Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4

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Fri 10 Jun 2016 19:53
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - gedi mk2

Hi,

You read the subject correctly!

My wife has been accused and "caught" on average speed cameras at an average of 115mph. She categorically denies this, which I have to believe has I have driven her car and it is horrible at 70mph, and has only ever had a top speed of 107mph (confirmed by VW Brochure)

She received an N.I.P just before christmas. we responded to it with the name of who was driving etc, or face 6pts. We were not allowed to make any other comment or question on the matter at this stage.

We honestly thought there would be an error, or she was passed by a m/c as she went through a camera.

We had not heard anything until last week. Essex police are taking her to court for this offence, even though the top speed of her car was 107mph new in 2002.

We intend to fight this fully, but have received some ludicrous quotations from severall law firms to represent us. These cost will mostly be unrecoverable through the courts.

Her options are to plead guilty by post, plead guilty in court or plead not guilty.

Is it right that she should be made to appear before a magistrates to plead not guilty to a "fictional" charge?

She has had no right of reply to the police in this matter, to point out there obvious error.

How would you go about fighting this without legal representation?

Is there a way to have the matter thrown out before it reaches a judge?

Any help much appreciated,

Ged

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Fri 10 Jun 2016 22:03
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - Bromptonaut

Where, when (date/time of day) who was driving? Over what distance is the 114 average alleged?

The brochure speed is presumably on a prepared losed track but on level. On a long m/way gradient it could almost certainly beat that.

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Fri 10 Jun 2016 22:48
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - Brit_in_Germany

Your wife will know how she was driving. If it is likely that she was driving at speeds significantly greater than the limit, there could be a chance that the readings are correct, especially, as pointed out, it was on a downhill stretch.

If she is someone who keeps to the speed limits, clesrly the readings are faulty and a not guilty plea would be appropriate.

Has the car been chipped perhaps?

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Fri 10 Jun 2016 23:08
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - RT

From a historically point of view, I can confirm that it's possible to significantly exceed and car's official top speed - as posted downhill with a tailwind can result in bouncing the engine off the rev limiter despite the top two gears being overdrive on many cars - with 10-20 mph more than official top speed.

That's not something I do now but I have in the past!

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Sat 11 Jun 2016 09:08
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - Dwight Van Driver

Presume the limit allegedly exceeded a 70?

Whilst it is a long shot because Mags etc are enslaved into believing that such devices are infallible and the high cost of a defence then I would be tempted to consider a not guilty plea.

My evidence - something from VW in a letter that vehicle not capable of that speed backed up with their paper burb.

taking the vehicle off road, runway etc and having an independent driver do runs to establish that that top speed could not be achieved.

Drivers statement that the speed alleged was not done.

And yes cameras can be faulty:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/10/questions-rais.../

Big problem is that CPS may bring in 'expert' from makers of the device who will charge and astronomical sum (000)which will have to be bourne by defendant if found guilty.

Regret it seems we are held to ransom by these things.

At speed alleged CPS could be considering a dangerous driving charge and even if not a disqaulifcation seems certain.

dvd

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Sat 11 Jun 2016 13:37
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - gedi mk2

Thanks all for your responses.

This is looking quite bleak. I know she wouldn't drive at these speeds on her own, never mind the fact that at the time our 6 month old daughter was with her.

The stretch of road in question (approx 4.5km/3miles) on A12 (kelvedon bypass for those who may know it) has a quite severe, narrow bend towards the last camera. Even when approaching this at 70, i often err on the side of caution and slow down, as does she. So to obtain a 115mph avg, she'd have had to hit 120-130(?) taking this bend in to consideration.

I really don't want to appoint a lawyer as cannot afford too, but cannot afford to plead guilty to something she hasn't done.

sorry if this is very ranty, sure you can imagine the frustration and all other s*** this has brought to our door.

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Sat 11 Jun 2016 13:49
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - gedi mk2
And yes cameras can be faulty:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/10/questions-rais.../

Although this solicitor might be worth a call!!

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Sat 11 Jun 2016 19:09
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - ExA35Owner

Two possibilities - or perhaps three.

1. Plead Not Guilty: argue that the offence couldn't have taken place for the reasons stated. However the offence is that of exceeding the speed limit, not that of travelling at whatever speed. The speed determines the level of punishment.

2. Plead Guilty (if she was indeed speeding at all) and ask for a Newton hearing which will determine the likely level of the offence.

3. Contact Police and explain that the offence as described is unlikely - for the reasons above. Suggest that there might be an error which they might like to check before getting egg on their faces.

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 02:12
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - Avant

I would try no. 3 first, as 115 mph in a 2002 Polo is implausible to say the least.

If you don't get anywhere, then best to go to a solicitor.

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 09:50
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - Palcouk

If the speed of 115mph is quoted in the legal paperwork, if found guilty its almost certain the driver will be banned from driving for a period, and receive a hefty fine.

You either represent yourself and supply documentation from the maker and test figures from an independent expert (for which you will have to pay) or seek legal advice which again you would have to pay for.

If the legal representation wins the day and it is conluded that the speed equipment is faulty in some way, then your costs should be awarded

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 12:30
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - FiestaOwner

Hi Ged

You say that your wife was caught by average speed cameras. My understanding is that average speed cameras use 2 sets of cameras.

The 1st camera takes a photo of your car (along with info of the date and time) when you ENTER the section of road which the cameras are enforcing the limit on.

The 2nd camera takes a photo of your car (along with info of the date and time) when you EXIT the section of road which the cameras are enforcing the limit on.

The registration number from the photos is used to identify that it is the same vehicle both photos. The distance between both cameras is known. The distance between the cameras and date/ time info on both photos is used to calculate the average speed between the 2 cameras.

I think you need to try and get both photos and check:

  • The registration number of the car in both photos is the same.
  • The picture in both photos is of the same car (ie. does one photo have a dealer sticker in the rear window and the other photo have no sticker or a sticker in a different position?). Does only one picture have a sunroof on the car? Basically you're looking for any differences which makes it obvious that it can't be the same car in both photos (even if the number plate is the same).
  • Can you check the position of the cameras and the distance between them is as stated? The photos might be of help in this?
  • Check the date/time info from both photos and using the distance between the cameras calculate the speed yourself.

Hope this is of help.

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 16:13
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - ExA35Owner

Need to be careful in asking for info from the police.

If you ask for evidence, that will be refused until the court case proceeds.

If you ask for photos to help identify the driver, they are likely to cooperate.

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 16:56
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - FiestaOwner

Need to be careful in asking for info from the police.

If you ask for evidence, that will be refused until the court case proceeds.

If you ask for photos to help identify the driver, they are likely to cooperate.

The OP's wife has already been named on the NIP as the driver.

I realise I don't have knowledge on the legal side of things.

If the OP's wife knows that she was going significantly slower, then I would strongly recommend she gets legal advice.

Surely there must be a way for a solicitor/ lawyer to get the camera info before the case gets as far as court.

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Sun 12 Jun 2016 19:02
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - SlidingPillar

.Are you a member of a motoring organisation? The RAC used to have a legal department, and I suspect the AA did too. Because to re-iterate what others have said, you need proper legal advice.

I've no idea if the photos still exist now, you do need to see them, and at this stage, I think only someone legal could get them.

The 'offence' is serious, as a ban is in the offing.

As presented, the matter is farcical, but you need to convince the magistrates of that. Chances are a human, not a computer has erred and from what you say, a Newton hearing is not appropriate either as 70 wasn't exceeded, let alone 115 average.

I don't know the distance or terrain, but to record 115 average would imply hitting a much greater speed, and as speedos usually overread, a guess of 130 indicated is not without substance.

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Mon 13 Jun 2016 11:38
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - nortones2

Before the case comes to court the prosecution must disclose the evidence they hold. As others have said a solicitor with motoring offence experience will know what is important to get.

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Mon 13 Jun 2016 13:39
Volkswagen Polo - 115mph Average in Polo 1.4 - slkfanboy

I would say further the top speed quoted by a simple goodle search for 1.4 tdi is 114mph, you need to check your exact model more carefully I suspect.

Further still does she say she was not speeding or she was not speed by that degree? Any thing over 90mph is risking a Ban

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