Ok so as my tag name suggests, I do like a change of vehicle! I've had great advice from you regulars on here so here goes....
A month or so ago I travelled a 7 hr round trip to an independent dealer after a few weeks of negotiations, all prepared to part ex and drive home in a white BM Cab. When I got there there was an issue with an engine light that apparently needed BMW to turn it off and to cut a long story short I walked away.
So now I've been negotiating with another garage on another BM Cab; (got rid of a 1 Series cab in Jan but miss the top down feeling!).
It was all sounding great until I checked the MOT History; (a great service btw!), noticed it had done 60k in its first 3 years and asked for the service intervals. After asking three times I now have screenshots of the service booklet and it appears the vehicle wasn't serviced until 56k.
I'm fairly sure I know what you will all suggest, but it appears to have been serviced annually since...(although by the dealer who's selling it; am I being paranoid??), since then and is now on 70k.
If it was a reps car it'd be motorway miles which aren't so tough on cars; or are they? But then surely it'd be regularly serviced?
If the engine was damaged for want of an oil change in its early life would it definitely be irreparably damaged?
I'm due to see it this Monday so advice and questions welcome, as always
Thanks
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Timing chains are very susceptible to dirty oil as are camshafts and oil pumps and piston rings.
Once damaged new oil does not repair them.
If you bought it and it then failed, BMW would wash their hands of you..
Run away.
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As madf really, I wouldnt even look at it, too many people are not servicing there cars for one reason or another ?
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Would it help if I had an RAC check?or is there no way of telling until it fails?
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The EAC won't strip the engine down to see any damage though.
Walk away.
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Lots of good cars out there, this one may be neglected so why take a chance on it?
Find a nice one or two owner car with a straight service history with all invoices and buy it.
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I look at this from a slightly different angle. A service record is no guide as to how good or bad a car is, there are plenty of knackered cars with a full service history and plenty of service histories that are bogus. If the car is in good condition the car is in good condition irespective of how it got there.
If you are suspicious of oil changes then get the engine checked out. I dont kow whether the AA or RAC will do a compression test but there are plenty who will. Its easy enough to stick a bore scope into the rocker cover and into the cylinders.. Even driving it, coast down a long hill opening the throttel at the bottom and look for smoke, labouring up hill look for smoke.
Service record or not its up to you to satisfy yourself the car is sound, plenty of bummers have a service record. As always be suspicious and dont buy unless you are happy.
Edited by Stanb Sevento on 28/07/2017 at 23:41
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plenty of bummers have a service record.
I'm hoping that was a typo!
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A cab won't have been a rep's car. More likely bought new by someone with more money than sense, who didn't care if it died after 3 years and couldn't be bothered with taking it to the garage. They probably drove it in a similarly careless manner too so there's probably other things wrong too.
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Don't walk away from it.
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RUN
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There are lots of 3-series convertibles in Cars for Sale on this site at all sorts of ages and prices. I suggest you go for a petrol rather than a diesel unless you do a very high annual mileage: older diesels can be money-pits.
I'm sure at last some of these will have a full service history, which I'd regard as essential. OK, some service histories are more trustworthy than others, but anything's better than no history for 56,000 miles.
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The service book not being stamped doesn't mean it hasn't been serviced, if it went into the BMW dealer (which most people would in order to keep the warranty) then it will be on their system.
An unscrupulous dealer could easily make some worthless stamps in the book, but i'm surprised they haven't tracked down where it was serviced, so they could prove it has been looked after but the previous owner wasn't great with paperwork.
As it is a car this modern with no history is worth a fraction of its retail, if it genuinely hasn't been serviced, something i doubt to be honest, then i wouldn't touch it.
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Ring BMW UK on 0800 3256 000 or ring a helpful main dealer and see if there are service records on their system, you never know the trader may be so useless he had not done this. If no records on BMWs system give it a miss.
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Ring BMW UK on 0800 3256 000 or ring a helpful main dealer and see if there are service records on their system, you never know the trader may be so useless he had not done this. If no records on BMWs system give it a miss.
And if the trader is so useless trying to sell it, imagine what he'll be like if you have a problem uinder warranty....
OP said "After asking three times I now have screenshots of the service booklet and it appears the vehicle wasn't serviced until 56k."
Three times. Seller is a .....
Big warning flags - ignore at your peril Cllnt Eastwood had an appropriate phras e"are you felling lucky today punk?" when playing Russian Roulette with someone else's life... I digress...
Edited by madf on 29/07/2017 at 10:00
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And if the trader is so useless trying to sell it, imagine what he'll be like if you have a problem under warranty....
Good point, if they can't be bothered to find some essential info to sell the car, what hope once they've got your hard earned.
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Wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.
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And if the trader is so useless trying to sell it, imagine what he'll be like if you have a problem under warranty....
Good point, if they can't be bothered to find some essential info to sell the car, what hope once they've got your hard earned.
Trouble is, there are people that would risk it and accept what some salemen say about cars, its possible its not the only car they have sold like that
Edited by bolt on 29/07/2017 at 13:49
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"Trouble is, there are people that would risk it and accept what some salemen say about cars, its possible its not the only car they have sold like that."
Always amazes me how few punters even ask about service history. Bulk of our auction bought stock had missing or only partial history yet it always sold.
Edited by SLO76 on 29/07/2017 at 15:18
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"Trouble is, there are people that would risk it and accept what some salemen say about cars, its possible its not the only car they have sold like that." Always amazes me how few punters even ask about service history. Bulk of our auction bought stock had missing or only partial history yet it always sold.
A retired mate of mine used to buy auction motors, usually full service history cars, on some occasions they did not have any history- but only come a cropper on one, he had to re auction, he lost over 50% of what he paid, but car was in a state engine wise I doubt it had ever seen a garage had 90k on clock
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Always amazes me how few punters even ask about service history. Bulk of our auction bought stock had missing or only partial history yet it always sold.
SLO7 I trust you as you always answer which is great. So are you saying I should take a gamble on this one?
Thanks for all the useful advise as always folks.
I wish I was like some people who find a car they like the look of and buy it! A little knowledge is abad thing maybe. I've been looking since January but am so picky that I still haven't got one.
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Unless there is PROOF that it has been serviced (as someone else has suggested, from a BMW dealership looking up on the BMW service network record), I would not touch this car.
The timing chains on these do not do well on old oil and infrequent oil changes. If that fails, then you are looking at thousands to fix.
Find something with a decent service history. There are hundreds of 3 series convertibles of a similar age for sale.
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I just rang BMW, thanks for the number.
They can see it's visited three dealers in 2011,12 and 13, but not what for. The one in 2013 was Dick Lovett in Bristol so I rang but the service dept is closed until 8am Monday. They also were able to tell me it had had 6 owners.
So I will ring on Monday Although I had planned to leave at 7.30, it's worth it to know. And it will save me time, money and fuel if it's a lemon.
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They also were able to tell me it had had 6 owners. So I will ring on Monday Although I had planned to leave at 7.30, it's worth it to know. And it will save me time, money and fuel if it's a lemon.
Only 6? 1 a year then, unless there's several number plate swaps that are muddying the waters.
Looking forward to the thread on technical when this thing self destructs.
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"So are you saying I should take a gamble on this one?"
No!
I think you should leave well alone. BMW's N47 diesel is notorious for timing chain issues and should only be considered with a full main dealer service history. I would've touch one that hasn't seen fresh oil EVERY year.
In fact I think you need a rethink regarding buying a premium badge convertible. My advice would be to spend more on a good approved used car with a full dealer history which has been on an annual service plan and not the daft biennial long life plan. These aren't reliable cars and they don't take neglect well.
Happy to help.
Edited by SLO76 on 29/07/2017 at 18:09
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"So are you saying I should take a gamble on this one?"
No!
I think you should leave well alone. BMW's N47 diesel is notorious for timing chain issues and should only be considered with a full main dealer service history. I would've touch one that hasn't seen fresh oil EVERY year.
In fact I think you need a rethink regarding buying a premium badge convertible. My advice would be to spend more on a good approved used car with a full dealer history which has been on an annual service plan and not the daft biennial long life plan. These aren't reliable cars and they don't take neglect well.
Happy to help.
I've had a 1 Series Cab and the only trouble I had was DPF. I've also had Saab, Audi TT and A4, Toyota and VW Beetle, all cabs. I loved my TT but I'd rather a 4seater, hated the A4 and Beetle, have been told Saabs are old hat and have had the 1 series so thought I'd go for the 3series. That's the rationale behind looking for a BM. This one is £11,999 and I can't go any higher, even if I part ex my Outlander.
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I find it hard to believe that any buyer would consider a car that had not been serviced for 56,000 miles and had during that time had 6 owners. It must be an absolute charmer if the owners get shut after less than a year presuming the original owner ket it a normal time.
I had a 118D for 5 happy years. It had its service at BMW every 2 years but in addition to that I used my Pela oil extractor to do an additional oil change at 1, 3 and 5 years. I used the correct BMW spec oil (LL04) which does not have to cost the same as angel tears if you buy from places like Opie.
Did I get any more for the car when PX's it, dealer never asked any questions other than did it have all the stamps and was it a write off so almost certainly not. But for the sake of £30 a year its stupid to skrimp on maintenance.
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I saw the great Hank Marvin and the Shadows live more than once. One of the songs they played was "Walk Don't Run". You need the re-mix "Run Don't Walk"!
Edited by RaineMan on 29/07/2017 at 19:01
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If you must have a 3 series convertible then forget the diesels or the 4cyl petrol models. The 6cyl models are much nicer to drive, suit the nature of the car better and are much more reliable. The best model is the 325. If it's just a second car/toy then economy shouldn't be much of an issue I assume?Auto Trader:
www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/20170530594...6
This particular car you're looking at is saying all the wrong things. Questionable service record, too many owners and an engine with a poor reputation to start with. This one's a big no no. Look instead for an one/two owner 325 with a full (and verifiable) BMW service history. I'd rather have a good older car than a neglected newer car.
Edited by SLO76 on 29/07/2017 at 19:16
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I do hope you still feel we're being helpful - but it really is all good advice. Unless I've missed it, I don't think we know your annual mileage: unless it's very high, you should avoid used diesels.
You're obviously an enthusiast so it's particularly important that you buy a good car and enjoy it. I won't advise against getting a used BMW - it would be very hypocritial as a month ago I bought a 125i convertible as a fun car. I've done 800 miles in it and so far so very good. BUT it's a non-turbo petrol, a 3-litre six, 2 previous owners and it had done 52,600 miles in its seven years. And above all it's got FSH stamped by reputable BMW garages.
There are more 3s than 1s out there, so a good 330i shouldn't be too hard to find. Mine is giving 31 mpg, which is very reasonable for a 3-litre. If that's too thirsty, you need to look at something other than a BMW.
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'I do hope you still feel we're being helpful - but it really is all good advice. Unless I've missed it, I don't think we know your annual mileage: unless it's very high, you should avoid used diesels.
You're obviously an enthusiast so it's particularly important that you buy a good car and enjoy it.'
Yes all comments are helpful thank you all. I don't do high miles in it I just haven't found a petrol that's all I want.. I tax two cars and the Outlander is £280 pa so I was trying to get the convertible for under £200 tax. I use the convertible for work and leisure most of the week then the 7 seater on weekends for family use. I do like the premium brands unfortunately but I'm not made of money. My dad taught me to always buy the top spec in any car so that it's easier to sell on and that's always been good advice I think. That also extends to the appearance of the car; I could find a good silver car with black leather but they don't exactly turn heads. Or maybe it's just that I've never found silver very enthralling myself; no offence if you have one! Because I change my cab every 2.5 - 3 years I always have trouble choosing what to go for next! I was originally looking at the 2006 model 3 Series cab but the forum put me off them!
Edited by Avant on 30/07/2017 at 00:29
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