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The law doesn't treat a lack of MOT as a terribly serious issue - it carries a fine but no points. Essentially a paperwork issue, much like failing to update your address on driving licence or V5.
However, the law treats driving a car in dangerous condition much more seriously - this is where points and fines can be issued.
That seems fine to me, and the correct priorities.
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The law doesn't treat a lack of MOT as a terribly serious issue - it carries a fine but no points. Essentially a paperwork issue, much like failing to update your address on driving licence or V5.
However, the law treats driving a car in dangerous condition much more seriously - this is where points and fines can be issued.
That seems fine to me, and the correct priorities.
Which essentially means that, unless the car gets pulled over by the Police or is involved in an accident and they get involved, the owner can potentially be driving around in an unsafe vehicle for years and avoid all the charges.
Yet another pointless set of laws if they aren't inforced - what's the point in having MOTs if the Police can't be bothered with checking vehicles known not to have passed for months? Surely its not beyong the whit of man to charge the offenders the full cost of such work, to be used as a deterrant.
Otherwise we may as well get rid of MOTs altogether and just have a law that says any unsafe vehicles either inspected at random by the Police or involved in an accident that either was the cause to any degree will get X penalty, in line with the damage done to the other party or, in the case of problems found, the cost of all the repairs (they still have to pay for them themselves) plus all admin costs of the case?
No point in having laws if they aren't policed. If extra money is needed for this, take it out of fines for breaking such laws, especially serious ones (in addition to any custodial sentence/licence removed in the case of driving a car in dangerous condition and causing a serious accident).
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Which essentially means that, unless the car gets pulled over by the Police or is involved in an accident and they get involved, the owner can potentially be driving around in an unsafe vehicle for years and avoid all the charges.
More likely to get pulled over by the police as they sometimes have some sort of APNR scanners on board (a friend was pulled over for no MOT - he forgot!). Also lots of fixed APNR cameras these days which could trigger a prosecution if the car is driven.
Eventually without MOT you'll have problems as it won't be possible to tax the car when it runs out .
Of course people could lie about where they live - but that's a criminal offence.
Also would you really stalk a neighbours "unsightly" car waiting for the MOT to expire - not good for neighbourly relations
Edited by Big John on 05/06/2019 at 22:10
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Eventually without MOT you'll have problems as it won't be possible to tax the car when it runs out .
And so it'll have no MOT or RFL, do you think plod will have any interest in it as long as it's insured?
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Say what you want about stalking neighbours. For one I don’t stalk my neighbours and two it was just clearly obvious from the condition of the vehicle that is was not going to have any tax, insurance or mot. A quick check revealed this and even indicated a long list of advisories including brake problem with rusty pipes and worn discs on the last mot, which was 18 months ago. I think you are missing the point and the severity of the situation. If someone was knocked down or injured in an accident involving an uninsured driver what chance have they of ever receiving compensation for what might be a life long injury. The system is not working and I don’t want myself or my children for that matter to fall victim to someone who puts them at risk by driving an uninsured car.
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Which essentially means that, unless the car gets pulled over by the Police or is involved in an accident and they get involved, the owner can potentially be driving around in an unsafe vehicle for years and avoid all the charges...
No, because without an MOT, the car can't be taxed.
And if a car is untaxed DVLA automatically issue fines. Assuming the registered keeper is on their system, of course.
>> No point in having laws if they aren't policed.
There are loads of laws which are rarely detected and prosecuted.
In the car: mobile phone laws? Or smoking when there's a child in the car?
In wider life: Selling alcohol to someone who is already drunk? Fox hunting?
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<< Yet another pointless set of laws if they aren't enforced - what's the point in having MOTs if the Police can't be bothered with checking vehicles known not to have passed for months? >>
That's just unrealistic. A huge number of laws exist, which would require an enormous workforce to supervise and 'enforce'. From time to time new laws are proposed here (and elsewhere) which would only intensify the difficulty.
The police only bother to follow up major crimes, possibly preferring those which present them with the smaller levels of danger; they leave those to the real professionals. Our laws do have the effect of advising law-abiding citizens of what they should not do. The others go and do those things anyway.
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Again, then why are there laws - just make it good advice, like 'smoking is bad for your health', etc, etc. The authorities never will publicly admit this because it's terrible PR, given how many areas they are currently 'not prioritising' in favour of more 'woke' ones.
The situation with people not MOTing, taxing and insuring their vehicles has gotten worse as more Police get taken off the traffic side of things an are put in Thought Police/virtue-signalling duties, plus the cuts in manpower.
There also is, as far as I can see, no specific method of reporting seemingly unsafe vehicles to the authorities other than calling the Police on 111 or, if you can find one, telling one in person. Whether they will do anything about it is another matter.
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<< Again, then why are there laws - just make it good advice >>
Because the hope is that 'society' (which Maggie said didn't exist) works best when people co-operate, rather than living in a police state where any transgression has to be penalised or punished in some way. Sadly there will always be a proportion (what percentage does anyone think?) who ignore rules, or believe they only apply to those foolish conformists (which I'm sure all of us here are - aren't we?) :-)
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This is patently NOT the same as 'keep off the grass' or 'no ball games'. It's a safety issue, and I've seen a good few cars over the years in my area that had missed their MOT that were obviously unsafe to drive (e.g. the suspension of one was badly damaged and was leaning heavily), and once again, the Police didn't want to know.
Let's just hope that you aren't involved in an accident with someone driving a car like that which couldn't stop in time or veers in your direction because it wasn't road-worthy and, despite being reported, nothing was done.
I'm not arguing for a Police state - I would like, for once, some actual laws that can make the difference between life and death or serious injury to be properly enforced, as these laws say are supposed to be. I don't think thats too much to ask, is it?
Why do you think that many more people die on the roads of less developed nations (per capita) and the US than the UK? Because, up until recently, we took vehicle safety/maintenance seriously, including enforcement of such laws, including the use of seatbelts. When people know they can get away with such things, they often push the boundaries by committing worse crimes.
Just my opinion.
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<< I would like, for once, some actual laws that can make the difference between life and death or serious injury to be properly enforced, as these laws say are supposed to be. >>
I agree with the sentiment, Andy, but to make it happen 'society' will have to pay for the enforcement agency, which in recent years has been trimmed back to cut costs. And if it were to happen, quite a lot of people would start complaining about a police state when they get caught and fined or whatever.
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There are reportedly about 1 million cars driving around with no insurance so presumably the same individuals are not concerned about MOTs or any other hinderances to their daily lives. If they are caught the fines they incur are derisory and they usually end up in net profit over moneys saved. Points on a driving licence the same. If they are involved in an accident again they usually suffer no real pain financially. So not worth getting worked up about. It is much the same with the increase in fly tipping, penalties if caught are a joke and the chances of catching offenders are almost nil
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