What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
New Honda Jazz - Senexdriver

I read that the new Honda Jazz has been unveiled at the Tokyo motor show. (In Japan it is known as the Honda Fit). The key feature of the next generation model is that it will have a hybrid power train only.

There are a number of members of this forum who swear by their Jazzes, with good reason I’m sure. However, I wonder how they will react to the idea that their next new Jazz will be a hybrid. Honda anticipate a dip in sales initially, but then fully expect numbers to return to normal once the hybrid version has had time to establish itself.

Once the hybrid Jazz is underway, the Civic will go hybrid only as well. So will the Accord, although we no longer get that model in the UK.

I read this in an Autocar update, but I don't know how to post a link to it. The article had several photos of the updated Jazz too. Diehard Jazz owners might be interested to track it down.

Edited by Avant on 23/10/2019 at 12:03

New Honda Jazz - Avant

If Toyota can make the complex hybrid tech reliable, so I'm sure can Honda.

Assuming that the hybrid will be automatic only, Honda may lose customers who prefer a manual Jazz (quite a few elderly owners I'd expect). Toyota offer a 1.2 petrol manual Corolla for that very reason.

New Honda Jazz - Senexdriver

Yes - the other item in the article was that it will have a CVT transmission as standard. I have no doubt that Honda can get the hybrid technology right; my concern was more as to how loyal Jazz owners would feel about a hybrid only option.

I suppose in reality they will move with the times. Hybrid will become more common until all-electric vehicles are cheaper and available in a wider range of models - and crucially the infrastructure is in place to make all-electric ownership more convenient.

New Honda Jazz - Falkirk Bairn

It will be a success BUT only if they have not priced it too high.

The current Jazz is not cheap for an entry level car.

CRV Hybrid is under £1000 more than the petrol 1.5 turbo - which is "reasonable"

Mind you a 4% increase in the old age pension might help - only joking.

New Honda Jazz - Tester

And perhaps it's not only elderly owners who would prefer a manual non-hybrid! I have the 1.2 manual Auris that preceded the new Corolla because my driving patterns would make next to no use of a so-called 'self charging' hybrid (as opposed to plug-in hybrid) -- almost none of my driving is in urban areas. I could see no point in using a 1.8 litre non-turbo to haul around the batteries that I would not be using, so the 1.2T seemed to be the obvious choice.

New Honda Jazz - Heidfirst

Assuming that the hybrid will be automatic only, Honda may lose customers who prefer a manual Jazz (quite a few elderly owners I'd expect). Toyota offer a 1.2 petrol manual Corolla for that very reason.

The 1.2T Corolla is apparently going away very shortly (at least in the UK) - just over 5% of sales here. www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/topic/189643-my20-.../

New Honda Jazz - Engineer Andy

Assuming that the hybrid will be automatic only, Honda may lose customers who prefer a manual Jazz (quite a few elderly owners I'd expect). Toyota offer a 1.2 petrol manual Corolla for that very reason.

The 1.2T Corolla is apparently going away very shortly (at least in the UK) - just over 5% of sales here. www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/topic/189643-my20-.../

The problem is that is the only cheap (ish) Corolla (Auris as was) - I hope they provide something rather than just the drab 1.8 hybrid or the good, but very expensive (newer) 2.0 hybrid.

I suspect this has more to do with the EU's stupid insistence (as they did with pushing diesels in the late 90s because of CO2 emissions, forgetting particulates and enabling the Dieselgate cheating) on huge corporate fine for car manufacturers if their average CO2 emissions across the range sold is more than (I think) 95g/km or so.

Now we enter an era of cars that don't drive well and cost a fortune to buy because they are solely designed to meet artificially low emissions figures, whilst conveniently forgetting how they are made and where all the components in those 'green' batteries com from and how they are mined, processed, constructed and recycled.

New Honda Jazz - Tester

Oh dear, that'll be me lost as a customer, then. Not that this will have Toyota quaking in their boots!

New Honda Jazz - SLO76
They’re already losing sales thanks to the over optimistic pricing of the current range, an automatic Jazz is approaching £20k with a bit of spec and even a basic model is thousands dearer than the previous despite cheaper build costs. Hybrid only will mean higher prices still and a big opportunity for the Korean brands. Toyota offer conventional manual petrol Yaris and Corolla models and will scoop up plenty of sales when Honda ignore the bulk of their custom.
New Honda Jazz - Engineer Andy

Odd why the current model is only being replaced after just 4 years on sale - most cars these days (especially the better ones) have a sales life of around 5-7 years, and often Japanese models even longer, as evidenced by the previous versions of the model being sold new for 7 years each.

I was under the impression that the latest version was by far the best, supposedly 'justifying' the very high price tag. Recent reliability issues with Honda's diesels and turbo-petrols will not help sales, nor will the new Jazz/Fit being so much more than the competition to buy - the medium and higher spec (not the engine, especially when the actually quite decent 1.5VTEC was introduced then dropped after 5 minutes) cars are costing the same or often more than cars with equal spec that are far more fun to drive and still have adequate space for most buyers in that segment.

Many cars that compete on space/versatility are often far cheaper and that are gradually closing the gap on reliability too. I'm unsure what Honda are playing at over the last 5 years or so, it's almost as though they are just 'managing decline', as evidenced by them closing their plant in Swindon (which was nothing to do with you-know-what).

Having also such a large gap in their range as regards vehicle size between the Jazz and the (extremely large) Civic with only a very expensive HR-V there and no 'ordinary type car' - what gives? They have less models on sale than much smaller firms like Mazda and just matching Subaru. 15-20 years ago, they were hot, now they are selling very cars in the UK.

New Honda Jazz - madf

Honda UK are targetting margins and not volume: as their MD says..

Their previous Jazz hybrid (IMA) was the wrong design.. The message from their F1 experience and hybrids was Not Invented Here reigns - ignore what other people do - even if it works.. and DIY even if it costs a fortune and does not work first time...

The new Jazz - made in Mexioc - has been full of niggling problems...and was not designed for EV/hybrid use....

Says it all really..

Jazz photos https://www.topgear.com/car-news/lock-your-grandma-new-honda-jazz-coming

Edited by madf on 23/10/2019 at 16:12

New Honda Jazz - SLO76
Another thing that will hit sales is the decision to kill off UK production. My parents bought a new Jazz in 2009 and much of that was down to the fact that Honda generated jobs here, ditto many other older Honda owners. I’ve owned several Honda’s over the years all UK built and all good cars but although not a deal killer it does deter me partially from buying another.

The choice to go for profit per unit in the UK just as Subaru do will be the big killer for Honda. Their cars aren’t that much better if at all than rivals and thus do not justify premium pricing. It’ll see lower volumes and dearer parts as aftermarket availablity dwindles again as Subaru which kills used values. I’d have a Suzuki Swift over an overpriced Jazz, at least Suzuki pass on some of the saving from manufacturing in the third world.

Edited by SLO76 on 23/10/2019 at 16:42

New Honda Jazz - badbusdriver

If Toyota can make the complex hybrid tech reliable, so I'm sure can Honda.

They already have, many years ago. The 1st gen Insight was in production (Dec '99) only two years after the 1st Prius (though the Prius wasn't available outside Japan till Sept 2000). And there are plenty of them still on the road after nearly 20 years.

As to the Jazz, i have absolutely no issues with it being a hybrid, and as our Jazz is the auto (CVT), i have no issues with that either. It is a brilliant gearbox (sorry, 'transmission' for the pedants) despite what the motoring press will have you believe.

New Honda Jazz - Falkirk Bairn

The current Jazz 1.3 ltr engine was designed as a hybrid - Atkinson cycle.

However the reliability of the hybrid in the USA/Japan market Fit (Jazz) was a disaster.

Heads rolled, senior management bonuses cut and the new hybrid design is seen in the CRV.. The fact that the USA cars were Mexican assembled did not help the as it highlighted the other problems of poor hybrid design

UK Jazz & HRV sourcing which had been Mexico was changed to Japan after about 18mths/ 2 years .

The NEW Jazz hybrid is similar with a 1.5 engine and not the 2.0 of the CRV.

Edited by Falkirk Bairn on 23/10/2019 at 18:15

New Honda Jazz - Bolt

It is a brilliant gearbox (sorry, 'transmission' for the pedants)

wouldn't worry about it Honda are doing away with the gearbox and will be 2 motor without box as will all Hondas later on

www.msn.com/en-gb/cars/news/new-2020-honda-jazz-re...p

Honda stated last year they were going Hybrid and all Ev

New Honda Jazz - gordonbennet

I remember years ago Honda saying they would never put a Diesel engine in their cars, when this electric farce proves not to be the answer to the worlds ills, they, like other makers, will have to make what sells or go bust.

They have form for alienating their loyal core customers, wrote off thousands of repeat mature buyers by deciding to stop making quietly handsome Civics and Accords, and look what's happened.

Edited by gordonbennet on 23/10/2019 at 23:00

New Honda Jazz - Falkirk Bairn

I bought my first Honda in 1995 - range of 2/3/4/5 door Civics, Accords, sports cars, coupes, MPV, ...................

Now Jazz, Civic 4/5 door, CRV, HRV, Electric car + NSX

Civic is not everyone's taste, CRV 's can now cost over £40K, New Jazz will be expensive

Looks like the wee Toyotas, Hyundais, Kias etc will be even more common as the Honda badge recedes to being one of the REST instead of one of the BEST.

New Honda Jazz - Bolt

I remember years ago Honda saying they would never put a Diesel engine in their cars, when this electric farce proves not to be the answer to the worlds ills, they, like other makers, will have to make what sells or go bust.

They have form for alienating their loyal core customers, wrote off thousands of repeat mature buyers by deciding to stop making quietly handsome Civics and Accords, and look what's happened.

Maybe they are responding to what the public have asked for which appears to be a minority compared to those that dont like Honda, they weren't going to make a diesel but it was asked for by the public.

as was the 8th gen Civic because it was space age looking, it wasn't meant to be made when first shown at a motorshow only public opinion made Honda produce it.

even the new Jazz has been made according to what people have asked for so maybe they should take no notice of what people want as they are not the majority and do what they want...or maybe they just cannot win.

New Honda Jazz - madf

Honda new car sales to end September 2019 down 18% Year on year.. vs market down 2.5%

Lexus and Toyota both up..

https://www.smmt.co.uk/vehicle-data/car-registrations/

In SERIOUS trouble.

New Honda Jazz - catsdad

I agree that Honda are sinking in UK but worldwide they are thriving. In 2018 they were the fourth biggest manufacturer in the world behind Toyota, VW and Ford. They had three models in the top 10 (Civic - third in the world - CRV and HRV). The Jazz is not even in the top 25.

UK is still the 6th biggest market with sales of about 2.3m in 2018 but those in places 1-5 bought about 40m units. China alone is 23.7m.

One message I take from this is that UK tastes are relatively unimportant when it comes to how global manufacturers develop and sell models. We'll get what we're given I reckon.

New Honda Jazz - Heidfirst

I agree that Honda are sinking in UK but worldwide they are thriving. In 2018 they were the fourth biggest manufacturer in the world behind Toyota, VW and Ford.

25th brand in Europe Jan-August 2019 ... carsalesbase.com/european-car-sales-analysis-july-.../

Edited by Heidfirst on 24/10/2019 at 18:21

New Honda Jazz - Tonyx
As long as they do not tell new customers that the Jazz is capable of going faster than 40MPH on rural roads they will still continue to sell them.
New Honda Jazz - madf
As long as they do not tell new customers that the Jazz is capable of going faster than 40MPH on rural roads they will still continue to sell them.

On our local rural roads, anyone doing 40mph is going to either killethemselves or others or several horses or have a head on argument with a tractor. I drive 6 miles every Saturday to our Beekeeping Association's apiary and the fatsest I can do is 45mph for about 0.5miles. The rest id 25mph -top speed - along roads sunk 2 meters below the fields with passing spaces..

Suits the Jazz fine:-).. Never meeet any Range Rovers - too big for the roads..

New Honda Jazz - SLO76
One feature I do wish they’d delete from the Honda Jazz is the system which causes the car to suddenly speed up whenever a bus approaches from behind and tries to overtake then when the bus pulls in again it immediately goes back down to 50mph with the same result when you go to overtake again. At times like these I wish my 50ft Volvo Elite came as standard with a guided missile launcher.
New Honda Jazz - Bolt
One feature I do wish they’d delete from the Honda Jazz is the system which causes the car to suddenly speed up whenever a bus approaches from behind and tries to overtake then when the bus pulls in again it immediately goes back down to 50mph with the same result when you go to overtake again. At times like these I wish my 50ft Volvo Elite came as standard with a guided missile launcher.

Buses round our way are very slow to do anything, ive been stuck behind a few every day this week where I cant get out of second gear they go so slow.

as the traffic is very light I assume the drivers are not in a hurry, so they decide to hold traffic up!.

New Honda Jazz - dan86
One feature I do wish they’d delete from the Honda Jazz is the system which causes the car to suddenly speed up whenever a bus approaches from behind and tries to overtake then when the bus pulls in again it immediately goes back down to 50mph with the same result when you go to overtake again. At times like these I wish my 50ft Volvo Elite came as standard with a guided missile launcher.

Buses round our way are very slow to do anything, ive been stuck behind a few every day this week where I cant get out of second gear they go so slow.

as the traffic is very light I assume the drivers are not in a hurry, so they decide to hold traffic up!.

They just seem to plod along without a care in the world and not give a second thought to any other road users. 15mph in a 30 zone or when they are at a bus stop and decide to pull out its either no indicator and pull straight out or indicator on for up to a minute before pulling out. No inbetween.

New Honda Jazz - catsdad
I don't recognise the stereotype of slow busses round my way. If all else fails wait until they stop to pick up passengers.

What I do find is that the practice of cars letting faster drivers pass when they are not in a hurry has all but gone. Much of my driving is on roads where passing is tight. I often slow down and move to the left to let others pass. I can't remember the last time another car did this for me. In fact, as per SLO comments the opposite is often the case. Busses, lorries and even white vans however are quite often helpful to overtaking traffic.
New Honda Jazz - Bolt

Busses, lorries and even white vans however are quite often helpful to overtaking traffic.

Not round my way they aren't, excluding Buses the rest just try and get where they are going asap and do get annoyed when they come across a slow driver, tailgating is nothing unusual where I live, having said that pedestrians are just as bad- just walking out into the road without even looking and usually looking into the phone screen