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Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

2 weeks ago there was a thread commenting on the new Focus and at the time I commented that I actually liked the car and was considering one early next year to replace my current ageing Focus. Since then we have looked round a bit more and compared it to more cars and had decided which we were probably going to make a final decision on come the new year.

Kia Ceed 1.4T. Best interior out of the lot with good space and a good boot but no spare of any type and despite being standard on 2 specs Kia themselves have confirmed that no option is available on our chosen spec. It was looking so promising but it was thrown out.

Hyundai i30 1.4T. Nice interior but a tiny bit smaller than the Ceed as was the boot but a spare is standard on all variants. So its a strong contender.

Focus 1.5T. Its fine in just about all respects but for one or 2 spec oddities. Bigger than i30 thus a strong contender.

Honda Civic 1.5T. As for the Focus its fine, in truth its got more space/boot than all the above and its cheaper. Only issue is no spare but I have found that a kit can be ordered for about £220 that includes all the parts required https://www.coxmotorparts.co.uk/honda-shop/genuine-honda-civic-spacesaver-wheel-kit-2017-onwards/ they sent me Honda document which lists them. Down side is it robs a bit of boot space but it will still be bigger than the others.

So to sum up the Civic 1.5T Sport is in a strong pole position followed by a tie between the Focus and i30.

But yesterday on our way out shopping we passed the Skoda garage and decided to have a look at the Scala despite me thinking it too dull to even consider. With all the good reviews it would be daft not to at least look as we drove past. Nearly died of boredom just looking at it. Why did they bother. Exactly the same as the Rapid which was just a slightly enlarged Fabia, within seconds the wife had walked off. As we were leaving she asked why not a Fabia which she thought would be big enough as a 2nd car (we will still have the Pulsar) and before we could say bye to the salesman he was offering us a test drive for the afternoon in a service car. After speaking to him a bit he actually offered us a 18 month old 1.0 Tsi 115 with 8000 miles they had taken in PX against a Scala and it actually looked very interesting at the price. So we had the service car for a couple of hours and despite being only the 95 ps version it was fine. He took us out for a very short run in the used 115 version which seemed quite a bit quicker and was better equipped and back at the showroom worked out a price to change of £9000. Considering it has quite a bit of extra kit on it (over £1000 at a guess – price when new was over £17000) and our Focus is 12 next year that seemed fair but after a bit of discussion he included next April's service (saving us about £260) and a set of very nice fitted mats (£60). Went shopping (only a few hours later than intended) and then sat down with all the figures.

In truth its a no brainer. Its virtually new, looks unmarked and as the wife suggested its a perfect 2nd car for my present needs. Less than ½ the price of any of the others we have considered and despite being smaller its just as big inside as our Focus and its boot is only slightly smaller.

So decision made, we collect mid week. Hopefully its happy days for the next 10 years.

Bought a car - and it's not a new Focus - Avant

Sound like a good choice, and I hope all goes well with it.

The Scala, like the Rapid, does seem to fill a gap (between Fabia and Octavia) which isn't really there. But given that it exists, is it any duller to drive than the Fabia - which like you I don't think is dull at all?

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - FiestaOwner
He took us out for a very short run in the used 115 version which seemed quite a bit quicker and was better equipped

Having had my Ibiza with the same engine for a few weeks, I can say that you'll love that engine. No roughness, very quick off the mark, but also easy to keep within speed limits in towns.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - SLO76
Good car. Ive far more confidence in VAG’s 1.0 3cyl than I do in Ford’s 3cyl Ecoboost, the 1.5 is basically an upscale version of the same rather soft motor that has a poor reputation for premature failures. I personally wouldn’t buy any current Ford.

Edited by SLO76 on 01/12/2019 at 21:07

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

Got car today and had 2 shocks.

On collection the dealer asked for £9450 not the £9000 on the order. Asked why and he said it was £450 for the paint and upholstery treatment. I said I had not asked for it and it was not on the signed order. He pointed to an A4 notice on the wall behind him that stated that unless the buyer declined the treatment all cars would be done and the price added to the order.

I was never asked and after some discussion I told him I wanted a refund of my deposit to which he said no so I stood up and took a photo of the notice in relation to his desk and said I was on my way to Trading Standards. He got nasty at that point threatening to take me to court at which point his boss came over.

He agreed to me paying the agreed price and he confirmed (in writing) that we will get the agreed free service in April. After that they will never see me again. Completely takes away the "pleasure" of buying.

When I got home I got the second shock. The space saver spare is actually a full size tyre/wheel (steel not alloy) so that's a bonus.

What a load of robbing b*********s. How many people does that work on and do they actually treat the cars. It looks clean but all cars do when they are fresh from the dealer.

Suppose I could complain to Skoda but will they be bothered?

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Avant

You were absolutely within your rights under contract law. An additional term like that has either to be clearly visible to the customer or specifically brought to your attention at the time of making the contract. An A4 piece of paper behind someone's desk is clearly not enough.

If you have time, it would help future customers if you point that out to the dealer, with a copy to Skoda UK.

In fairness, it may just have been one dud salesman (what could he have taken you to court about, for heaven's sake?): his boss seems to have done all right.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

In fairness, it may just have been one dud salesman (what could he have taken you to court about, for heaven's sake?): his boss seems to have done all right.

One dud salesman my a***. There is no way the salesman will have put the notice there, it will be company policy.

I would bet its also company policy to simply remove the cost from any customer who complains like I did.

But how many actually pay up? I would bet its a huge majority.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Avant

"One dud salesman my a***. There is no way the salesman will have put the notice there, it will be company policy."

No need to swear, Thunderbird: I was referring to the salesman getting nasty and threatening to take you to court. There's no excuse for a salesman to take that attitude to a customer, particuarly one who has just bought a car.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Senexdriver

I had the same paint treatment scam when I bought my first Audi. I had decided to buy a new model they had in stock so the salesman draws up the quotation for the purchase price, detailing the model, the charge for metallic paint, the optional extras that were already fitted, the road tax charge, VAT blah blah. Then he prints it off and proceeds to run through it with me, quickly skimming over an item of £390 (or however much it was) for paint treatment. When I asked him to stop and explain the paint treatment entry he says oh they add it all their vehicles and passes on to the next item. So I ask him to go back to the paint treatment and query whether I’m obliged to have it. He says well no, but they do advise it in view of the salt they put on roads and if your car is regularly parked under trees and it’s guaranteed for 5 years and blah blah blah. So I ask for it to be taken off the quotation, which he does, but customers don’t usually ask them to delete it.

So if I hadn’t been paying close attention I’d have been stung too. Not quite as underhand as your guy - that was sheer deception, plain and simple.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - sammy1

Just about sums up the dealer system. I would not have expected this sharp practice from a major manufacture dealership, goes to show you have to have your wits about you. OP or to state where the dealer is ie town. They should be reported to trading standards and Skoda UK. Consumer laws in the Uk are still far from strong enough. People are paying big money for unsatisfactory products and left to largely fight their own corner for redress. The new build housing a prime example.

In HJ column this week is a consumer asked to pay £39 for an engine flush on his very low mileage jazz, not really sharp practice but a nice little earner from the unwary.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - badbusdriver

Suppose I could complain to Skoda but will they be bothered?

I would definitely get in touch with Skoda about it, even if nothing comes from it, it will feel better to let them know exactly what your thoughts on this practice are. I'd also be reviewing the dealer where possible (Autotrader?), to warn other unsuspecting 'victims'.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - groaver

Suppose I could complain to Skoda but will they be bothered?

It appears they employ their own sharp practices:

https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/475118-when-is-a-superb-not-a-superb-the-answer-is-worth-%C2%A33000/

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

Been to Trading Standards today with a print of the photo showing the notice regarding paint and upholstery treatment. The chap said that the dealer is very close to crossing the line but they confirmed what I suspected i.e. they could do nothing for me since I had not suffered any kind of loss, I got the car I ordered at the price I signed for. They did say that other dealers locally had been doing similar and were being watched and now this dealer is on the list. They also asked me to contact Skoda informing them of the dealers practices, messaged them just before posting this. What surprised me was a comment made by the chap I saw. He said that the treatment is unlikely to cost the dealer more than £100 even if they have a company come in to do it. If they DIY (more likely) the cost of materials is about £30. A nice little earner.

After that we had a ride out and have to say we are most impressed overall with the car. Performs better than the 1.8 Focus ever did and if the dash display is true we are looking to save a small fortune in fuel costs. HJ suggests about 48.8 mpg for the 110 PS (it not a 115 PS like I thought, that did not arrive until September 2018) but we saw 56 mpg on the dash at the end of a 70 mile drive stopping off for lunch. Traffic was appalling as well, took forever. Focus would do about 35 mpg on a good day.

With regards to naming the dealer I would love to but the forum moderators would remove it before most people read the post so why waste my time and potentially get banned for breaking forum rules.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Manatee

Sounds to me as if TS are being wet. Notice or not, thee dealer should show it on the signed order. The only possible reason not to do that is so the customer doesn't see it. It's assumptive selling which was well acknowledged to be a shady practice many years ago.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

It's assumptive selling which was well acknowledged to be a shady practice many years ago.

Never heard of that phrase so looked it up.

Cambridge Dictionary says its "the practice of trying to sell something by acting as though the person that you are trying to sell it to has already decided to buy it:

Assumptive selling assumes the person wants to buy, so the salesman says things like "Do you want the red one or the green one?"..

From another site

"The assumptive selling technique, also known as a presumptive close, takes place when a salesperson intentionally assumes that the customer has already said yes to the sale. For example, an assumptive statement from the salesperson might be "give me your credit card and I'll get the paperwork started."

The assumptive close works well because it comes across as professional and is used as part of an intentional sales process. To implement it effectively, you must have a clear understanding of the customer's needs and desires beforehand. If you have listened well and matched the customer up with the perfect product or solution for their needs, then there is nothing more to discuss with the customer, except for how they intend to pay for their purchase."

No mention of it being illegal.

So nothing whatsoever to do with adding extras after the deal has been signed.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Manatee

So nothing whatsoever to do with adding extras after the deal has been signed.

Slightly different context but not the use of "assumptive" and that the seller was penalised by the FSA. This relates to including PPI without telling the customer.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/insurance/6452415/Swinton-fined-770000-and-to-refund-500000-over-PPI-failings.html

I've had quite a lot to do with TS over the years and I reckon they could stop that business with the wall notice, although I wouldn't like to say whether they could win a court case if it was defended well.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

Time for an update. Had the Fabia for 7 weeks almost and have to say its all good news. Other than what can only be described as "bland looks" (and they are easy enough to spot before you buy) its a truly excellent car. It rides well, is spacious, is incredibly quiet (compared to the 2008 Focus) and goes like a little rocket when you press the RH pedal.

But the best bit is the economy. Only done about 1,200 miles so far and the longest run has been about 35 miles but its looking brilliant compared to the 33 mpg average the 1.8 Focus did. Calculated its doing about 49 mpg which is spot on what my research had suggested I should get. HJ's figure for the car is 48.8 mpg and What Car achieved 49.2 mpg long term (but that was a 95 PS 5 speed car not a 110 PS 6 speed like ours). It further confirms what I have suspected for a while, the people who come on here claiming between 60 and 70 mpg for the 1.0 TSi either require maths lessons or the dash read out re calibrating.

When you consider that our late 2005 1.6 TDCi 110 PS Focus (Euro 3 - no DPF) only managed an average of 44 mpg over the 12 years we owned it there is sufficient prrof haw much small petrols have come on. That Focus was slow compared to the 1.8 petrol Focus and the Fabia is much quicker than the 1.8 petrol Focus. If I could compare the TDCi with the TSi I am pretty sure the TDCi would feel like a slug, and a not very economical one.

But I suppose there is one small issue with the car, the Mrs prefers it to the Pulsar 1.6 DIG-T, surely that says a great deal about the all round abilities of the Fabia.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - Andrew-T

When you consider that our late 2005 1.6 TDCi 110 PS Focus (Euro 3 - no DPF) only managed an average of 44 mpg over the 12 years we owned it there is sufficient prrof haw much small petrols have come on.

The engines and their control systems have certainly 'come on' over the decades - most noticeably in cleaning up what comes out of the tailpipe. But while overall efficiency has improved, much of the gains have been cancelled out by increased vehicle weight, plus the ability to sustain higher speed, which most drivers like to exploit.

Back in the 1960s my Morris 1100 averaged 44mpg (UK gallons) on a 3500-mile tour around the western States. I can't recall what a series of Maxis did after returning here, but my 205s with a 1.4 engine managed high 40s, the 1.6 GTis high 30s. My 'new' 306 with the 1.6 engine also does high 40s. The Pug diesels have crept up from low 50s to just about 60mpg with the current 207. I don't think my driving style has changed drastically over the years, or that the gains in overall economy have been remarkable, but the air we breathe has certainly benefited.

Bought a car - and its not a new Focus - thunderbird

But while overall efficiency has improved, much of the gains have been cancelled out by increased vehicle weight, plus the ability to sustain higher speed, which most drivers like to exploit.

Good point. I suspect that the Fabia is lighter than the Focus thus not a good argument between those 2 but it is certainly heavier than a Mk 2 Golf from the 80's. Stick the Fabia engine in that lighter Golf and you would have the same power a a GTI of that period, better torque, more gears and about 200kg's less to drag around (possibly more since the 1.0TSi is all alloy whereas the 1.8 in the Mk 2 Golf was a cast iron boat anchor).

Wonder if any enterprising owner has actually tried it?