quite cheap too?, in which case it may well have had numerous previous owners, some of which may well not have looked after it very well.
But, and here is the big but, are we going to find a reliable mid performance newer car for £2500.. I guess that's the gamble and some people will say no chance and others will say yes
As for this, it isn't impossible, but it will be more about luck than anything else, as any car at this kind of price level is going to be a gamble.
I would suggest that if you want a nice 'keeper', you wait till you can afford something decent. With only £2.5k to put in the kitty, you need to be focussing on the condition of the car above anything else, not the performance (beyond its ability to comfortably maintain the legal limit). But I'd be sticking to a naturally aspirated petrol and manual gearbox.
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I did a quick calculation and at 30 mpg vs 45 mpg you will save £20 per week.
If you get something more modern but with mid range performance it might not be much better mpg than the Golf. If you get a diesel with decent power mpg might be ok and mileage of 14k per year might be okay. Most people here will warn of complexity, turbo, dpf, DMF etc.
Anyway if it was me I'd keep the Golf. Does it qualify for classic insurance? If so that might save a bit too?
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If it is a a good car, spend the money on the insurance, better the devil you know.
+1 to this. You've had the Golf for a while and know its faults. If you buy any sub-£4000 car to replace the GTI, it could have all sorts of expensive problems in waiting ... or you might get lucky. It's a gamble.
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If it is a a good car, spend the money on the insurance, better the devil you know.
+1 to this. You've had the Golf for a while and know its faults. If you buy any sub-£4000 car to replace the GTI, it could have all sorts of expensive problems in waiting ... or you might get lucky. It's a gamble.
Despite my answers so far, this is probably the best option, at least for the moment. If the GTI is running fine and giving no problems, with such a small mount available to replace it, better just keep it till either it becomes unreliable, or you can throw more money on its replacement.
But maybe have your daughter look into tips on driving more efficiently!
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Anyway if it was me I'd keep the Golf. Does it qualify for classic insurance? If so that might save a bit too?
Not sure you can for a car of this age, but also, pretty much all classic policies will have limited mileage allowances.
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I'd part with it and get a late Ford Focus MK2 instead. Fun to to drive, reliable, while parts if needed aren't expensive. The 1.6 petrol is the one to go for. Buy with low owners and full service history for greater peace of mind.
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No OP, a 1.6 Focus will be a huge slug of a let down after your Golf
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If it is a a good car, spend the money on the insurance, better the devil you know.
+1 to this. You've had the Golf for a while and know its faults. If you buy any sub-£4000 car to replace the GTI, it could have all sorts of expensive problems in waiting ... or you might get lucky. It's a gamble
+2. You don't say how much you paid for it, or what the mileage is. But I assume it has almost stopped depreciating at this age unless you paid over the odds. If you buy another younger car, not only will it cost you all of your £2500 and more, it will depreciate more than your GTi is doing. So I suggest you advise daughter to drive as though there was an egg between her foot and the accelerator, and to contribute £100 per month (depreciation) to the £2500 pot till it dies.
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The 1.8 20V turbo was one of VWs better engines. I had one in a Mk1 Octavia vRS and it went to about 110000 miles with no issues at all, and never used any oil.
I think they can have a habit of eating coil packs and need the timing belt changing rather often, but I've heard of plenty which manage mega miles.
That version of Golf GTI is starting to become more desirable, so it may be worth more than when you bought it. However, I'd keep it and enjoy it unless it's got low enough miles and is in good enough condition to be a future classic.
I could get nearly 40mpg on the motorway in the vRS (according to the slightly optimistic on board computer) if I stuck to the speed limit. If you're only getting 30mpg on that type of journey it might be worth checking for a sticky brake caliper, change the air filters etc. as it should do a bit better than that.
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All the answers make great sense.
Better the devil you know until it blows up..
Paid £1600 for it
The Good
Body very good
Engine seems very good, pulls in all gears, new turbo last year, no smoke
4 almost new tyres
Interior very good condition too
Only 101k Miles which I think is good for 2002
The Bad
Wheel ABS Sensor faulty ( cost approx £100 )
Bonnet has dint across top where scaffolding pole fell on it ( prev owner )
MPG seems in the 30-35 range
Click on releasing clutch pedal most probably due to slave cylinder sticking ( doesnt affect driving but could be quite a bit of money to fix )
Prev owners had rear windows and back window tinted..not good in the dark !
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It is more a matter of when, not if, a 19 year old car doing a 60 mile a day commute will fail. It may be frequent small faults or one terminal large one.
The suggestion to put £100 a month in a pot for its eventual replacement is sensible but probably too low - would suggest at least £200. Together with additional fuel will cost an extra £300 per month.
Personally I would ditch the car, and replace with a new leased small car for ~£200 per month. Not so exciting to drive perhaps, but should be reliable, frugal, and equipped with more modern tech.
For a 19 year old "new" may have as much street cred as "knackered icon"!
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When it comes to your time to breath your last, do you want to look back and admire how pragmatic you were, or do you want to remember having a bit of fun?
Sometimes fun is a bit more expensive, but it pays you back tenfold in memories.
Your daughter will tell her grandchildren about her time sharing a cool car with her dad, but she'd most probably forget to tell them about the practical one it was replaced with.
One kick of the ball in this life and then it's done. Enjoy what you can while you can.
;-)
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When it comes to your time to breath your last, do you want to look back and admire how pragmatic you were, or do you want to remember having a bit of fun? Sometimes fun is a bit more expensive, but it pays you back tenfold in memories. Your daughter will tell her grandchildren about her time sharing a cool car with her dad, but she'd most probably forget to tell them about the practical one it was replaced with. One kick of the ball in this life and then it's done. Enjoy what you can while you can. ;-)
The USP of a hot hatch, is it being practical as well as fun (to drive), not either or. Though in the case of the 3rd and 4th gen GTI's, not so much fun as the handling was pretty soft with understeer being the main characteristic. A 1st gen Focus, even a 'non sporty' one, is going to be much more engaging (and memorable) on a twisty road.
Edited by badbusdriver on 25/06/2021 at 11:39
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May I refer the honourable gentleman above to the concept of "cool"? A Focus may well be better dynamically, but a GTi, any GTi, is, well its just cool.
;-)
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100k miles new turbo almost new tyres good body I would keep it. You know the car and changing for something else too much of a gamble. A lot of members on this forum boast about "bangernomics" they seem to have gone quiet. Do NOT buy a diesel as some have said and do not be driven by MPG alone
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May I refer the honourable gentleman above to the concept of "cool"? A Focus may well be better dynamically, but a GTi, any GTi, is, well its just cool.
;-)
What car is or is not cool, is pretty much the same as what car is, or is not good looking. That is to say, it is entirely down to the Individual's perception of what that means. When watching the 'cool wall' section on Top Gear, some I'd agree with (including the reasoning), others, not so much.
My own personal take is that if a 'bread and butter' version of a particular car isn't cool, neither is the sporty version. Coolness, IMO, has absolutely nothing to do with how fast a car goes. So while I would call a 1st gen Golf GTI cool (because the basic versions are also cool), 2nd too at a push, I certainly wouldn't call a 3rd or 4th gen Golf GTI cool.
Here is another little nugget about the 4th gen Golf GTI. When it first appeared, it had the n/a (125bhp) version of the 1.8 20 valve engine. VW however, decided that engine was too 'peaky', and so replaced it with the old 2.0 8 valve 115bhp lump (which had slightly more torque at much lower revs). But the kicker is that VW themselves decided that both it and the earlier 1.8 were undeserving of the GTI badge. When they arrived at the dealer, they were simply badged as Golf 1.8 or Golf 2.0, but in order to satisfy the customers who were clearly more interested in the badge than whether the car was worthy of the moniker, we had to prise off the 1.8 or 2.0 and replace them with the letters GTI, which is kinda sad!.
Obviously the OP's car has the 1.8 turbo, which gave a much needed boost in power having, at first, 150bhp, subsequently upped to 180bhp (then more for special editions). That didn't really do much for the handling deficiencies though, it was still too soft, wooly and nose heavy to be a proper hot hatch. Weirdly, the Golf estate and Bora (saloon) were a bit less 'understeery' having a little more weight at the rear. We had a Bora demo for a while with the 180bhp 1.8t, that was a real sleeper, and had the benefit that you didn't always get numpties challenging you to a race (like you would in a Golf GTI). I really liked that Bora, though its suspension was also too soft (and tyres too small) for its performance, especially on a twisty road.
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This is the old thing
flic.kr/s/aHsmW5NQi7
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