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AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Please could I have advise on automatic gearboxes

Owning a Toyota yaris SR VVT-i semi automatic I have now learnt there are different types (this one was worse then most and was only in production for a very short amount of time apparently)

I'm looking for a smallish automatic and don't want to be caught again! I'm quite open as to what I have as long as it's "tried and tested". As a community nurse I do LOTS of very short trips.

I'm considering:

Honda Jazz / VW golf / citronella c4 cactus / Hyundai ix20 / Ford focus, fiesta, b-max / Peugeot 106 / Toyota yaris!

Questions:

are the newer Toyota better than the model I had (what 'model' should I look for / avoid)

I've heard the newer ford's have a "wet cambelt" that is very expensive to replace ...what should I look for / avoid. Do other makes have the same?

Any cars I should sc*** from the above list to avoid disappointment.

THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH

(I've read reviews but would love some advise from real people who know about used automatics.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

Can't make many recommendations without a budget.

But as to your list and specifically in reference to the automatic transmissions:

Honda Jazz - yes

VW Golf - no

Citroen C4 Cactus - yes

Hyundai ix20 - yes

Ford Focus - depends on age, but if Powershift is mentioned, no. Ditto for the Fiesta and B-Max

Peugeot 106?, the youngest of them is going to be 21 years old, so I'm going to stick my neck out and assume you mean the Peugeot 108?. If that is the case - no

Toyota Yaris - yes*

*Your Yaris (I'm assuming) will have the Multimode automated manual. Toyota, as with Honda (i-shift) dabbled with automated manuals, realised that they aren't great and so didn't use them for long before reverting to a CVT.

I will make some other suggestions once you say how much you plan to spend.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Fantastic advice. Thank you.

Yes my toyota was a multimode. And you're correct I must have got the wrong peugeot number (thank you).

My budget is up to £8000.

Small - medium car.

The Honda jazz is probably my favourite (is there anything to double check for/ avoid in these cars.

And like wise with the others. Are there any stand outs to avoid (I wish someone had said to avoid the mmt prior to me getting it, but I didn't know to ask!) Any indicators in the 'title' of the car or description I should look for. (As you say.... avoid powershift in fords)

I am so grateful for your response.

Thank you again.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - SLO76
Forget any Ford with the wet belt Ecoboom engine and or the horribly fragile Powershift automatic box. Older 1.4 petrol auto Fiestas are fine, but getting on a bit in age now.

The Mk II Honda Jazz uses a CVT gearbox or earlier examples had a nasty automated manual box called I-shift that is similar to the MMT box in your Toyota. Either way the Jazz autos command silly money for what they are and aren’t worth it as far as I’m concerned. They’re generally reliable but not very pleasant to drive. The newer Mk III is nicer to drive.

Don’t touch any VW/Seat/Skoda or Audi fitted with the DSG automated manual box, these are prone to catastrophic failures and rust is a problem on the older examples you’ll be looking at.

The Citroen/Peugeot 1.2 Puretech motor is also a wet belt design and known for belt failures like the Ford Ecoboost. Avoid at all costs. Older cars use the fragile chain driven VTi motor shared with BMW’s Mini and are known for chain failure. I’d leave well alone.

The best small auto is probably the Mazda 2 1.5 Skyactiv petrol. These use a simple chain driven petrol motor linked to a conventional torque converter gearbox. They’re mechanically very robust but do rust underneath more than most so I’d advise spending a bit more on the newest example you can afford. Good wee cars these, but not many autos around.

The Hyundai/Kia autos are generally ok, though I still don’t trust their later automated manual DCT boxes, as no other manufacturer has managed to make one reliable over the long term. Even the Japanese gave up and Ford have finally switched back to a conventional transmission.

The newer Yaris Mk III is a good bet. It is a CVT but it’s better than earlier versions and particularly good on fuel. They’re mechanically very robust if looked after. But as with any decent small auto prices are high and £8k won’t go far.

Where roughly will you be looking? I’ll have a look at what’s on sale nearby.



AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - elekie&a/c doctor
I’d take a look at the Kia venga / Hyundai ix20 ( basically the same car ) . 1.6 petrol automatic. No frills functional car . Only downside is the fuel consumption is not brilliant. My sister has one and does low 30 s .
AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - gordonbennet
'' The Hyundai/Kia autos are generally ok, though I still don’t trust their later automated manual DCT boxes, as no other manufacturer has managed to make one reliable over the long term. Even the Japanese gave up and Ford have finally switched back to a conventional transmission.''



I still can't work out why this is, in truck world automated manual boxes are found in almost every new large truck, many makers not offering a manual version at all.

Reliability is superb even if the driving experience still leaves something to be desired, the only failures i've had over the last 20 years driving auto artics has been a MAN/ZF thrust bearing collapse (all 4 of ours did that around the 500/600k mark) and the gearbox computer malfunctioned on one of my long term Scanias some 18 years ago but luckily with someone else driving.



Maybe car gearbox designers should spend a week or three at a truck gearbox factory and see how it should done.



I wouldn't have an automated manual in a car either.

Some good suggestions for the OP above, keep it simple, try and avoid cars that have lived in Scotland due to excess road salt usage causing corrison damage.
AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - movilogo

There are many automatic transmission types

  1. Torque converter
  2. Automated manual or single clutch type
  3. Dual Clutch Transmission (dry and wet)
  4. Continuously Variable Transmission (CVT)
  5. eCVT (very different from CVT)

You can find animation of each in YouTube.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

As has been said above, £8k isn't going to go that far, partly because of of the high prices of used cars in general, but also because small auto's are particularly in demand.

First thing I'm wondering is whether you have off street parking and how many miles you do in a day?. Because it strikes me that an EV could be a good fit for your needs.

Going back to your list, I'd still avoid the Golf and anything else coming under VAG (VW, Seat, Skoda, Audi) because of the DSG (DCT) auto. This is similar to the transmission in your Yaris except it has two clutches rather than one. This (in theory) means quicker gear changes, but there is more to go wrong and they don't cope very well with abuse and/or neglect.

The Jazz, as a CVT, is fine as long as transmission fluid has been changed as scheduled. But the i-shift is much and such the same as your Yaris and is best avoided. The i-shift was introduced with the 2nd gen Jazz in 2008 but replaced by the CVT when they facelfted the car in 2011.

The Citroen C4 Cactus is a car I really like, but an £8k automatic is going to be the 1st gen which uses the same type of transmission as your Yaris. On top of that, the early Puretech engines there were problems with disintegrating wet belts. If your budget was enough to get you into the 2018 on 2nd gen car with a decent automatic transmission and (in theory) sorted wet belt, I'd be happy to give it serious consideration. But as is, I'd have to say no.

The Hyundai ix20 is a sound and reliable choice, but you need to be aware of a couple of things. One is that they are pretty thirsty, more so on the pre-facelft (2010-2015) cars which used a 4 speed auto (2015 on used a 6 speed). Second is that older Hyundai (and Kia) models are perhaps not as well protected against rust as some, so check MOT history (which you can do online with the reg number of the car) for mention of rust. Be aware also that the ix20 has a sister car in the Kia Venga, same car barring some minor trim and styling differences, soon point looking at one without the other.

With the Fords, as I mentioned earlier, you want to be avoiding both the Powershift (DCT) and the 1.0 Ecoboost engine. Which rules out the B-Max along with most Fiesta's and Focus'.

The Peugeot 107/108 (the latter is just a facelifted version of the former) and the automatic versions of which use the same type of auto as your Yaris which, as you know, isn't very nice. Same goes for the sister cars, Citroen C1 and Toyota Aygo.

With the Yaris, same as Jazz applies. Avoid the Multimode and you will be fine.

Alternatives?.

Well I'm a fan of the underdog so I'm going to nominate the Mitsubishi Mirage. This is a car which is hated by the motoring press but (crucially) loved by most owners because of its reliability and simplicity. Ideally you want the facelifted version from 2015 on.

The Mazda 2 is a great wee car and very reliable. At that budget, most will be the older shape car (up to 2014) but they are equally reliable.

Suzuki Swift is another very worthy contender. Budget is probably not quite enough to get into the newer (2017 on) shape car with the excellent 1.0 Boosterjet (turbo), but the earlier shape 1.2 is absolutely fine.

Suzuki Splash and Vauxhall Agila are the same cars barring minor trim and styling differences, and are very reliable.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Twinks

Don't forget the excellent Suzuki Baleno - with a 6 speed torque converter automatic box and the 1.0 turbo boosterjet engine

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - John F
The Citroen/Peugeot 1.2 Puretech motor is also a wet belt design and known for belt failures like the Ford Ecoboost. Avoid at all costs.

Early ones, yes - but sorted from 2018 onwards. Hundreds of thousands of this award winning engine now running happily all over the globe in many different models. Stellantis used the bomb proof Aisin auto box which they call the EAT6. After more than 5yrs ownership Mrs F and I are v happy with her Peugeot 2008, especially the lipless low boot which is no higher than my kneecap, useful for loading and offloading the sometimes heavy kit a district nurse might need. Thanks to its clever exhaust manifold design it also warms very quickly on cold winter mornings!

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Hugh Watt

A little thread drift here, since my car's a manual, but I'm always reassured by John F's championing of the Puretech engine, as I bought a 308SW in 2018. Only covered about 24k miles, but almost completely trouble-free - just an ABS sensor needing to be replaced recently, plus a pesky AC leak. And just had the cambelt replaced (6yrs/60k miles) at the main dealers for sub-£500, so reasonable enough (when compared say to the 4-figure cost with the similar Ford engine).

Averaging 50mpg too, by the car computation.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Thankyou.

Does this mean puretech is fine after 2018? Is the "1.2" bit mentioned above of importance? Are there other puretech that are OK before 2018?

Is stellantis a make of car? I've never heard of it.

Edited by Jacquelyn Smith on 08/12/2024 at 00:39

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Engineer Andy

Thankyou.

Does this mean puretech is fine after 2018? Is the "1.2" bit mentioned above of importance? Are there other puretech that are OK before 2018?

Some people say yes, others no. I, like some people, are rather wary of the 'belt in oil' design approach used in such cars.

Is stellantis a make of car? I've never heard of it.

Stellantis is the overall company that owns many car companies / brands after PSA (previously owning Peugeot, Citroën, DS, Opel and Vauxhall) and FIAT-Chrysler merged:

Abarth, Alfa Romeo, Chrysler, Citroën, Dodge, DS, Fiat, Jeep, Lancia, Maserati, Opel, Peugeot, Ram Trucks, and Vauxhall.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Thank you. Sorry for the delay in response. Been on long shifts. I'm based North Bristol, but willing to travel for the right car (or get it delivered).

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

Had a wee look on Autotrader using a 50 mile radius of a north Bristol postcode (Aldi!) and had them presented youngest first. Here are some which I think could be worth a look:

202409164079141 Not sure how you'd feel about buying private, but this 2018 Astra seems to be offering a lot for the age/money. Had a look at MOT history and I'd say a set of tyres will be needed before too long, but otherwise nothing else mentioned.

202411306885999 Hyundai i10, sound we cars with little to worry about and a "proper" automatic gearbox. My Mother in law has one she bought one new in 2019 and absolutely loves it.

202409164097763 Mitsubishi Mirage. As I mentioned earlier, the motoring press hate these with a vengeance, they'd have you believe them to be one of the worst cars ever made. But if you look at owners reviews a different picture emerges, that of a car which is reliable, comfortable, well equipped (power fold mirrors, cruise control, heated seats, etc) and cheap to run.

202411106150919 Ssangyong Tivoli is a small boxy SUV/Crossover type and this seems good value. Simple engine and gearbox so not really too much to worry about, my only concern here would be the vulnerability of those low profile tyres re potholes/kerbing and the resultant cost of replacements.

202411136242015 Vauxhall Meriva, arguably a better car than the trendier Mokka which sort of replaced it (they did overlap) with a better ride and more flexible seating (the rear seats slide back and fore). We used to have one and I'd have liked it much better as an auto. Similar concern to the Tivoli, this is a higher spec car with bigger wheels and lower profile tyres, though you do get the panoramic roof on this SE trim.

202410225474897 Another Hyundai i10, this one has the nice two tone blue and black interior. Shame about the naff black wheel trims, but this could be changed cheaply enough if you wished.

202412036945143 Sister car to the Hyundai i10, same platform, engine gearbox etc. Slightly smaller car though inside and out. Like the Astra at the start, this is a private sale. Nothing of note in MOT history and I'd assume new tyres have been fitted (they were noted as advisories '22 and '23)

202412036969182 You mentioned the Hyundai ix20 in your original post, this is the sister car I mentioned, the Kia Venga. Essentially the same car, short but tall, so decent interior space and boot volume for the exterior size.

202411266757320 Kia Rio, this one is a bit pricey for its age, but it is a one owner with low miles.

202410225486116 Astra estate here, possibly a little bigger than you'd like but seems to be a good price and the 1.6 is probably the most reliable engine option.

202412026930014 Mazda 2, very reliable and a fun thing to drive (if that is important)

202411256718174 Another Hyundai i10

202410225480753 The Honda Jazz is one you mentioned in your original post, this is a one owner car which looks to be in fine fettle. They are incredibly spacious for their size and generally very reliable (make sure transmission fluid has been changed when required). It was mentioned earlier that these aren't much fun to drive, which is true, but I'm not sure the majority of drivers would really care.

202403127490757 Another Kia Venga, this is a higher spec one with the panorama roof, hated seats and power fold mirrors (if that appeals)

Just to point out, I've only checked the MOT history on the two private sales. But (assuming the number plate hasn't been covered up) you can do that here- check-mot-history

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Manatee

The mirage is the washing machine of cars. No character at all but easy to use. I used to borrow them from the Mitsubishi dealer at services. Most of theirs has done well over 100.000 miles.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Engineer Andy

Seen two 1.6 auto Vengas (in '3' trim level) over the last year at my local KIA dealership - both of the face-lifted version with the 6spd auto gearbox. Both looked immaculate (obviously I couldn't check underneath for rust) and both going for about £8.5 - £9.5k. Both were snapped up quite quickly.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Engineer Andy

I don't think that the newer designed Mazdas (mostly from 2013 onwards) will have anywhere like the rust problems of the earlier cars - I've yet to see any from then out and about with a hint of rust on their visible bodywork, including their previous problem area of the wheel arches.

I don't recall any issues on underbody rust being reported on the Mazda3 owners' website / forum for the gen-3 cars (2014-19), which share much in common with the current gen Mazda2 (since 2015) and similar underneath Mazda CX-3, which has the benefit of the larger 2L petrol engine (a good deal quicker in auto format the 1.5 Mazda2, and 40mpg ave.) of the Mazda3 and a bigger boot than the 2.

The obvious downside of the CX-3 is that they do command a significant price premium to the 2 (cabin space is also not that different), and so the OP may not find many for their budget compared to the 2.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202412067056961

Any opinions on this car please. (Citreon c4) I'm thinking it's 1st gen (as before 2018) and therefore the puretech/ wet belt isn't a good choice? Or have i gotta wrong.

Thank you.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

I notice it appears to have low profile tyres which have shown up as worn on most of the mot's. Is that a concern?

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

I'd be very wary of a Puretech of that age (2018 on should be fine) so I'd give it a miss.

As for the tyres, I'm not sure the profile is as low as some based on how they look, but they are certainly a vulnerability on the UK's pothole 3rd world streets. Based on the comments in the MOT history, it does appear that a set of new tyres will be needed soon though.

I maybe would be a little concerned about the state of that passenger side front wheel in the pic, looks like the owner uses it mainly to determine where the kerb is..........

Edited by badbusdriver on 07/12/2024 at 14:31

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Thank you. I'll keep looking. :)

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

Thank you. I'll keep looking. :)

None of the cars I linked appeal then?

:-(

Edited by badbusdriver on 07/12/2024 at 16:52

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

Yes. I looked at them all. There were 4 I liked and have emailed the seller about. But I'm still searching incase they sell before I get to it.

I've seen some also on 'motors' website but can't link them unfortunately.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202408052550171

How about this one? Is it the same due to it being older than. 2016? (Sorry to keep asking. Thank you.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

It seems the Honda fit is a Japanese import. Is that correct. I hear it cam be difficult to insure an import, is that also correct.

Thank you.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - badbusdriver

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202408052550171

How about this one? Is it the same due to it being older than. 2016? (Sorry to keep asking. Thank you.

I mentioned the age of the Citroen because various Citroen and Peugeot models use the 1.2 Puretech engine of a wet belt design. What happened on earlier cars was the belt material would disintegrate within the engine and the results would be disastrous. Later cars have belts of a suitable material and are supposedly fine. Forum member John F has a Peugeot 2008 with a Puretech (owned from new, last of the previous shape, so I think it would be a 2019) and acording to him, 2018 on cars are fine. But I wouldn't be keen on something with that engine any younger (In fact the engine used before the Puretech, the 1.6VTI, also has issues!).

It seems the Honda fit is a Japanese import. Is that correct. I hear it cam be difficult to insure an import, is that also correct.

Yes, the Honda is an import, the Fit is what the Jazz is called in various other countries including Japan. They can be insured, but it will be more expensive than a Jazz. There may also be issues getting parts for it given that generation (3rd) of Jazz was never offered as a hybrid in this country.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

A car on "motors" (I really like this one!)

WHAT SHOULD I BE ASKING (as I will have to probably buy it and have it delivered unseen!)

Is it a concern that it's a repossession? Anything specific to consider from that point of view.

DETAILS.

Toyota, Yaris

2019 (69) - 1.5 Hybrid Excel 5dr CVT

Vehicle Summary

Front Wheel Drive

1.5 litre

6,800 Miles

Hybrid - Petrol/Electric

5 Seats

Hatchback

Automatic

Insurance Group 8, 1 Previous Owner, Here we have a perfect example of a Toyota Yaris Excel Hybrid automatic. The Toyota comes with half leather interior, air conditioning, reversing camera, DAB radio, cruise control, lane assist, X2 keys and full book pack plus much more,. It is in outstanding condition as to be expected having only covering 6775 miles from new and supported with a full Toyota service history. This vehicle comes with a brand new service. Next MOT due 14/10/2025, Last serviced at 6,162 miles, Full dealership history, Excellent bodywork, Black Part leather interior - Excellent Condition, Tyre condition Excellent, Metallic Blue. This vehicle is part of our repossessed stock.

A repossessed car means it was previously owned but has been recovered by the lender due to missed finance payments. Please rest assured, there are no mechanical or legal issues with the vehicle. All necessary checks and inspections have been carried out to confirm its condition and roadworthiness. We are pleased to offer free delivery within 500 miles for your convenience. However, we regret to inform you that we are unable to accept part exchange. For more information or to arrange a viewing, please get in touch!

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Jacquelyn Smith

YIKES .... THIS IS THE CAR I LISTED ABOVE (same reg)

Advertised on autotrader for £14,750 and 2 owners (no mention of repossession) being sold by browns autos from Brighton.

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202411055971369

Advertised on motors for £7,130 and 1 owner (with admission of repossession) bring sold by QPR TRADDER (?) LTD from London.

* bit odd they've spelt "trader" with 2 d's!!! *

Feel now that the original add is most likely a scam?

WHAT DO I DO? I'm even more worried about buying a dodgy car now. ??

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - bathtub tom

There's something funny going on, QPR TRADDER is a registered company listed here: find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk...1 I suggest you look closely at the info and draw your own conclusion..................................

I'd advise never to buy a car sight unseen. Take someone with you who knows a bit about cars, or get an independent inspection. I believe you suggested this youeself earlier.

AUTOMATIC GEARBOX TYPES - Adampr

The original ad is most definitely a scam. Nobody would be selling a 69 plate Yaris with 6,000 miles on it for £7k.

I suspect the seller is no longer in the UK and will ask you to pay a £500 holding deposit to reserve the car. That will be the last your hear from them. Photos are possibly from wherever trade auction the car was at after being PXed by the original owner.