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Toyota BZ4X - 3 Wheeler EV - sammy1

The new Toyota EV, the one with a name that sounds like a chemical formula or is it algebraic has been recalled when barely in production. The car was developed jointly with Subaru who have also recalled theirs. Apparently the problem is with a bolt that could fail. They have identified the problem with only a limited amount of cars produced and none for the UK market. I do not know what the current trend is with manufacturers marketing their EV cars with obscure numbers and letters like VW with their ID3 and 4, nothing much to say down the pub when asked what do you drive.

[Amended subject to put the car model number in so the search facility pick it up]

Edited by Xileno on 27/06/2022 at 09:44

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Adampr

Without googling, I think it's a BZ4X and I would guess:

Battery, Zero Emissions, 4 Wheel Drive.

I did see one round the back of our local Toyota dealer the other day - I wonder if they'd been told not to sell it.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Adampr

I wonder if glitter comes out the exhaust

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Xileno

If it is the BZ4X, I'm struggling with the 3 wheeler bit or is due to the recall being wheel bolts meaning one wheel might come off...?

Edited by Xileno on 24/06/2022 at 07:24

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Wee Willie Winkie

I'm sure plenty of ICE cars are recalled, too.

As for naming conventions, howabout Suzuki's SX4? BMW's M3? Audi's RS4?

More anti EV nonsense from certain quarters.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Sofa Spud

I'm sure plenty of ICE cars are recalled, too.

As for naming conventions, howabout Suzuki's SX4? BMW's M3? Audi's RS4?

More anti EV nonsense from certain quarters.

Agreed - wheels coming off are unlikely to be a side effect of being an electric vehicle!

And the world's largest car maker should, by now, be able to design vehicles so that the wheels don't come off !!

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - RT

If it is the BZ4X, I'm struggling with the 3 wheeler bit or is due to the recall being wheel bolts meaning one wheel might come off...?

"Japan's safety regulator said sharp turns and sudden braking could cause a hub bolt to loosen, raising the risk of a wheel coming off the vehicle"

www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/toyo.../

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - focussed

I wonder if glitter comes out the exhaust

No - the official emissions report stated that the only emission was fairy dust.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - JonestHon

Well done Toyota for recognising faults at their EV at such early stage, I wish more brands will follow and get on top problems early in post-production stages. The name is still odd, but not much more than say.. RAV4.

BTW, Toyota did show a three wheeler, not sure if it was an EV www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGuN-ozC5cY

Edited by JonestHon on 24/06/2022 at 08:13

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Xileno

Absolutely. Some manufacturers don't recall when in other markets they do, mainly the USA where consumer legislation seems much tougher. With some companies a wheel coming off would be just a 'feature'...

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - daveyjp

Well done Toyota, but its fascinating how you can redesign a component such as a wheel nut and bolt/stud to a point where it fails to do the job it is designed for.decades ago.

I have had three recalls on my Subaru. One of them was for a new brake pedal switch as there was a very small chance the silicon in valeters spray may affect its operation!

If you don't like Toyota nomenclature buy the Subaru Solterra (Sunland/Sunearth) instead!

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Terry W

Just imagine that every component were 10% "more" to de-risk the probability of failure.

Suddenly the car weighs an extra 100kg, costs 10% more making it uncompetitive.

There may be an argument that some components should be deliberately over-engineered (eg: steering, suspension, brakes) but if the corporate culture is (understandably) about efficiency, weight saving, cost reduction then occasionally car companies will screw up.

They should be congratulated for their actions in dealing promptly with the problems and learn from the mistakes, not ridiculed. (I have no connection, nor ever owned a Toyota!!)

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - sammy1

Danger of the hub failing and a wheel falling off. Pretty fundamental error in engineering when you consider how long wheels have been on cars. One wonders how new designs on EVs have been rushed into production to keep up and let the customer sort out the problems. The BZ4X is being heavily advertised so a bit of an embarrassment for a new product, the MD cannot be happy. given the culture of his country.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Andrew-T

Just imagine that every component were 10% "more" to de-risk the probability of failure.

Suddenly the car weighs an extra 100kg, costs 10% more making it uncompetitive.

Materials are not the only (or even the major) cost of production, so 10% is an overstatement.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Terry W

It's not just materials - part of de-risking may be more fasteners, more software development, additional not just larger components, more pre-production testing, higher component tolerances.

The assumed weight gain may not be evenly distributed:

- discs could be increased in size to provide better braking performance, requiring new callipers, pads, wheels and tyres increasing component weight by 20%.

- additional design effort, testing, changes to auto braking software uses no materials by costs effort.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - edlithgow

Absolutely. Some manufacturers don't recall when in other markets they do, mainly the USA where consumer legislation seems much tougher. With some companies a wheel coming off would be just a 'feature'...

Sometime in the late 70's I'm standing at a zebra crossing in Leeds waiting to cross when a wheel goes by.

I look up the road a bit and, sho nuff, 3 wheeled Morris Traveller.

A feature.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Heidfirst

Toyota are very risk-averse & will "recall" vehicles for minor issues that many other manufacturers may not. I put in inverted commas because many are not actuall full safety recalls but the subject of Technical Service Bulletins or Customer Support/Service Campaigns where a minor issue has been identified & fixes can be applied under the normal service regime rather than having to be brought in specifically..

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - sammy1

Toyota are very risk-averse & will "recall" vehicles for minor issues that many other manufacturers may not. I put in inverted commas because many are not actuall full safety recalls but the subject of Technical Service Bulletins or Customer Support/Service Campaigns where a minor issue has been identified & fixes can be applied under the normal service regime rather than having to be brought in specifically..

Toyota had no say in the recall, the problem was highlighted by the Japanese Safety Regulator who reported that sharp cornering or braking could result in the hub failing and coning off with the wheel.

Toyota have instructed all those who have taken delivery to park the cars up until they have a solution. So it is not a trivial minor issue by any means and on going

Subaru will be in the same boat with its new EV

Edited by sammy1 on 24/06/2022 at 14:49

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Zippy123

Suzuki had a problem with one of their small cars a few years ago.

Apparently the brakes failed to work when stomping on the brake pedal as in an emergency stop. Failed to work fully - not just poor performance.

A car magazine was testing the car at the time and asked for a replacement car (thinking the first one must have been faulty). But the failure to slow down was repeated.

I understand that the pedal decoupled from the attached mechanism to save the drivers ankle but did so too soon.

Anyway, Suzuki told dealers not to release any more cars until there was a fix and to get all the ones actually delivered back and not let them drive. Some dealers even had to block cars on a customer's drive if they weren't home.

Toyota - 3 Wheeler EV - Heidfirst

Toyota had no say in the recall, the problem was highlighted by the Japanese Safety Regulator who reported that sharp cornering or braking could result in the hub failing and coning off with the wheel.

Toyota have instructed all those who have taken delivery to park the cars up until they have a solution. So it is not a trivial minor issue by any means and on going

Subaru will be in the same boat with its new EV

In this case, this is a full safety recall. I think that you will find if you delve deeper that actually Toyota/Subaru will have identified the issue & reported it to the Japanese Safety Regulator (rather than vice-versa) who then issued a global notice (as currently only made in Japan & exported).

It doesn't change that Toyota are very risk-averse & will also have "recall" programmes for vehicles where the issues are minor & many other manufacturers would not bother.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - focussed

Toyota announce a recall on their bz4x electric car. The wheels can fall off.

This is the DVSA page on it.

Recall number R/2022/181

Recall date23-06-2022

Recall type Safety recall

Just in case anybody has one - the recall date was only 3 days ago

So don't drive it is the advice.

There is also a recall in europe

https://car-recalls.eu/toyota-bz4x-recall-wheel-bolts/

Of the 2,700 potentially affected vehicles, 2,200 were for the European market, 260 for the United States, 10 for Canada and 110 for Japan, the company stated.

The bolts that hold the wheels on can loosen, and the wheels can fall off. Toyota is still investigating why this can happen and under what conditions. The Japanese safety authority has said sharp cornering or sudden braking can be problematic. The regulator has advised owners to stop using the vehicle until a “permanent” remedy is taken.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Xileno

We've discussed this recently here: www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/162677/toyota---3-...r

but I can merge the two threads if people wish to add anything to this one.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - mcb100
www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/162677/toyota---3-...r
Raised on here a few days ago.
Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - badbusdriver

Yes, we found this out on the curiously titled "Toyota-3 Wheeled EV" thread from Thursday.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Brit_in_Germany

None sold in the UK, however, I believe.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - focussed

Sorry boys, I didn't notice the previous threads and posts.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - sammy1

Merge the threads by all means, I consider my title to be quite appropriate.

What I did pick up is that Subaru/Toyota do not seem to have a fix yet?

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Heidfirst

None sold in the UK, however, I believe.

I think that you will find that UK dealers will have at least a demo or (in the current situation) showroom display model - my local certainly does.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - edlithgow

Perhaps a job/marketing opportunity for Locktite.

OTOH maybe Locktite Legal (good name for a firm, if not taken) wouldn't want to touch the Locktite Liability issues with a long Locktite pole.

I've been screwing down wheel nuts over a sheet of polythene (from a poly bag) for many years. I do this mostly to protect the threads and aid removal (it looks a bit like discarded snakeskin when the nuts are removed), but I THINK it may also make them more vibration resistant, nylock stylee.

Might be especially useful on motorcycles.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - badbusdriver

Sorry boys, I didn't notice the previous threads and posts.

In fairness, Sammy's thread title suggests a new Toyota EV with three wheels. And if that didn't appeal, you could be forgiven for not having looked!

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - FP

"Sammy's thread title suggests a new Toyota EV with three wheels."

Yes.

"And if that didn't appeal, you could be forgiven for not having looked!"

I didn't. Turns out the title was misleading/ironic/humorous.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Xileno

Threads now merged and I've put the model number in the subject so people can find this thread if using the search. The search only picks up the first subject header.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - sammy1

Yes they are falling off and my title and content was meant to be humorous. As regards to reading threads there is so little activity on here it takes me all of 5 minutes to read everything!

I am surprised that no one has anything to say about the lack of an apparent fix, it seems a complete design failure?

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Xileno

I've quickly scanned both the links mentioned above and there seems no clear cause. It might be down to an inadequately specified bolt. Or a bad batch of bolts (not meeting Toyota standards) or something else.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - alan1302

I am surprised that no one has anything to say about the lack of an apparent fix, it seems a complete design failure?

Is says they are investigating - and the majority of the cars sound like they have not been delivered to customers yet.

Toyota bz4x - The wheels are falling off Toyota EV's - Bolt

I am surprised that no one has anything to say about the lack of an apparent fix, it seems a complete design failure?

Is says they are investigating - and the majority of the cars sound like they have not been delivered to customers yet.

They are advertising the car on TV so can only assume it won`t take long to sort the problem out with a bit of help from Subaru possibly...