|
after 10 shops no one manages to find the solution,
this solution works on the car,
it doesnt cut and it works on 4 cylinders.. the only thing is i am not sure how long the engine will last and handle that....
i dont know how cylinders work on that car..
|
|
I'm not sure I understand what it is you think you have done.
IF you've swapped injectors and the broken cylinder changes, then you have an injector fault.
IIF you've swapped ignition components, and the broken cylinder changes, then you have an ignition fault.
IF you are somehow sharing the ignition (or injector) pulse between two cylinders and the broken one now works, them
(a) I'm surprised
(b)You have an ignition (or injector) fault
(c) I'd think your timing will be way out and if you keep doing that you'll break something
Edited by edlithgow on 30/09/2020 at 02:13
|
|
Injector works its not broken only the signal - is somewhere either broken either from ecu computer or from the cable somewhere but since its extremely old car almost 30 years old and no one wants to fix it and find the problem and the issue,
this is how 1 electrical garage solve the issue they bypassed signal from other injector and now car works on 4 cylinder injector supplies fuel i am not sure if it provides right amount of fuel on the right time so solution is - shared injector pulse , between 2 cylinders so they work on the same time - can i damage my engine that way? What can be broken ,
|
|
You'd need to know the normal injection timing and the firing order to understand what's happening in detail, but in general if the ignition timing is correct I wouldn't expect this to be necessarily damaging.
Obviously if it injects during the exhaust stroke the fuel will be wasted, your catalyst will get hot, and there may be damaging backfiring in the exhaust system.
iIf it injects in the other 2 phases of the 4-stroke cycle *suck, pr squeeze I THINK it should be effective, though not optimal.
If it injects in the "bang" phase after ignition, that'll be the same as injecting in the exhaust phase
Injection early in the suck and squeeze phases might increase the risk of damaging pre-ignition. This could perhaps be reduced by a water decoke.
Edited by edlithgow on 30/09/2020 at 07:51
|
|
you dont bypass the signal you share the signal, but if the injector works according to supply to open at a certain length of time, sharing that signal will disrupt the injectors flow of fuel
so it will run very weak but not certain it will work as the ecu knows if there is any change in resistance and power in the circuit, I suspect it will bring engine light on to show a fault and could cause limp home mode
but not certain of above, apart from not a good idea to mess with this system in that way, it would be better to find the wire or connection problem and correct it
|
|
Yes thats Right - electrical guy made sharing of the signal , so here is what is it before sharing signal,
injector doesnt receive impulses- so when it receives shared signal i guess it follow pattern of the other injector from which receives data, impulses,
i dont have any light at the moment, my car is before limp mode, was invented so i really dont care about that,
no body managed to find the wire , if its damaged the ecu , for only 4th cylinder how can be found that?
|
|
You didnt give year but one problem will be valve timing will be out of sync with injector, so you could end up with petrol in the oil as it will wash oil away in the bore and contaminate it
You would be better off leaving it running on 3 cylinders
Why cant they find the wiring fault? Its not that hard if they know what they are doing
|
|
accord year 1997
face lift
f22z2 engine 2.2vtec
these cars are extremely rare its 5th generation if its ecu it needs to be reprogrammed with another key lock smith,
also i cannot find from scrap yard since cars are so rare if cable is cut or there is a issue with the cable,
still extremely hard to find, so using another injector signal its not good solution at all :(
these cars doesnt have diagnostics only 3 pin and blinking codes with help u nothing.
|
|
Im not certain but think diagnostics port is behind the ashtray on that not 100%
|
|
If its like the Taiwan 1997 Accord 4-cyl VTEC, I don't believe it has OBDII diagnostics, though the US model apparently does.so some details may vary with country.
|
If its like the Taiwan 1997 Accord 4-cyl VTEC, I don't believe it has OBDII diagnostics, though the US model apparently does.so some details may vary with country.
It may have one as the other port you get flashing codes from is if you do not have diagnostics machine, have you checked behind the ash tray above centre console in dash, in front of gear lever?
apologies if that is wrong but found one on youtube that mentioned it was in same place as Taiwan Accord
|
If its like the Taiwan 1997 Accord 4-cyl VTEC, I don't believe it has OBDII diagnostics, though the US model apparently does.so some details may vary with country.
It may have one as the other port you get flashing codes from is if you do not have diagnostics machine, have you checked behind the ash tray above centre console in dash, in front of gear lever?
apologies if that is wrong but found one on youtube that mentioned it was in same place as Taiwan Accord
Yeh, I got the flashing lights thing, but not OBDII AFAIK, though I believe there was quite a long period of overlap where you got both, at least on US models
Looked behind the ashtray and a few other places mentioned ont Internyet.
TAIWAN Accord was mentioned on Youtube? And not in Chinese? Surprising.
Wasn't me. Never figured out how to post videos on there, which is probably just as well.
Edited by edlithgow on 01/10/2020 at 11:19
|
If its like the Taiwan 1997 Accord 4-cyl VTEC, I don't believe it has OBDII diagnostics, though the US model apparently does.so some details may vary with country.
It may have one as the other port you get flashing codes from is if you do not have diagnostics machine, have you checked behind the ash tray above centre console in dash, in front of gear lever?
apologies if that is wrong but found one on youtube that mentioned it was in same place as Taiwan Accord
Yeh, I got the flashing lights thing, but not OBDII AFAIK, though I believe there was quite a long period of overlap where you got both, at least on US models
Looked behind the ashtray and a few other places mentioned ont Internyet.
TAIWAN Accord was mentioned on Youtube? And not in Chinese? Surprising.
Wasn't me. Never figured out how to post videos on there, which is probably just as well.
According to internet the Taiwan version is a US import so I cant see it not having one, would be a bit daft not to fit one
Getting too many adds on youtube now, tends to spoil the decent videos on there, but I`m not paying for it -Google earns enough out of advertising imo
|
|
The one I was working on has SANYANG moulded on quite a few of the plastic assemblies. That suggests to me it was assembled in Taiwan.
I believe SOME local Honda's are, or have been, imported, but I doubt that was one of them.
|
The one I was working on has SANYANG moulded on quite a few of the plastic assemblies. That suggests to me it was assembled in Taiwan.
I believe SOME local Honda's are, or have been, imported, but I doubt that was one of them.
Your right Honda owned them untill they competed in motorcycles then 2002 Honda split from them but still have shares according to internet
Not that it helps you sorry to drift...
- As far as OP is concerned problem is easy to trace just needs decent mech on it m
|
|
This car doesnt have diaagnostic port it have 2 or 3 pin diagnostic port which is inside passager legs,
opposito to driver without blinking code or code at all its impossible to diagnose it since these cars were build between 1993 and 1997-8 max it doesnt have obdd ii unfortunately..
its build in the uk swington,
i checked for codes and nothing this problem is probably wire somewhere trapped, or broken pins of the ecu so it doesnt provide proper signal this is my guessing,
these accords were 3 different version for us marked for uk market/ european market and for japanese market i got for uk market , no obd ii,
how do u think problem is easy to trace more than 20 services failed to find and tell me the problem is it distributor can someone tell me ? since car is wired to the other cylinder it receives impulses from them will this leads to making the car soon run on only 3 cylinders ?
Car is made in year 1997 f22z2 engine code.
i am using 5w 30 oil this is what factory advices should i use other oil ? please advice which,
i am more concerned that more cylinders can get damaged and also electric can be fried not sure :(
Car have 4 cylinders
so with 3 cylinders i can barely move it , sounds like diesel and extremely terrible slugish etcs etcs.. no way to use it,
|
how do u think problem is easy to trace more than 20 services failed to find and tell me the problem is it distributor can someone tell me ? since car is wired to the other cylinder it receives impulses from them will this leads to making the car soon run on only 3 cylinders ?
I'd expect a problem in the distributor to relate to ignition. I understood you to be saying the problem is a lack of injection signal to one injector.
If it is in fact the ignition pulse you are sharing, I'd say DONT.. The timing will be wrong.
I'd think injection timing will be less critical, though I've never really thought about it before.
|
i am using 5w 30 oil this is what factory advices should i use other oil ? please advice which,
NO
I like thick oil. The available evidence suggests its downsides are hugely exaggerated, but I would not ADVISE anyone to use anything not recommended by the manufacturer, though I might do so myself.
In this case it'd only be perhaps appropriate as a work-around to a confirmed fuel dilution problem caused by your shared injection pulse work-around. You don't (yet?) have a confirmed fuel dilution problem, so it isnt (yet?) appropriate.
If it was I might start with a 15W40. Here in Taiwan (where its never below freezing) I've used a 50:50 mix of 15W40 with straight SAE 40, and am currently using a 50:50 mix of 20W50 with straight SAE 40.
This is in an old flat-tappet engine.
I wouldn't expect thicker oil to cause problems in a VTEC, but I could be wrong
|
i am using 5w 30 oil this is what factory advices should i use other oil ? please advice which,
NO
I like thick oil. The available evidence suggests its downsides are hugely exaggerated, but I would not ADVISE anyone to use anything not recommended by the manufacturer, though I might do so myself.
In this case it'd only be perhaps appropriate as a work-around to a confirmed fuel dilution problem caused by your shared injection pulse work-around. You don't (yet?) have a confirmed fuel dilution problem, so it isnt (yet?) appropriate.
If it was I might start with a 15W40. Here in Taiwan (where its never below freezing) I've used a 50:50 mix of 15W40 with straight SAE 40, and am currently using a 50:50 mix of 20W50 with straight SAE 40.
This is in an old flat-tappet engine.
I wouldn't expect thicker oil to cause problems in a VTEC, but I could be wrong
Your complicating matters, 5w 30- Honda did recommend to prevent the oil burning problem, so its ok but any thicker may prevent the VTEc working as the filter is very small and often with thicker oils they block up preventing the VTEC working...
|
I wouldn't expect thicker oil to cause problems in a VTEC, but I could be wrong
Your complicating matters, 5w 30- Honda did recommend to prevent the oil burning problem, so its ok but any thicker may prevent the VTEc working as the filter is very small and often with thicker oils they block up preventing the VTEC working...
I'm not complicating matters. Matters are just complicated.
|
I wouldn't expect thicker oil to cause problems in a VTEC, but I could be wrong
Your complicating matters, 5w 30- Honda did recommend to prevent the oil burning problem, so its ok but any thicker may prevent the VTEc working as the filter is very small and often with thicker oils they block up preventing the VTEC working...
I'm not complicating matters. Matters are just complicated.
Tbh whatever the problem is it should be easy to find, it sounds like the people who looked at it either know nothing about it, or just plain cant be bothered which i think is more like it
As for whats been done is a pure bodge job which is likely to cause more damage and if parts are very hard to find,which i find odd for this, it might as well get another car its not worth the time and effort though someone must know where to get parts even new
|
I wouldn't expect thicker oil to cause problems in a VTEC, but I could be wrong
Your complicating matters, 5w 30- Honda did recommend to prevent the oil burning problem, so its ok but any thicker may prevent the VTEc working as the filter is very small and often with thicker oils they block up preventing the VTEC working...
I'm not complicating matters. Matters are just complicated.
Tbh whatever the problem is it should be easy to find, it sounds like the people who looked at it either know nothing about it, or just plain cant be bothered which i think is more like it
As for whats been done is a pure bodge job which is likely to cause more damage and if parts are very hard to find,which i find odd for this, it might as well get another car its not worth the time and effort though someone must know where to get parts even new
Agreed it would be better fixed.
However, if it can't in practice be fixed, so far we I havn't seen a reason in this thread why the bodge would be fatal, apart from the possibly enhanced risk of pre-ignition.
If I was in that situation I'd certainly try it, out of curiosity if nothing else, since there would be nothing much to lose
Incidentally the "thicker oil clogs filters" thing doesn't seem to make much sense. Filter clogging will require solids (wear particles, soot) or semi-solids (varnish, sludge) which shouldn't be any worse with thicker oil. Oil flow will be less with thicker oil, but as I understand it, VTEC operation depends on oil pressure, not mass flow.
In any case if VTEC stopped working it wouldn't be fatal, you'd just be down on power.
|
|
You didnt give year but one problem will be valve timing will be out of sync with injector, so you could end up with petrol in the oil as it will wash oil away in the bore and contaminate it
You would be better off leaving it running on 3 cylinders
Why cant they find the wiring fault? Its not that hard if they know what they are doing
Undesirable, but not likely to be fatal anytime soon. After all, Honda CR-V's have a history with fuel dilution of the oil, and Honda seem to think (or at least say) it isn't a big deal.
Fuel in oil can allegedly be detected with the blotter spot test (look it up) though I havn't evaluated it for that and dunno how sensitive it is likely to be.
Its consequences could be mitigated by
(a) Using thicker oil
(b) Avoiding short-tripping in the cold
(c) more frequent oil changes
I dunno if "You would be better off leaving it running on 3 cylinders" but I suppose it depends on how badly it runs in that mode. I run on 3-cylinders all the time, since that's all I have, but thats by design.
I you do that long term it might be worth tacking the inlet valve out.
|
|
Is it batch injection or sequential? If it is batch then you may have a broken wire between the two injectors that can be repaired/bypassed. If sequential then it won’t work.
|
|
Seems to be referred to as Programmed Fuel Injection, which I suppose means its sequential. There are TDC, Cam and Crank position sensors involved. Horribly complicated.
BUT if you share the pulse from another injector, it'll still inject, wont it?
www.scannerdanner.com/forum/post-your-repair-quest...l
Lot of poking around with a test light which would make me nervous on a computer-controlled car.
Edited by edlithgow on 04/10/2020 at 00:54
|
|
Guys can it be ecu ???
problematic ecu , i am still driving with 3 cylinder car i decided to scrap that idea of using pulse from other cylinder it will damage my engine badly...
i need to fix the car asap :(
since mot is coming very very soon...
from where i can get computer?
also do i need to reprogramm again the whole computer since i got imobilizer :(?
So here are few things so far, SPARK PLUGS HAVE SPARK,
so its not spark plugs or cables we already exchange that on that damaged cylinder, so its probably not distributor as well, the problem is if its computer ecu i need to find exactly same computer and manual gearbox for f22z2 extremely hard to find if someone knows scrapyard or something these cars were made only from 1996 till 1998..... so extremely hard to find,
i found some ecu in russia but they dont ship overseas :(
or they cost quite insane amout of money..
i dont think
1000gbp is fair price for used ecu...
for that car, i really like and love the car and i cared a lot, it Have Koni regulated shocks it have brand new 4 brake disks and pads new steering joints a lot of things are changed all 3-4 parts of the exhaust, everything battery, tyres, alloy wheels,secret nuts,
due to the nature of this,
and car is fully serviced,and i have driven it very low miles i want to fix it repair it...
if we try another distributor from another engine from honda without vtec will it work if its distributor ?
because this vtec engine everypart is so extremely hard to find,
ecu is
s3e
37820-p5s-g31
after that numbers 238520-7313 oki uk limited made in the uk, i really need working 1.... really .. if somecan help..
find one from somewhere.. of course i will pay.... its some of my last hope on this ecu.
Edited by bladest on 05/10/2020 at 07:49
|
|
Of course it CAN be the ECU, but I was assuming (as you seem to be confirming) that economic ECU replacement may not be possible if you can't find one in a scrappy.
I'm temped to say that being uneconomic to replace is a significant part of what an ECU is for.
It seems a bit unlikely, though not impossible, that an ECU fault would affect one cylinder only, though. It seems much more likely that the cabling to the injector, or its terminals at either end, are faulty, I;d guess you might have to examine the signals with a scope.
Re "i decided to scrap that idea of using pulse from other cylinder it will damage my engine badly..." not saying you are wrong, but I'd be interested to know what you base this on.
Havn't seen anything definitive in this thread so far
|
|
So far we have checked, cables, spark plugs there were both replaced, but even older ones and newer ones produces sparks,
fault is exactly like that cable which comes from ecu - its signal or pulse cable i think doesnt work properly.
some technicians tried to measure etcs and i am not sure how correct was this they also opened ecu found nothing wrong but still claim to me its ecu i need to find source ecu can someone point me from where i dont care left or right steering wheel as long as price is normal one tried ebay no luck asked a lot of scrap yard and private sellers nothing so far not even 1.
everyone told me we sold it with the engine,
i want my car to work , properly
as factory was build in 1996-7 i dont want some horrible modification this is what its done so far.... thats why i decided to be back to stock.
with non working 4th cylinders...
here are some tips on lpg
are 4 cylinders works i use normal lpg,
and if i take signal from other injector to non working it works - so automatically , injector is fine,
what are the biggest scrapyards in the uk or europe for old honda accords?
Edited by bladest on 05/10/2020 at 11:02
|
|
You don't seem to have answered my (and your original) question. What is wrong with the bodge?
Based on what you do say (I dunno what is mean't by lpg here, which I'd normally take to mean Liquid Petroleum Gas ) it seems you don't know the ECU is faulty.
If you don't know its faulty, replacing it is quite likely to be a waste of money.
You need to find someone to actually diagnose the problem rather than just throw parts at it. and to explain the diagnostic process to you.
This implies that you also need to get your head to the point where you can tell the difference between a meaningful explanation, and b*******.
Not easy, but necessary. There is never any shortage of b*******.
|
|
Is that LPG converted or is it petrol?
if petrol this may or may not help.....https://troubleshootmyvehicle.com/honda/2.2L-2.3L/how-to-test-for-a-bad-fuel-injector-1
If you suspect a faulty ECU which is possible, you could try and find a repairer who will know of any faults on it and be able to repair it, some you have to send ECU to and can take several weeks, but you wont know untill you find one and ask
Edited by bolt on 06/10/2020 at 07:17
|
|
Hello car is converted fully to lpg it can run on lpg it can run on petrol too.
no body repairs these ecu all people told me they are too old and they cannot source parts....
|
no body repairs these ecu all people told me they are too old and they cannot source parts....
I recently tried to get a dead radio from a 1994 car repaired - the (common) fault was its microchip, and the repairer could not find a replacement. Like anything to do with computer chips, evolution and obsolescence are rapid, so it is not surprising that you find the same problem.
I did manage to find a replacement radio on E-bay - which is equivalent to you looking for a replacement car .... :-)
|
|
Several electrical car gurus checked the car and told me its ecu on 99,99%
|
|
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-Accord-ECU-Engine-Control-Unit-0281012583-37820-RBD-E91/264294251822?hash=item3d892a3d2e:g:uJsAAOSwRYNcvgRz
Just ask the seller if it will be ok for yours it says for your date Accord but you have the details of part to check against
Not so sure no one repairs them as some advertise as refurb any ECU and some chips have an equivalent thats better than the original, though it isn`t always a chip problem, it could be a solder joint dried up...
|
|
My ecu is made by oki MADE in the uk this one is made by bosch is not for my car
it doesnt control vtec
its probably for diesel or at least much newer car,
my ecu is made in the uk by oki,
i can replace it only with it it was produced only 2 years from 1996 til 1998
i cannot substidue it , with bosch for diesel or other engines bosch made diesels most of the time never petrol engines,
some people tried to fix it already but none so far so i am stopping with experiements since i loose money and i am without a car..
i would be better if i source other ecu working one at normal price from oki,
|
|
|
|
